Lamy Safari

[christof]

Yes, Umbra is what you call Charcoal.

C.

[Uffuffa]

Okay, maybe my statement was not clear. With the term "early colors" I was thinking of Savanna, Terra and Umbra.

Here is a short timeline of the first regular Safari colors:

 

 

I got these facts from Mrs. Kiessling, the very friendly Lady from Lamy customer service. She took the informations from old catalogs.

As you can see, there was never made a glossy Umbra pen.

Hope this helps.

C.

Hi Christof,

 

This table is fantastic - thanks for sharing. I'm particularly interested in the dates for the hot red and the blue. I've been hunting for a blue with a metal cross cap for years and have never found one; this late date of introduction might explain this. Perhaps it was introduced after the metal cross caps were phased out?

 

Regarding the hot/red - I'm interested that this was introduced in 1989. I have a red Safari fountain pen that is stamped "W. Germany", so there must have been only a handful of these compared to the ones stamped "Germany". I am referring only to those hot/reds that have metal cross caps. The ones stamped Germany with the plastic cross caps are plentiful. Presumably the "W.Germany" stamp became exhausted sometime during 1990 as I doubt Lamy would have immediately ceased release of the W.Germany stamp in late 1989.

 

So, three questions for all:

1) Does anyone out there possess a blue Safari with a METAL cross cap? If so, please let me know and I'll resume my hunt.

2) Does anyone else have a red Safari stamped "W.Germany"? (I just remember that CBBP has one of these too, and it has an advertising emblem on it).

3) Does anyone know what year the metal cross cap was replaced by the plastic cross cap? Presumably sometime between 1994-1997, since I have a yellow with a metal cross cap, but an exact year would be great.

 

Finally, the table does miss out one more pen from the pre-1989 era, and that is the earliest version of the Demonstrator. I've only ever seen photos of two Demonstrators stamped W.Germany, one owned by KMPN and one other owned by CBBP. All other Demonstrators that I've seen in the flesh or on photo, of which there are several with the metal cross cap and one (posted by Haywoody) with a plastic cross cap, are stamped Germany.

 

Happy hunting everyone!

 

(Edited because I forgot that CBBP has a W.Germany Demonstrator and a W.Germany Hot/Red...!

Edited February 20, 2016 by Uffuffa

[Uffuffa]

You did not ask me, but I think that all the glossy pens in early colors (except alpin) are just heavy worn.

I observe this on my own pen, a Charcoal Safari which I carried with me the last 15 years. The surface texture has completely disappeared and the entire pen is glossy now.

Just my thoughts.

C.

Oh, and thanks for your thoughts on my question, Christof, but what I was looking at was the young Glossy Black released first in 2010. The Glossy Black that was on sale had a black nib, a black o-ring and a black clip (instead of the usual silver nib, black o-ring and chrome clip). I suspect it was a Frankenpen though, unless anyone else out there has one like this that they bought from a Lamy distributor?

[pen2paper]

Hi Christof,

 

This table is fantastic - thanks for sharing. I'm particularly interested in the dates for the hot red and the blue. I've been hunting for a blue with a metal cross cap for years and have never found one; this late date of introduction might explain this. Perhaps it was introduced after the metal cross caps were phased out?

 

Regarding the hot/red - I'm interested that this was introduced in 1989. I have a red Safari fountain pen that is stamped "W. Germany", so there must have been only a handful of these compared to the ones stamped "Germany". I am referring only to those hot/reds that have metal cross caps. The ones stamped Germany with the plastic cross caps are plentiful. Presumably the "W.Germany" stamp became exhausted sometime during 1990 as I doubt Lamy would have immediately ceased release of the W.Germany stamp in late 1989.

 

So, three questions for all:

1) Does anyone out there possess a blue Safari with a METAL cross cap? If so, please let me know and I'll resume my hunt.

2) Does anyone else have a red Safari stamped "W.Germany"? (I just remember that CBBP has one of these too, and it has an advertising emblem on it).

3) Does anyone know what year the metal cross cap was replaced by the plastic cross cap? Presumably sometime between 1994-1997, since I have a yellow with a metal cross cap, but an exact year would be great.

 

Finally, the table does miss out one more pen from the pre-1989 era, and that is the earliest version of the Demonstrator. I've only ever seen photos of two Demonstrators stamped W.Germany, one owned by KMPN and one other owned by CBBP. All other Demonstrators that I've seen in the flesh or on photo, of which there are several with the metal cross cap and one (posted by Haywoody) with a plastic cross cap, are stamped Germany.

 

Happy hunting everyone!

 

(Edited because I forgot that CBBP has a W.Germany Demonstrator and a W.Germany Hot/Red...!

My glossy Alpin, Hot Red, Yellow, Blue, textured Griso, all have "Germany" black plastic cross, black clip/nib.

Changes begin with Red Clip, Red Circle cap, black nib, on light blue. Flame Red Clip, Red circle cap, is my first without black nib.

Then silver clips start.

I see no W. Germany on mine.

Have no Terra Rot, Savannah Green, or demonstrator other than Vista, or textured Alpin.

[christof]

@Uffuffa

 

To your questions:

 

1. I have never seen one.

 

 

2. Yes, I have one:

interestingly, the W.Germany is made of much darker red pastic than the never ones. (hard to capture in the picture)

 

3. I don't know a precise date, but your estimation seems correct to me. I bought another red one with metal screw in 95, and a Umbra one with plastic screw in 2000.

 

I did not mention the Demonstrator in my matrix because I don't know if it ever was available officially.

Would be interested in hearing some more informations about these. I don't have one.

 

C.

Edited February 20, 2016 by christof

[Cole_Phelps]

@Uffuffa

 

1) I do not own a blue safari with a metal screw, but I do own one which seems to be sold with an unmarked nib. Does anyone know when the labeled nibs were introduced?

 

2) No, I don't have.

 

3) I own a couple of these W. Germany demonstrators. I will try to answer your questions about them, just go ahead and ask.

[Dillo]

Hi,

 

I thought I had replied to this earlier, but apparently I hadn't. I didn't have a Lamy Safari or Al-Star until fairly recently because I have been more interested in the Lamy ABC. Speaking of the ABC, there have been two major generations that I know of. The first generation has a hard plastic grip section. The second generation has a double shot grip section with softer material. My first generation ABC has the tailless feed that the second generation Safari had and the channels in the cartridge connector, but it has slots on the grip section for the piston converter. I think that although, if I'm not mistaken, the ABC was introduced in 1987, a few years before the third generation Safari, and was developed around the time of the second generation Lamy Safari, and at that time they knew that they would be making converters with nubs on them. I'm rather curious if the development of the ABC had anything to do with the development of nubs on the converter. I'd imagine that they didn't want small children who were trying their hand at bottle filling their pen popping the converter out accidentally and making a mess, and it may also explain why the knob on the Z24 is red. My first generation ABC is red, and it matches the knob on the converter I have installed in it. Maybe it worked so well on the ABC that they decided to introduce it on their other school pen, the Safari. One thing the Z24 converter allows is for the child to grasp either the upper part of the grip section or the converter body and twist the top knob since the nubs prevent the converter from rotating in the grip section. The ABC grip section is unique in that there is a large expanse of plastic sleeve above the threads for the barrel, and on the top of this sleeve are the two notches for the converter. This makes for a larger piece to hold onto when filling the pen which would make easier to grasp, especially for a child who is developing fine motor control.

 

Both my first and second generation ABC pens have a black inner cap. You can't exchange the caps on the first and second generation due to changes in the design of the grip section.

 

I believe the ABC has three generations of pencils. The first two take 3.15 mm leads. One has the hard plastic grip section and the other has the double shot grip section with soft material. The third generation has a double shot grip section but takes 1.4 mm leads like the Faber Castell E-Motion. I only have the third generation pencil, but I believe Bernardo on this forum has a second generation pencil.

 

ABC pens only seem to have come with A nibs which have a round tip and are between a medium and fine in width. A nibs are not, as far as I can tell, made in the black finish. You can get them as spares though. I don't believe they sold the A nibs with the Safari or Al Star, but they do sell them with the Nexx (although outside of Germany, they don't appear to sell the A nib on the Nexx any longer). All of my Lamy Nexx pens have A nibs and so do my ABC pens. I also put an A nib on my Lamy Joy. To this day, the steel A nib on my first generation Lamy ABC is one of the smoothest nibs I have experienced out of the box, and I have handled a lot of nibs.

 

Dillon

Edited June 5, 2016 by Dillo

[caxawu]

The silver converters look really nice but I haven't ever seen one for sale with the safari

[Anne-Sophie]

Hi,

 

I thought I had replied to this earlier, but apparently I hadn't. I didn't have a Lamy Safari or Al-Star until fairly recently because I have been more interested in the Lamy ABC. Speaking of the ABC, there have been two major generations that I know of. The first generation has a hard plastic grip section. The second generation has a double shot grip section with softer material. My first generation ABC has the tailless feed that the second generation Safari had and the channels in the cartridge connector, but it has slots on the grip section for the piston converter. I think that although, if I'm not mistaken, the ABC was introduced in 1987, a few years before the third generation Safari, and was developed around the time of the second generation Lamy Safari, and at that time they knew that they would be making converters with nubs on them. I'm rather curious if the development of the ABC had anything to do with the development of nubs on the converter. I'd imagine that they didn't want small children who were trying their hand at bottle filling their pen popping the converter out accidentally and making a mess, and it may also explain why the knob on the Z24 is red. My first generation ABC is red, and it matches the knob on the converter I have installed in it. Maybe it worked so well on the ABC that they decided to introduce it on their other school pen, the Safari. One thing the Z24 converter allows is for the child to grasp either the upper part of the grip section or the converter body and twist the top knob since the nubs prevent the converter from rotating in the grip section. The ABC grip section is unique in that there is a large expanse of plastic sleeve above the threads for the barrel, and on the top of this sleeve are the two notches for the converter. This makes for a larger piece to hold onto when filling the pen which would make easier to grasp, especially for a child who is developing fine motor control.

 

Both my first and second generation ABC pens have a black inner cap. You can't exchange the caps on the first and second generation due to changes in the design of the grip section.

 

I believe the ABC has three generations of pencils. The first two take 3.15 mm leads. One has the hard plastic grip section and the other has the double shot grip section with soft material. The third generation has a double shot grip section but takes 1.4 mm leads like the Faber Castell E-Motion. I only have the third generation pencil, but I believe Bernardo on this forum has a second generation pencil.

 

ABC pens only seem to have come with A nibs which have a round tip and are between a medium and fine in width. A nibs are not, as far as I can tell, made in the black finish. You can get them as spares though. I don't believe they sold the A nibs with the Safari or Al Star, but they do sell them with the Nexx (although outside of Germany, they don't appear to sell the A nib on the Nexx any longer). All of my Lamy Nexx pens have A nibs and so do my ABC pens. I also put an A nib on my Lamy Joy. To this day, the steel A nib on my first generation Lamy ABC is one of the smoothest nibs I have experienced out of the box, and I have handled a lot of nibs.

 

Dillon

I know the post is almost a year old. Would you mind posting pictures of your ABC's?

[ENewton]

This morning I found, in one of my drawers, the Lamy Safari I bought for my daughter in the late 1990s, when she was a little girl. According to the taxonomy presented in the original post on this thread, the pen is of the third generation. It is of the darker yellow color, with a black nib not marked with the company name or nib size.

 

Would a current Lamy converter be compatible with this pen?

[Astronymus]

Yes, Z24 (old design) and Z28 (new design).

Edited July 30, 2017 by Astron

[ENewton]

Yes, Z24 (old design) and Z28 (new design).

 

Thank you.

[pen2paper]

Hey everyone,

 

I'm glad somebody got some use out of this over-the-top post. I was an exile from FPN for a while and started checking in again recently. It was fun to catch up on this thread and see what others have added. I will try to get back to what I have promised several times and add more information (heard that before? )... I do have a few pictures that might clear up some of the recent discussion...

 

The textured white fountain pen is real; I own two of them. Providing photographic evidence proved to be pretty difficult. If anybody has some tips on how to capture the textured surface of white plastic I'd love to hear them. I tried a bunch of things and in the end had to do some Photoshop trickery to highlight the texture. I didn't add the texture to the pen; it's already there. I simply increased contrast and over-sharpened the pics:

 

Here's the original shot with minimal processing. Textured pen on the bottom/right side:

 

http://haywoody.smugmug.com/photos/1031388852_iiu9k-L.jpg

 

Same photo, with more contrast and sharpening:

 

http://haywoody.smugmug.com/photos/1031388907_ia7jY-L.jpg

 

One more with the textured pen on the top/left:

 

http://haywoody.smugmug.com/photos/1031388790_nxCMx-L.jpg

 

I hope that is proof enough that Lamy shot white plastic into their textured mold at some point.

 

The level of texture is the same as the early charcoal/terracotta/savannah pens. It's hard to see but feels exactly the same. Both my textured pens are what I called "second generation" in the original post, with W. Germany stamped on the bottom. The smooth pen in the comparison pics is also the same generation with identical features but only the LAMY logo textured.

 

I have never seen physical proof or photographs of the smooth charcoal/terracotta/savannah pens but I grilled another FPN'r who claims to have one. He certainly seemed to know what he is talking about and I can't imagine why he would pull my leg. I was also the one who was told by a former, longtime Lamy rep that the pens were made smooth at some point. I'm convinced enough to be on the hunt and will certainly scream if I ever get my hands on one.

 

Cheers,

Woody

Thread discussion bump.. Thanks again Haywoody & All for your contributions.

White Alpin in smooth & textured. Apparently 4 generations, reducing/simplifying parts.

Unless just pulling the nib reveals which one will never know which smooth Alpin I have, since (lesson learned) pulling the feed wrecked my Vista.

[stevesurf]

Bump for a wonderful thread of the very best descriptions of LAMY "Generations." I would be an amazing display if someday at a pen show, a LAMY display of all the colors and variations, against a "rainbow" timeline display. One of the LAMY stores should hire you out to coordinate this

 

I recommend this thread be stickied.

 

 

Hi,

I was Googling "Lamy Safari colors" a few years ago and found my way to this thread. That was my intro to FPN. The Safari was the first fountain pen I ever spent money on. I remember staring at them in a drafting/art supply store near my university many times before I could bring myself to spend $24 for a pen! I'm glad I did... my Charcoal Safari was my only FP and daily writer for nearly 10 years. It wrote without a problem for nearly 17 years until it developed a leak last year. Not too bad for $24.

I have built up a collection of all the colors over the last few years and ended up with some interesting paraphernalia too. This post is the first installment, design changes, with several more to come. The information here is speculation based on the pens sitting in my collection. I doubt it is complete and I am sure there are other variants out there... some of this information is guaranteed to be incorrect. Corrections and additions are welcome.

So, aside from the F sticker on the front pen, what is the difference between the four pictured below?

safari_a1.jpg

They are all obviously textured Charcoal but there are minor design changes from the oldest (front) to most recent (back). Lets call them first through fourth generation. How to spot the differences:

First generation - launched in 1980 these were available in textured finish with 3 color options - Terracotta orange, Savannah green and Charcoal black. The white pen might have been made this early too but I have not seen one.The easiest way to identify the pen is by the lack of imprint in the bottom of the barrel. Another minor detail that is different from future generations is the cap nut is hexagonal. You can see the flats on it if you shine a light into the cap. The pen was designed for cartridges or the old-style metal squeeze bar converter so there are only two wide slots at the threaded end of the section. I believe the old-style converters were included with the pen in some markets and sold separately in others.

Second generation - these appeared sometime in the mid 80's. The "W. Germany" imprint was added to the bottom of the barrel. The inner cap was redesigned (the early material deteriorated quite easily) and the cap nut was changed to a round shape. Other colors were added, including white, red, yellow and blue. Most of these colors were only offered with a smooth texture. The charcoal was still textured and the white was made in both textured and smooth. I have heard rumors of a smooth charcoal but never actually seen one. The Terracotta and Savannah were discontinued.

Third generation - these came around 1990 or 1991. There were two changes on this pen: the barrel imprint was changed to "Germany," thanks to reunification, and extra slots were added to the section to accept the snaps on the plastic piston converter. Colors were basically the same as the previous generation but the textured white disappeared and the first demonstrator was added. The demonstrator might be considered the first "LE" Safari. Around the mid-90's they were sold in some markets but I don't know if they ever appeared as a regular catalog item.

Fourth generation - this change came in the mid to late 90's and was a big one. The clip, nib and feed remained the same but all other parts were redesigned. The Lamy logo and nib size were added to the nib via laser-etching. The barrel was changed from one part to two. The cap and cap ring were combined into one part. The cap asembly was redesigned to snap together, eliminating the machined top screw and cap nut. I believe this redesign was done as a cost-saving measure. The price of these pens has changed very little in nearly 30 years and this redesign allowed Lamy to lower the manufacturing cost. Total number of parts went from 14 down to 11 and they eliminated two costly machined parts. All done without really altering the appearance or quality of the pen - not bad. The original white pen disappeared, a textured grey was introduced and followed by many LE colors. The demonstrator exists in this generation too but it went away when the Vista was introduced.

safari_a2.jpg
Same pens with the section threads showing. The slots for the piston converter were added on the third generation pens

safari_a3.jpg
Tops, generation 1-4, left to right

safari_a4.jpg
Bottoms, generation 1-4, left to right

safari_a5.jpg
Autopsy shot - third generation pen

safari_a6.jpg
Autopsy shot - fourth generation pen

safari_a7.jpg
Converters and a cartridge

If you have a Safari which falls outside the descriptions above, please post (and let me know if you are interested in selling it /default/yikes.gif ).

Next installment... nibs

/Woody

[Lamyliz]

What a great thread! Thank you for the information and photos.

I was confused about one thing though, I know people love lamys but this week I saw 3 safaris on eBay which were chewed up and there were 10 bidders on it! The auction included a blue all-star, a red, and lilac lamy safari and a brown case.

Do people really want them so beat up?

[cujo]

Found those Safaris on Japanese auction site:





What a lovely pigeon blue matte color. Never seen it before. Can you please help me identifying it?

[Uffuffa]

Hi Cujo - that is a very interesting find! Where did you buy it? At first it looked to me like a griso but you have mentioned it has a blue tone to it. If it is blue-grey, I don’t believe I have seen that colour either. Do you have a griso to compare it to side by side? Chris

[cujo]

Sorry, unfortunately is not mine. Found it on Yahoo auctions Japanese site. Not sure if It is OK to post the link here.


I have griso safari and this one looks quite different to me, the white balance of the pictures is right as well. Lovely color, maybe it is a Japanese limited edition.

[1nkulus]

That greyish blue is a lovely colour, probably a JP only release.

[Anne-Sophie]

The greyish blue purple need to be re-issued! It is a lovely color.

 

Those look like pencils. I never knew that there was a pink pencil.