Pilot VP Nibs - Fine vs Medium

[marcosv]

Greetings!

 

I'm considering buying my first fountain pen over $50 and looking at picking up a Pilot Vanishing Point. I'm trying to decide wither to get a fine or medium nib. I wasn't able to find these pens locally where I could try out both nib sizes at the same time.

 

Here's what I have:

 

Lamy Al-Star EF nib --- works great with Noodler Black on moleskine notebooks. Found that the F nib writes a bit too wide for my tastes

Lamy Al-Star F nib --- works great with Waterman Florida Blue on the same moleskine notebooks.

Pilot Cavalier F nib (I believe this to be a Japanese market model which I bought from JetPens) --- writes finer than the Lamy EF nib with whatever ink I put in it; which is OK, but, I'm thinking the lines are a bit too fine.

 

Based on the above experience, I'm wondering if should get the a medium nib with the Pilot VP. Then again the Pilot VP I'd be getting is intended for the U.S. market and I don't know if that makes its nib sizing different than the Capless models for the Japanese market.

 

Anyone have any experience with Pilot Vanishing Point nibs and the steel Lamy nibs?

 

 

- Thanks in advance,

Marcos

[Conan the Grammarian]

 

I have a Lamy EF and a Lamy F. I also have a VP F and a VP M. The VP F IMHO writes like the Lamy EF. If the F is a "bit too wide" for your tastes, I'd recommend the VP F.

 

Good pens.

[savarez]

Greetings!

 

I'm considering buying my first fountain pen over $50 and looking at picking up a Pilot Vanishing Point. I'm trying to decide wither to get a fine or medium nib. I wasn't able to find these pens locally where I could try out both nib sizes at the same time.

 

Here's what I have:

 

Lamy Al-Star EF nib --- works great with Noodler Black on moleskine notebooks. Found that the F nib writes a bit too wide for my tastes

Lamy Al-Star F nib --- works great with Waterman Florida Blue on the same moleskine notebooks.

Pilot Cavalier F nib (I believe this to be a Japanese market model which I bought from JetPens) --- writes finer than the Lamy EF nib with whatever ink I put in it; which is OK, but, I'm thinking the lines are a bit too fine.

 

Based on the above experience, I'm wondering if should get the a medium nib with the Pilot VP. Then again the Pilot VP I'd be getting is intended for the U.S. market and I don't know if that makes its nib sizing different than the Capless models for the Japanese market.

 

Anyone have any experience with Pilot Vanishing Point nibs and the steel Lamy nibs?

 

- Thanks in advance,

Marcos

 

I think you're right on with your instinct to go for "M". If you've used a Pilot Cavalier "F" and found the line is too fine for you, the VP will be in the same ballpark.

 

Rule of thumb: Japanese nibs tend to run about one size smaller than their western counterparts.

Edited January 15, 2009 by savarez

[nolagraph]

I cannot comment on what the Lamy nibs are like, aside from a Vista M that I have, but my VP fine is almost identical in line thickness to my western EFs - a Sheaffer Snorkel & a Pelikan M215. If you are happy with the EF nib on the Al-Star, I'd say go for a fine on your VP. If you like your line a bit thicker I'd get a medium. Japanese nibs tend to run almost exactly a size small when compared to standard western nibs. As far as I know, VP nibs are the same width regardless of where they are marketed. Any way you go, you can't go wrong with a Vanishing Point. I am more than satisfied with mine.

[ProfMike]

I'll second the vote for a medium nib. I have VPs with both M and F nibs - the F is great for margin notes or other times when I really need very fine lines. For everyday writing, I find the M nib lays down a nice, smooth equivalent to most of my western F nibs.

 

Cheers,

Mike

 

PS - Just thought... The best thing about VPs is that you can always get two nibs, and switch around for whatever line width you need for the task at hand.

 

EDIT - Just reread above and saw that you were happy with the Al-Star EF. The medium VP nib will probably be closer to the F Al-Star than to the EF. As you mentioned, though, the Cavalier F (and similar VP F) can be slightly too fine from time to time. Guess you might have to get both nibs after all! Welcome to our world

Edited January 16, 2009 by ProfMike

[sph33r]

From what I've read, the Fine VP nib follows the rule that Fine = Western Extra Fine. But the Medium = Medium. Not sure why that is but I've found it to be true. My VP Medium is actually a bit thicker than the Medium point Lamy Safari I have.

 

Don't know if that helps but I know I bought my VP in Medium hoping it would be fine and it was not. Luckily the beautiful smoothness distracted me from the nib size.

[JohnS-MI]

I have a VP with medium nib. I would say the medium is VERY similar to any western medium nib (which is what I like). But at least on the medium, it is NOT an example of Japanese nibs running one width finer. Based on your preferences, you would probably prefer the fine.

 

But as pointed out, the nib assemblies are much less than the whole pen. You could buy the second nib assembly. It is trivial to install.

[Shelley]

I have an F, M and a B in the pilot, the F is very fine, the M is fine and the B only about a normal western M at the most, the F is slightly scratchy (well mine was) but the others are like butter.

[excarnate]

I'm considering buying my first fountain pen over $50 and looking at picking up a Pilot Vanishing Point. I'm trying to decide wither to get a fine or medium nib. I wasn't able to find these pens locally where I could try out both nib sizes at the same time.

I had the good fortune to try it at a place that only had the medium nib, and I don't like wide lines, so I ended up buying from Pam Braun and paid MUCH less, had excellent service, and have a fine nib that is wonderfully smooth and what I'd call a fine (my Prera writes more XF or even XXF).

 

I don't really remember the medium VP nib, but what I do recall matches those folks saying it is more like a "western" medium, or a Lamy Fine (the Lamy's run wide).

 

Pilot Cavalier F nib (I believe this to be a Japanese market model which I bought from JetPens) --- writes finer than the Lamy EF nib with whatever ink I put in it; which is OK, but, I'm thinking the lines are a bit too fine.

Check the reviews on that. If it writes like a Prera, then the Vanishing Point fine will be good.

 

Or you can get a Binder nib and he will show you the width to expect.

Edited January 16, 2009 by excarnate

[nkk]

I'll second the vote for a medium nib. I have VPs with both M and F nibs - the F is great for margin notes or other times when I really need very fine lines. For everyday writing, I find the M nib lays down a nice, smooth equivalent to most of my western F nibs.

 

Cheers,

Mike

 

PS - Just thought... The best thing about VPs is that you can always get two nibs, and switch around for whatever line width you need for the task at hand.

 

EDIT - Just reread above and saw that you were happy with the Al-Star EF. The medium VP nib will probably be closer to the F Al-Star than to the EF. As you mentioned, though, the Cavalier F (and similar VP F) can be slightly too fine from time to time. Guess you might have to get both nibs after all! Welcome to our world

 

I am going to have to disagree with your statement. Lamys tend to run wider than normal, and their EF is most definately not a real EF. So if their EF=normal F=Pilot M, that is what the OP should go with.

 

However, I strongly urge getting two nibs. IF you like the M, you can trade the F for something, or have it reground, and vice versa.

 

-Nkk

 

EDIT: This just hit me: I am a needlepoint lover. I have started thinking my Binder XXXXF is a bit too wide, so take my advice with a grain (or a mole) of salt

Edited January 16, 2009 by nkk

[marcosv]

Pilot Cavalier F nib (I believe this to be a Japanese market model which I bought from JetPens) --- writes finer than the Lamy EF nib with whatever ink I put in it; which is OK, but, I'm thinking the lines are a bit too fine.

Check the reviews on that. If it writes like a Prera, then the Vanishing Point fine will be good.

 

Or you can get a Binder nib and he will show you the width to expect.

 

That's for the suggestion. I took a look at the Pilot Prera review by KCat and the Pilot VP F nib looked close enough. Lily over at JetPens says that the Prera had similar characteristics with the Cavalier. So if I connect the dots, the F nib maybe the way to go. At least this way, I'm comparing three different pens by the same company.

 

[marcosv]

Rather than wasting bandwidth with separate replies of "Thanks!", I'll say it right here: Thank you all for your thoughtful suggestions. Combined, you given me enough information to place a pen order.

 

I've decided to order the Pilot VP with a F nib --- and buy the M nib shortly there after (need to decide if I order just the nib or order a 2nd Pilot VP pen).

 

Since I do a lot of writing in Moleskine pocket notebooks with Noodler Black ink right now, I don't want to err on getting a nib that writes too wide. I find I can live with the Pilot Cavalier and so given the suggestions, the F nib is a good place to start.

 

I am thinking a Pilot M nib could be useful as well, even if it turns out I find it writes to thick for the pocket notebooks. When I write on blank paper, I tend to write bigger and that's where I think the Cavalier's F nib is too thin. In any event the interchangeability of the Pilot nibs is a big plus. Looks like I can do the exchange without risking damage to the nib.

 

 

- Marcos

Edited January 16, 2009 by marcosv

[KrisH]

I think you'll be fine with the fine

 

I bought a medium VP and found that the point was wider than I had expected so I bought a Decimo with a fine nib. I'd say the pilot fine is about the same as the EF in my lamy Vista and both behave themselves nicely in the Moleskine pocket cahiers that I use.

Edited January 16, 2009 by KrisH

[churl]

I think that the Pilot F is finer than even other Japanese fines. I have a Namiki Falcon, 78G, Prera, and VP with F, and all my Pilot F's (except for Petit1) are finer than my Sailor F's.

 

The VP Medium is indeed more like a Western medium. I think this is likely because the Japanese market has little use for M so they went wide like the Western market. Given that you have a Lamy Vista F, I would say that the Lamy F and VP M are pretty comparable.

 

The nice thing about the VP is you can experiment with nibs. If you're feeling adventurous, look up Richard Binder's site where he sells VP nibs he's tweaked and modified (not affiliated).

 

Here is a topic I put up on different fine nibs.

 

[Gawain]

I bought my vanishing point from Richard Binder in the fine. The VP lays down such a wet line, I can't imagine a medium in a VP. I love my fine nib vanishing point.

[hexyr]

I find that VP M nibs are incredable wide. It made my Visconti M look like a fine.

Although I was really happy with the f nib

[marcosv]

Greetings again,

 

FWIW, I wanted to share my experiences with the Pilot VP nibs.

 

I ordered a Pilot VP with F nib from RichardPens. It wrote as thin as one could want in a moleskin notebook. As others have noted about Lamy nibs, the Pilot VP F nib wrote slightly thinner than the Lamy EF nib. I found the scratchy sound the VP made with the little bit of flex feel of the nib gave me the impression that the nib was scratchy, but, the VP wrote smoothly as I'd hope for.

 

Then I ordered a M nib for this pen. Does write thicker lines, but, wow, does the VP write smoothly. It's a real joy to write with. I could use the M nib in the small pocket notebooks, but, I think the lines are still a bit too thick for my tastes.

 

Net result: I'm going to end up with two Pilot VP pens: in both M and F nib sizes --- exactly like some of the suggestions people gave in this thread.

 

 

Thanks again for the inputs. It really helped me in my decision process and figure out what was the best course for me.

 

 

- Marcos

 

[Clive Merrick Morel]

I'm considering buying my first fountain pen over $50 and looking at picking up a Pilot Vanishing Point. I'm trying to decide wither to get a fine or medium nib.

Hi Marcos,

 

I would strongly suggest you purchase a VP with whatever nib it comes with . . . then contact Richard Binder and purchase a Binderized Cursive Italic nib for your pen. You can discuss the merits of each type of Italic nib with Richard and, along with completing a brief online nib questionnaire, arrive at an ideal configuration that will much better accommodate your style of writing. Just as importantly, a Cursive Italic will enable you to lay down some beautiful script . . . much better looking (IMHO) than any "stock" VP nib would permit. Furthermore, a Binderized nib has been optimized, which means that you can be reasonably certain that it'll write - each and every time - the instant it touches the paper ... and smoothly.

 

My $0.02.

 

Cheers!

 

-Clive

[jmkeuning]

Based on all that, I would go with the fine. No doubt.

[Usui]

haha... He got both... he posted that already. Proof that people don't read!!