Is it normal for ink to pool around the tines regularly like this?

[iPen]

When I first go to use my fountain pen, I notice that there's always ink that pools around the tines of the nib (shown in first pic). When I wipe it off and write with it, the ink pool appears again shortly after use.

 

If that's normal, then:

• Will that always happen and that's simply the nature of fountain pens?
• Is that caused by how I store it (flat and parallel with surface/ground on a table)? I.e. should it be stored with the nib point up?
• Is it because the ink that I'm using is especially wet?
• Should I not be wiping it off? Does that pool of ink that's there prevent more pooling of ink (this may not be insignificant, as over time, that may mean a lot of wasted ink, more frequent refilling which is often messy, etc.)? 

 

If that's not normal, then:

• Is my nib damaged? For an EF size, it seems to write bolder than I expected. Using electronic calipers, I measured the line thickness as approximately 0.44mm on junk mail envelope stock, and 0.25mm on cereal box cardboard. When the ink is running low/out, it writes much thinner and what I assumed an EF would write like. After refilling the converter with ink, it writes much bolder. That comparison is shown in the 2nd pic, with both written on the same junk mail envelope paper (there's lots of feathering and bleeding, but the difference in boldness is clear; and mind my handwriting, I'm still working on it lol).
• Is there simply too much flow? If so, then how do I go about slowing down the ink flow? Do I tighten the tines (like this)?

 

Further specs and variables:

• Pen: Lamy Lx Palladium
• Nib: Lamy Z55 14K gold <EF>
• Ink: Pilot tsuki-yo iroshizuku

 

Thanks in advance!

[davisgt]

My suggestion would be to store the pen nib up for a week. See if it stops. You could also try a dry ink like Pelikan 4001. See if that helps.  

[Lithium466]

That looks relatively normal to me, you may want to try other inks and see what it does.

I also want to say the line size is within acceptable range for a Z55 EF, measurement on decent paper would give a better idea. I think the range Lamy gives is 0,36mm +-0,06mm so if you include spreading/feathering on bad paper the 0,44mm would not shock me.

[iPen]

2 hours ago, davisgt said:

My suggestion would be to store the pen nib up for a week. See if it stops. You could also try a dry ink like Pelikan 4001. See if that helps.  

 

I'll definitely try to keep the pen nib point up for a week. If I exhaust all other non-$ options, I may try that ink suggestion, thanks.

 

19 minutes ago, Lithium466 said:

That looks relatively normal to me, you may want to try other inks and see what it does.

I also want to say the line size is within acceptable range for a Z55 EF, measurement on decent paper would give a better idea. I think the range Lamy gives is 0,36mm +-0,06mm so if you include spreading/feathering on bad paper the 0,44mm would not shock me.

 

Interesting, so this may all be normal and/or within expectations then.

 

And yeah, given those parameters, the 0.44mm should not be too surprising. I'm curious though as to how I can effectively produce thinner lines and to see what works (e.g. tightening the tines, drier ink, etc.).

 

Thanks for those details 

[Dillo]

I find that this can be fairly common depending on the ink you are using. One other thing I would try to dispense with is the idea of a clean nib, especially on a bottle-filled pen. I see a lot of people wiping their nibs constantly, running them under water to try to get the ink off. Instead, I would say it's normal to have ink on the nib on anything from the tines forward. Don't bother wiping it off. If you have any spots of dye on the nib, any moisture in the cap from the ink and condensation will generally turn the spots of dye into drops of ink when you uncap the pen.

 

Lamy gold nibs tend to run wider than their steel counterparts. I see this often when comparing the Z50 and Z55 nibs. The Lamy EF nibs often have an interesting shape that creates thinner downstrokes and thicker horizontal strokes.

 

My very last thing is to look and see if the nib and the feed are touching and there is no gap. Lamy's Z50 and Z55 nibs sometimes have variations with the amount of curvature they have, but they should have a gentle curve downwards and touch the feed. You should not be able to pass even a thin piece of paper between the feed and nib if everything is adjusted properly. A gap will cause both the pooling and inconsistent flow, but it may not be the cause of what you are experiencing. It's worth checking though. If there are problems, I would take the nib off and place it over your thumb and gently bend the tines downward. This will also dry the flow up slightly. In my experience, the gold nibs are more springy than the steel nibs and a bit more effort is needed to get the gentle curve you need. During the nib manufacturing process, there is a step that pushes the tines together and creates the subtle bend. On the Z50 and Z55 nibs, sometimes there are issues with this process and they don't get enough of the curve or much of a taper in the slit from the breather hole to the nib tips. I went through a whole bunch of my Lamy pens last night because someone asked a question about this and made measurements.

[iPen]

3 hours ago, Dillo said:

I find that this can be fairly common depending on the ink you are using. One other thing I would try to dispense with is the idea of a clean nib, especially on a bottle-filled pen. I see a lot of people wiping their nibs constantly, running them under water to try to get the ink off. Instead, I would say it's normal to have ink on the nib on anything from the tines forward. Don't bother wiping it off. If you have any spots of dye on the nib, any moisture in the cap from the ink and condensation will generally turn the spots of dye into drops of ink when you uncap the pen.

 

Lamy gold nibs tend to run wider than their steel counterparts. I see this often when comparing the Z50 and Z55 nibs. The Lamy EF nibs often have an interesting shape that creates thinner downstrokes and thicker horizontal strokes.

 

My very last thing is to look and see if the nib and the feed are touching and there is no gap. Lamy's Z50 and Z55 nibs sometimes have variations with the amount of curvature they have, but they should have a gentle curve downwards and touch the feed. You should not be able to pass even a thin piece of paper between the feed and nib if everything is adjusted properly. A gap will cause both the pooling and inconsistent flow, but it may not be the cause of what you are experiencing. It's worth checking though. If there are problems, I would take the nib off and place it over your thumb and gently bend the tines downward. This will also dry the flow up slightly. In my experience, the gold nibs are more springy than the steel nibs and a bit more effort is needed to get the gentle curve you need. During the nib manufacturing process, there is a step that pushes the tines together and creates the subtle bend. On the Z50 and Z55 nibs, sometimes there are issues with this process and they don't get enough of the curve or much of a taper in the slit from the breather hole to the nib tips. I went through a whole bunch of my Lamy pens last night because someone asked a question about this and made measurements.

 

Fortunately for me, there's no sufficiently large gap between the nib and feed. Though, your suggestion to bend the tines downward for a drier flow is something that I'm considering. I'm also considering this method to bring the tines closer together: 

 

 

[Dillo]

Don't bend them downwards for dryer flow. That only works well if you have the gap between the nib and feed. Otherwise you can negatively affect the curvature of the nib and how it interacts with the feed. Try the Doodlebud method, but two things. Try to minimize the nib tips hitting each other or the sides of the slit chewing each other up. This will work to slow down the flow.

[antares1966]

Looks like classic “nib creep”.  A “drier” ink can help remedy the problem but the issue is usually imperceptible imperfections in how the slit was cut at manufacture.  Typically it’s fairly benign and mainly aesthetically unpleasant.

 

http://www.richardspens.com/?page=ref/ttp/creeps.htm

 

This link has a pretty good explanation of the phenomenon.

[torstar]

On 11/16/2024 at 2:11 PM, iPen said:

When I first go to use my fountain pen, I notice that there's always ink that pools around the tines of the nib (shown in first pic). When I wipe it off and write with it, the ink pool appears again shortly after use.

 

If that's normal, then:

• Will that always happen and that's simply the nature of fountain pens?
• Is that caused by how I store it (flat and parallel with surface/ground on a table)? I.e. should it be stored with the nib point up?
• Is it because the ink that I'm using is especially wet?
• Should I not be wiping it off? Does that pool of ink that's there prevent more pooling of ink (this may not be insignificant, as over time, that may mean a lot of wasted ink, more frequent refilling which is often messy, etc.)? 

 

If that's not normal, then:

• Is my nib damaged? For an EF size, it seems to write bolder than I expected. Using electronic calipers, I measured the line thickness as approximately 0.44mm on junk mail envelope stock, and 0.25mm on cereal box cardboard. When the ink is running low/out, it writes much thinner and what I assumed an EF would write like. After refilling the converter with ink, it writes much bolder. That comparison is shown in the 2nd pic, with both written on the same junk mail envelope paper (there's lots of feathering and bleeding, but the difference in boldness is clear; and mind my handwriting, I'm still working on it lol).
• Is there simply too much flow? If so, then how do I go about slowing down the ink flow? Do I tighten the tines (like this)?

 

Further specs and variables:

• Pen: Lamy Lx Palladium
• Nib: Lamy Z55 14K gold <EF>
• Ink: Pilot tsuki-yo iroshizuku

 

Thanks in advance!

 

I can only wish mine were that clean....

 

When it bothers me I wipe it down, if it starts to get all over the place I panic.

 

I don't thoroughly clean things after the plunge for a piston fill.  If the fingers are going to remain unsullied I am good to return to writing.

 

 

[Ron Z]

59 minutes ago, antares1966 said:

Looks like classic “nib creep”.  

 

Exactly.

[Beechwood]

18 hours ago, antares1966 said:

Looks like classic “nib creep”.  A “drier” ink can help remedy the problem but the issue is usually imperceptible imperfections in how the slit was cut at manufacture.  Typically it’s fairly benign and mainly aesthetically unpleasant.

 

http://www.richardspens.com/?page=ref/ttp/creeps.htm

 

This link has a pretty good explanation of the phenomenon.

 

I thought nib creep was just an unpleasant person that I met at the London Pen Show.

 

But, seriously,  as Antares suggests, in the whole scheme of things, it is not something that is worrisome.