Gold versus steel nib

[archie001]

The pentrace article is interesting, but it isn't quite there. The key parameter for flexibility is the strain at which plastic deformation occurs. This can be calculated from the strength and the elastic modulus, so for the materials used in nibs (using the numbers in the Pentrace article):

 

14K Gold: 2.5 - 5.6 x 10^-3

18K Gold: 1.5 - 4.0 x 10^-3

302SS: 3.8 - 4.5 x 10^-3

Ti6Al4V: 4.1 - 6.8 x 10^-3

 

The bigger this number is, the more flex you can have (for the same deformation strength). The range in the numbers for each material is due to variation in composition and treatment.

 

Essentially, this tells you that:

- a good 14K gold alloy is the best material to use, but the wrong alloy will give you less than half the flexibility of a good alloy,

- stainless steel is pretty good too, but gives you 20% less flex than good 14K for an equivalent design,

- stainless steel is better than most 18K alloys, and more consistent in its properties than gold,

- 18K alloys can be really poor (1.5 x 10^-3) or as good as stainless steel (4.0 x 10^-3), depending on composition,

- Titanium would be the best material if it wasn't for issues with weldability and formability that make it a really lousy material to use for a pen.

 

... and finally, the design is the key. You can make a good nib with any of these materials, but not everyone does.

 

Moreover, not everyone likes the same things in a nib. I like a bit of give, but I don't like too much flexibility. Others like their nibs to be stiff as a nail, and still others like a lot of flex. Horses for courses, and what I like in a nib may well be different from what Glenn-SC likes.

 

Sorry Bob, I don't have these numbers for glass.

 

In my normal writing and sketching, I love a pen that produces constant width of line and constant flow of ink and color. I want the shading to be constant also that is why I like a stiff nibs. But when I like to have calligraphic writing style with variable line widths then I resort to calligraphy pens. I really don't want flexible nibs for my normal writing purposes.

 

[OldGriz]

Hmm... my last post failed to kill this thread. Potty mouth.

 

And the reason that this thread needs to be killed and people should not discuss what they like or dislike IS???

 

[ANM]

I know how you feel. I can't understand why anyone had anything to say after I gave my opinion too. However your gold alloy figures seem to assume a constant in 14 & 18 k. gold which isn't there. The only constant in those alloys is the percent of gold. The other metas can vary greatly both in which metals are used and how much of each of them in is proportion to the others. I can't imagine that 14K gold with 58% gold and 40% copper with 2% zinc will perform the same as one with 30% copper and 12% nickel. Those numbers are arbitrary but were used to make my point about gold. There are factors in metal beside content and geometry too. Some metals are tempered differently and some metals are layered with other metals. All of which seems like they should be factors in the performance qualities of nibs.

Edited March 10, 2009 by ANM

[hamadryad11]

Hmm... my last post failed to kill this thread. Potty mouth.

 

Okay, in a quixotic attempt to kill off this thread, and all future threads of the same or similar title:

Actually this doesn't totally answer the original question, although it's potentially valuable for anyone who likes flex nibs (I am not of that persuasion myself, but chacun à son goût). I believe the OP was asking a more general question regarding the potential superiority of gold over steel nibs. While a flexible nib seems to be the holy grail for a certain subset of fountain pen users, it is not for everyone. It is certainly not the only measure of quality. For some of us it might even be a negative trait.

 

There are so many threads about this topic because there are so many varying opinions of what makes a good nib.

[RevAaron]

However your gold alloy figures seem to assume a constant in 14 & 18 k. gold which isn't there. The only constant in those alloys is the percent of gold.

 

It also assumes a specific steel alloy. I don't know why that one got picked- perhaps it is a common SS alloy for nibs- but there are many different SS alloys, and each have their own properties.

 

That said, troglokev's posts was informative and useful. Way over the heads of most people, though- and they'll keep on asking this question. And if we try to point them to trog's post, they will likely skip over the good bits. *shrug*

 

I believe the OP was asking a more general question regarding the potential superiority of gold over steel nibs.

<...>

There are so many threads about this topic because there are so many varying opinions of what makes a good nib.

 

OK, let's completely ignore flex. If we do that, the answer to any general gold vs steel question is:

 

There is no real difference.

 

A gold nib will be more resistant to corrosion, but when you factor in the inks we use today and the improved corrosion resistance in modern stainless steel there is little to no difference. Nothing worth mentioning.

 

 

That said, the original post wasn't asking if gold nibs were better than steel nibs in general. Perhaps folks see the vague topic title, skipped the original post and assumed it was yet another universal gold vs steel question.

 

The original post asked about steel vs gold nibs in Pelikans made during WW2. There can be differences between the gold and steel nibs of one maker, though the steel nibs Pelikan (and other German companies) used during the gold ban performed identically to their gold nibs from before the ban.

 

If the question was Parker Sonnet steel vs Parker Sonnet 18k or Pelikan M200 steel vs Pelikan M800 gold the answer would be something else.

[troglokev]

The reason for assuming particular alloys is that the Pentrace article only gave numbers for those particular ones, so I used them.

 

You will note that I provided two curves for 18K gold: these are the extremes of the range, and there is a lot of variation between them! As ANM points out, much depends on what else is in the alloy. I'll edit the original post and make that clear.

 

Old Griz, you appear to have taken my comment about killing the thread seriously. You should know better than that, my firend!

[troglokev]

That said, troglokev's posts was informative and useful. Way over the heads of most people, though- and they'll keep on asking this question. And if we try to point them to trog's post, they will likely skip over the good bits. *shrug*

 

*sigh* They always do. But thanks for the kind words.

[Hugh200au]

All this talk about 14ct and 18ct. I have one 18ct nib on an eversharp doric, it's a number 3 adjustable and it's got plenty of flex when set for it. The only 14ct I've got that out flexs it is on an old Conklin. So I'm not convinced by the charts, figures etc as the reality that I've encoutered ( limited as it is) doesn't support it, but does make me think the added alloys play a far greater part. That aside, I'm not really a user of flex and in general use there's not much difference between gold , steel or alloy etc but I prefer gold (gold!! $$$) and as Robert suggested earlier I like yellow!!

Regards

Hugh