Lamy 2000, Pilot Custom 74, Sailor 1911, and Pelikan M200, all in M nib.

[AceNinja]

Finally I've got a chance to visit a prominent pen store. And I asked to test the 3 pens: Lamy 2000, Pilot Custom 74, Sailor 1911 all in M nib. This is the first time I seeing these 3 pens with my own eyes and touch these pens with my own hands.

 

Between the 3, at least the 3 example that I tested (dipped ink) in this store, the pilot is the smoothest of all, even smoother than the L2K. And finally I understand the pencil like effect of sailor. It is smooth, with the consistent pencil feel. The L2K I tested I think there's problem with the nib, because it lay down a thinner and lighter line than the other 2, indicating to me that the tine must be too tight.

 

On the spot I brought my own Pelikan M200, so I took it out to test on the spot on the same paper. It makes me appreciate my M200 so much, because it's smoothness is just below the pilot, but definitely above the Sailor.

 

In terms of pen feel and quality. The L2K is the best, and I think my grip suits the pen. And the pen material is definitely obvious different from Jinhao 80 haha, it's just that from the photo along it's kind of the same.

 

Next the quality of pilot and sailor is on par of each other. And I think my M200 has better quality feel than the sailor and pilot.

 

I ended up did not bought any of the pen. Still need time to digest what I've just felt, for the first time. Bought some pilot twsuwario ink instead.

[Janeite]

Thanks so much for sharing your impressions!  There is nothing like being able to handle the pens and write with them for yourself to determine your own feelings toward the pens that we hear so much about!  

 

I was recently in a store with most of these pens, and it was definitely interesting.  The Pilot nibs deserve their reputation, that's for sure!  Unfortunately, I just don't care for the looks of the Custom 74, at least not at its price.  It writes so well, but it does not look like it should cost as much as it does!  I prefer the looks of the 743, but I'd want the U.S. exclusive version in green, but I'm not sure that paying $140 or more to not have a black pen is worth it, so instead, I'm just dithering on the sidelines.  

 

How does your M200 compare to the L2K?

[Driften]

My Lamy 2000 M puts down a 0.55m line width but you have to be careful not to rotate the nib or it will skip. My Pilot 92 M does 0.50mm, my Sailor KOP M 0.50mm but in a Pro Gear its B is 0.45mm which for some strange reason is also what my 1911 Large MF does. Now my Pelikan m200 M does 0.50mm.  In any case you have to judge each pen as an individual sample.

 

It could be when you tested the L2k the nib wasn't flat in the sweet spot and wrote a little thinner, but you also need to know just dipping pens doesn't always give you the same performance as ink coming from a fill. I expect the Lamy didn't soak that much into the feed with its semi hooded nib. 

 

The L2k has some great points like not drying out easy with the cap off, but I don't find it as comfortable to hold as the others you tested. The Pelikan m200 is a great pen and very cheep to swap nib sizes on. That said I do like Pilot and Sailor. I agree Pilot needs to have some nicer body finishes black+gold, or demonstrators get old. I also enjoy the feedback from Sailor and Platinum nibs. I don't find a nib that is so polished that it skates and is hard to control on smooth paper to be an enjoyable experience. 

 

If you like the feel any of the pens in your test should do you well.

[AceNinja]

16 hours ago, Janeite said:

Thanks so much for sharing your impressions!  There is nothing like being able to handle the pens and write with them for yourself to determine your own feelings toward the pens that we hear so much about!  

yep!  I've read and watch so much about these pens, for so long.  It still doesn't compare when the pen is actually your hand.

 

16 hours ago, Janeite said:

How does your M200 compare to the L2K?

From the test example that i have, my M200 is definitely far smoother than the L2K.  But again like i said, i think that particular L2K's nib is tine too tight.  And I like the looks of M200 better (mine is the Brown Marbled version)

 

14 hours ago, Driften said:

My Lamy 2000 M puts down a 0.55m line width but you have to be careful not to rotate the nib or it will skip. My Pilot 92 M does 0.50mm, my Sailor KOP M 0.50mm but in a Pro Gear its B is 0.45mm which for some strange reason is also what my 1911 Large MF does. Now my Pelikan m200 M does 0.50mm.  In any case you have to judge each pen as an individual sample.

In your case which is the smoothest M nib of all? of the pens you mentioned here.  Do you enjoy more to the glassy smooth or the pencil like Sailor?

 

 

14 hours ago, Driften said:

It could be when you tested the L2k the nib wasn't flat in the sweet spot and wrote a little thinner, but you also need to know just dipping pens doesn't always give you the same performance as ink coming from a fill. I expect the Lamy didn't soak that much into the feed with its semi hooded nib. 

I do aware of the famous L2k sweet spot, so when i test i do test from multiple angle.  This particular one doesn't give me the feel of a 'sweet spot'.   And you could be right, dipping a semi hooded nib doesn't pick up as much ink as normal nib like the C74 and 1911.  I spent so much time testing this 3 pens, especially the L2k i re-dipped a few times, I felt a bit sorry walking out the store without buying one of the pen.

 

 

[Dillo]

With the Lamy 2000, it might be worth buying from someone like Dan Smith from Nibsmith because he can tune it and adjust it before you get it. Back when, people would order Lamy 2000 pens and have them sent directly to me for adjustment before they received them because there is some inconsistency in how many nibs are. I have quite a few Lamy pens, and none of them write the same way even with the same point size on the nib. Montblanc and early 2000's Parker are more inconsistent in my experience though. To be fair, I've seen some of this variation in Pelikans too, back when I used to sell Pelikans. Pilot has very consistent nibs. I collect Pilot, and my Pilots all write very consistently. I know that if I buy the same Pilot pen in the same point size I will get a very particular writing experience.

[Driften]

I think my pilot nibs and Pelikan nibs are the smoothest for me. I do like the feedback on Sailor nibs.

[Mercian]

On 10/30/2024 at 9:34 AM, AceNinja said:

In terms of pen feel and quality. The L2K is the best, and I think my grip suits the pen.

 

On the basis of this ↑ comment, you seem to like the Lamy 2000 very much - enough that, of the three pens you tried, you should probably buy it (unless you would prefer to have a c/c pen as well as your piston-fill M200).

 

I think that, if I were you, I would go back to the store and ask to try out a Lamy 2000 again.
You may get a different 2000 this time, or you could even ask to try a couple of them, to see if they all have the same, 'reduced', level of flow of the first one that you tries out.

 

For what it's worth, I suspect that you may be right about that particular 2000 having a nib-problem, because my own Lamy 2000 (which has an 'F' nib) is just as 'wet' as my Pelikan M205 F and my 1990s Pelikan M400 (with a narrow 'M' nib).

My Lamy 2000 'F' is also as smooth as my Parker 75 'F' and 'M', and my other Pelikans.

 

I wish you good luck in your quest

[lamarax]

I'm not one to usually paint things with a broad nib brush, but if I were to categorize these makers in mere consistency terms (not the particular models), it'd go something like this:

 

Pilot > Platinum > Sailor > Pelikan ...

...and then Lamy at the bottom. By far.

 

IMO predisposition towards a certain brand doesn't hold when it comes down to hard QA. I'm personally fond of Pelikans, but I'd be lying if I said they're always good out of the box; "baby's bottom" is a real thing, more often than I'd be comfortable to admit with such an investment.

Lamy's fountain pens OTOH, including their flagship 2000 (but ooh.. aah.. Bauhaus!), are nothing but glorified, entry level ballpoint substitutes for whatever reason one wants to do that in this day and age.

 

With Japanese brands, you're at least guaranteed to have the experience they intended you to have each and every time, whether you like it or not 😛

 

[Mercian]

1 hour ago, lamarax said:

Lamy's fountain pens OTOH, including their flagship 2000 (but ooh.. aah.. Bauhaus!), are nothing but glorified, entry level ballpoint substitutes for whatever reason one wants to do that in this day and age.

 

What, even the ones that have oblique or italic nibs?

Harsh!

[lamarax]

32 minutes ago, Mercian said:

 

What, even the ones that have oblique or italic nibs?

Harsh!

 

Pray tell, where one is to find those? I mean the only grinds the average Joe person can encounter at large, are the standard EF, F, M, or maybe the stray B.

 

(I say this having an actual, physical, exclusive LAMY store practically next door -- If I were to ask for a left oblique italic, they'd probably call the counter-terrorist squad) 😉

[Mercian]

12 minutes ago, lamarax said:

Pray tell, where one is to find those? I mean the only grinds the average Joe person can encounter at large, are the standard EF, F, M, or maybe the stray B.

 

(I say this having an actual, physical, exclusive LAMY store practically next door -- If I were to ask for a left oblique italic, they'd probably call the anti-terrorist squad) 😉

 

You have an actual Lamy Store?
Ooh, bloody luxury!

 

Being an inhabitant of twigs-in-one's-beard territory near an unremarkable small market town in the UK equivalent of US 'flyover country', I am forced to make all my purchases online (unless I have an urge to buy a Safari with an 'M' nib on it, or some cartridges of Lamy 'Blue').
Fortunately for me, there are some great online retailers here in the UK 😊

 

Lamy only offer two oblique grinds - OM and OB - and even then they only offer them on their gold nibs.
So, possibly out of the reach of the 'ordinary Joe' (or, indeed, anyone who is not the sort of 'clearly-insane' pen hobbyist that one can find here on FPN ).
I presume that these are 'left foot' obliques - i.e. suitable for use by right-handed writers.

 

The Z50 nib can be had in 1.1i, 1.5i, and 1.9i - but only in shiny stainless steel, not in black-coated steel.

I have 'fully' one 1.1i nib, and I estimate the wide down-stroke line that my one 1.1i nib writes to be ~0.6mm wide.
Its down-stroke is slightly wider, and its cross-stroke slightly less-crisp than, the equivalent strokes of the 'M' nib on my Pilot Plumix.

[lamarax]

I know 😊 

 

My point is; when someone's gathered all that knowledge, they're probably already past LAMY (although admittedly, one is compelled to own at least a pfff... black Macrolon 2000 to be taken half-seriously. Now, the green 500€ version takes you to another level of ehm... connoisseurness 😛)