Need help with an ID for an old Sheaffer.

[Peony Blush]

I got an old Sheaffer fountain pen today (1950s ish?). It’s banged up, but cute and it makes me smile. It’s very small and I can’t figure out how to open it to put ink in. I did a dip test, and it seems to write fine. I’ve attached several photos. Any thoughts, aside than it looks like someone chewed on the nib? 😉

Edited October 4, 2024 by Peony Blush
Typo

[Peony Blush]

Ha! I think I figured out how to ink it. The back end unscrews and you can pull up a piston. That’s a new one for me! I’ve only used cartridges and converters up to this point.

[Ron Z]

Turn the nib over....  Is there a metal tube in the middle of the feed or not?

 

Tube = snorkel.  No tube = Thin Model (TM) Touchdown (TD). 

 

Both are pneumatic fillers, similar in operation.  With the TM TD you pull the touchdown tube back all the way, immerse the nib in ink and push down. You should see bubbles come out of the nib and hear a "chiff" at the end of the down stroke.  Wait a few seconds and pull out of the ink.

 

With the snorkel, turn the back end to extend the snorkel and then like the TD, pull the tube back, push down swiftly.  You should see bubbles come out of the end of the snorkel tube, and nowhere else.  Take the pen out of the ink, retract the nib by turning CW until it stops.  The pen should be ready to write.

 

With either pen, and especially with the snorkel, don't pull back on the TD tube with the pen in the ink.  If the sac is bad, you'll pull ink into the barrel, not the sac, and that's not a good thing.  Even if the sac is good on the snorkel pulling back on the TD tube can pull ink in around the point holder gasket that goes around the snorkel tube and is hidden in the section.  That's a bad thing, because there are carbon steel parts that can rust very quickly, which makes a heck of an expensive mess to repair.

[gmark_wa]

From your photos, it looks like you have a Sheaffer Touchdown Valiant.  These were made around 1949-1950.  As Ron has mentioned, this has a Touchdown filler (see attached filling instructions).  

 

Touchdowns have a rubber sac and a rubber plunger o-ring.  These parts degrade over time and eventually fail (the rubber goes hard).  You need to check that the sac is good before trying to fill the pen.  There are videos on YouTube that show how to service or restore a Touchdown (it is not difficult).

 

[es9]

Honestly, the nib doesn’t look that bad. Some light polishing will help, but be careful not to overdo it on the masking—that’s just plating. 
 

Great pens… a bit harder to restore than a lever-filler, but much easier than a snorkel. 

[Peony Blush]

  On 10/4/2024 at 9:14 PM, Ron Z said:

Turn the nib over....  Is there a metal tube in the middle of the feed or not?

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Not sure if you can see the photos, but the fifth photo shows the other side of the nib. Based on your description, I'd say it's Thin Model (TM) Touchdown (TD). Would you agree? I'm not very good at this yet.

 

 

Also: "With either pen, and especially with the snorkel, don't pull back on the TD tube with the pen in the ink.  If the sac is bad, you'll pull ink into the barrel, not the sac, and that's not a good thing.  Even if the sac is good on the snorkel pulling back on the TD tube can pull ink in around the point holder gasket that goes around the snorkel tube and is hidden in the section.  That's a bad thing, because there are carbon steel parts that can rust very quickly, which makes a heck of an expensive mess to repair."

 

I'm so glad I didn't try to ink this up yet! Thank you for the warning.

[Peony Blush]

  On 10/4/2024 at 10:43 PM, gmark_wa said:

There are videos on YouTube that show how to service or restore a Touchdown (it is not difficult).

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Wow! I found more than expected. Apparently, I need to remove the barrel from the nib section, but mine won't budge, even with the help of a jar opener. They recommended soaking in water overnight, so it's sitting in a glass of water right now. Also, they were able to move the piston up and down MUCH easier than I could, whatever that means. Thank you for the suggestion!

[Peony Blush]

  On 10/5/2024 at 1:00 AM, es9 said:

Honestly, the nib doesn’t look that bad. Some light polishing will help, but be careful not to overdo it on the masking—that’s just plating. 

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I'm glad to hear that! It looks a mess to me. I've never tried to polish a nib. Is that something I can DIY, or should I have a professional do it?

[gmark_wa]

  On 10/7/2024 at 1:07 AM, Peony Blush said:

 

Wow! I found more than expected. Apparently, I need to remove the barrel from the nib section, but mine won't budge, even with the help of a jar opener. They recommended soaking in water overnight, so it's sitting in a glass of water right now. Also, they were able to move the piston up and down MUCH easier than I could, whatever that means. Thank you for the suggestion!

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If you can't unscrew the section from the barrel then the threads probably have a sealant on them. Sheaffer's used a sealant when they produced the pens, and repairers often use shellac or similar to seal the threads after refurbishing the pen.  From my experience, these sealants will loosen with mild heat (less than 80 degrees C).  I use my wife's hair dryer to warm the area where the section screws into the barrel (the top 10 cm of the barrel).  This usually loosens the sealant and allows me to unscrew the section.  Be careful not to overheat the plastic.  

 

Soaking the pen will help loosen any dried ink in the section and barrel but probably won't loosen any sealant.

[Peony Blush]

  On 10/7/2024 at 10:38 AM, gmark_wa said:

Soaking the pen will help loosen any dried ink in the section and barrel but probably won't loosen any sealant.

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It seems you are correct, sir. I attempted to unscrew the barrel this morning, and it didn't budge in the slightest. The water was still clear, so it would seem there wasn't any dried ink that was reachable by the water. The hair dryer trick is next. Wish me luck!

[Peony Blush]

  On 10/7/2024 at 10:38 AM, gmark_wa said:

From my experience, these sealants will loosen with mild heat (less than 80 degrees C).  I use my wife's hair dryer to warm the area where the section screws into the barrel (the top 10 cm of the barrel).  This usually loosens the sealant and allows me to unscrew the section.  Be careful not to overheat the plastic. 

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Ha! That did the trick! Back to the YouTube videos.

[Peony Blush]

The picture below shows my progress so far. I have a new ink sac and O rings on order, but it appears I need some silicone grease, sealant, and chalk dust as well, so I'm in the process of sniffing that out. Forgive my terminology if I get any descriptions wrong in my explanations.

 

I found a few things I didn't expect:

1. The sac housing seems like it's in rough shape. On the videos I watched, they were all shiny. When I run my fingers over it, the surface is rough in places. Visually, it looks like it might be some kind of residual adhesive. Should I polish that up somehow?
2. I'm finding rust on the head of the screw from the piston cap. There also appears to be some in the threads where the grip screws into the body, but I guess it could be old resin, if that's possible. I can't tell if the threads are rusty metal or gunky plastic. Any suggestions on how to tidy them up?
3. The star shaped washer that went under the screw was a surprise.

According to one of the videos, if I soak the grip and thread assembly, it should loosen that up. Does that sound right? I still need to dig the old O ring out of the top of the body, which ought to be a challenge being black on black.

 

You all have been so helpful! I'm really enjoying this process. Additional suggestions are welcome.

 

[terim]

  On 10/7/2024 at 12:54 AM, Peony Blush said:

Not sure if you can see the photos, but the fifth photo shows the other side of the nib. Based on your description, I'd say it's Thin Model (TM) Touchdown (TD). Would you agree? I'm not very good at this yet.

 

 

Also: "With either pen, and especially with the snorkel, don't pull back on the TD tube with the pen in the ink.  If the sac is bad, you'll pull ink into the barrel, not the sac, and that's not a good thing.  Even if the sac is good on the snorkel pulling back on the TD tube can pull ink in around the point holder gasket that goes around the snorkel tube and is hidden in the section.  That's a bad thing, because there are carbon steel parts that can rust very quickly, which makes a heck of an expensive mess to repair."

 

I'm so glad I didn't try to ink this up yet! Thank you for the warning.

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They did make "fat" versions of the Valiant touchdown, so you'll want to figure out which you have before you order the O-ring.

 

Here's one we had recently ....

https://www.peytonstreetpens.com/sheaffer-valiant-fountain-pen-1949-50-burgundy-fat-touchdown-14k-medium-excellent-restored.html

[Peony Blush]

  On 10/7/2024 at 8:24 PM, terim said:

you'll want to figure out which you have before you order the O-ring

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Based on the photos, I'm pretty sure that's not the same size as the pen I have. The kit I ordered came with two O rings. I wonder if that's why? 

[gmark_wa]

  On 10/7/2024 at 2:09 PM, Peony Blush said:

 

1. The sac housing seems like it's in rough shape. On the videos I watched, they were all shiny. When I run my fingers over it, the surface is rough in places. Visually, it looks like it might be some kind of residual adhesive. Should I polish that up somehow?
2. I'm finding rust on the head of the screw from the piston cap. There also appears to be some in the threads where the grip screws into the body, but I guess it could be old resin, if that's possible. I can't tell if the threads are rusty metal or gunky plastic. Any suggestions on how to tidy them up?
3. The star shaped washer that went under the screw was a surprise.

According to one of the videos, if I soak the grip and thread assembly, it should loosen that up. Does that sound right?

 

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1.  These sac protectors are made of non-stainless steel and are given a blueing-type treatment. Unfortunately, this finish wears off over time and the steel corrodes. I treat mine with rust inhibitor. 
2. Rust on the screw head is common. It shows that the pen was left inked for a long time. I clean the rust off and treat the screw with rust inhibitor. 
3. Touchdowns and Snorkels have a rubber gasket (washer) inside the plunger cap to seal the bottom of the plunger. Is that where the star shaped washer was? The gaskets I have seen are mostly round.
 

Regarding the grip, I suspect it is also sealed. I would try mild heat again. 

[gmark_wa]

  On 10/7/2024 at 2:09 PM, Peony Blush said:

The picture below shows my progress so far. I have a new ink sac and O rings on order, but it appears I need some silicone grease, sealant, and chalk dust as well, so I'm in the process of sniffing that out. Forgive my terminology if I get any descriptions wrong in my explanations.

 

Expand  

The white rubber O ring is most likely the original.  Sheaffer's used white rubber rings whereas replacement O rings are usually black rubber.

[Peony Blush]

  On 10/7/2024 at 8:24 PM, terim said:

Here's one we had recently ....

https://www.peytonstreetpens.com/sheaffer-valiant-fountain-pen-1949-50-burgundy-fat-touchdown-14k-medium-excellent-restored.html

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I love your store! I had a chance to browse a little this morning and add a bookmark.  

[es9]

  On 10/8/2024 at 5:19 AM, gmark_wa said:

I treat mine with rust inhibitor. 

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What specifically do you use? 

[Ron Z]

  On 10/8/2024 at 8:59 AM, gmark_wa said:

The white rubber O ring is most likely the original.  Sheaffer's used white rubber rings whereas replacement O rings are usually black rubber.

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I see both in pens that have never been restored.   I have OEM 0-rings that came out of the Sheaffer service center that were used in the Imperial and Targa sections, in both black and gray (not white).  There's enough variation that you can't say that as a hard and fast rule.  The change in  material and color came some time in the 60s.   The after market ones that have been available were based on measurements of 0-rings.  Not sure what the source was.   But the correct 0-rings are available, many of them gray, not black.  I've used gray 0-rings that came from Sheaffer in all of my TM size pen repairs, and many of my Fat TD and PFM repairs since 2008, as did Richard Binder, and now the Kennedys and I think Martin Ferguson. 

 

 

 

 

[Peony Blush]

I still can't get the grip and nib assembly unstuck from each other. Heat from the hair dryer doesn't seem to help, even using a rubber gripper for traction.