Are there versions of "Copperplate" where the letters are enclosed and more readable?

[PhiloPlume]

Hi,

 

I am probably going to tick some people off, but I find both of those have small and capital letters that don't look like what I think they should look like and makes it not just hard to read for myself, but others that I have shown it too.

 

I am learning Copperplate, but I do not want to end up using some of the letters.  Mostly those that are not completely enclosed.  It is sometimes a guessing game to read what has been written if I cannot rely on the rest of the letters filling in the blanks so to speak, in order to make out the word or sentence.

 

Forget about the "crazy" Z and z.  I will come up with my own to look like regular ones.    I am thinking about letters like p which looks more like and h, minuscule r, and a few others including capitals.  Maybe I am looking for a consistent alphabet(s) to practice and learn how to write, whatever it is called.

 

If I ever got good enough to write a formal document like a wedding invitations (not going there!) I would like it to be completely legible.  How some letters addressed with Copperplate that I have seen ever make it to the proper recipient baffles me! 🙂

 

 And everything is so "big" from what I have seen. I use italic for most of my writing (i.e., Lloyd Reynolds, Fred Eager,...) but want to learn something more formal for special occasions.  Maybe certificates,....  although I do think Italic is beautiful especially some of the examples in Sheila Water's beautiful "Foundations of Calligraphy" book.

 

All right.  That's it for now hehe

 

Don't suggest Spencerian because I hate it! 🙂

[effrafax]

There's nothing stopping you from developing your own style and modifying letters to suit your taste.  May not be strict Copperplate, but how important is that to you?

 

[PhiloPlume]

  On 7/29/2024 at 2:43 AM, effrafax said:

There's nothing stopping you from developing your own style and modifying letters to suit your taste.  May not be strict Copperplate, but how important is that to you?

 

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Not at all!  I just seems like it is the "in thing".  Everybody's doing it 🙂

 

Thanks!

[PhiloPlume]

  On 7/29/2024 at 2:43 AM, effrafax said:

There's nothing stopping you from developing your own style and modifying letters to suit your taste.  May not be strict Copperplate, but how important is that to you?

 

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It would be helpful if I had a sheet to trace and practice with a lightbox though!

[Inkyways]

If you learn the basic Copperplate then you can have or create your own version of copperplate. but the only thing in common would  be respectful for all copperplate IS  SLANTING , AND SPACING AND SHADING AND hair lines as for " old English  round hand "

 

You can use some SPENCERIAN CAPITALS WITH COPPERPLATE.

If you look at THE CENTURY  OLDEST AMERICAN Enoch  Noyes  American round hand  which I believe before America Engrosser round hand it is very similar to ENGLISH ROUND HAND.

I am attaching two pages to show some specimens  here .

That can be really used with English round hand.

Elinor Winter has a different approach  in to copperplate and it was the contemporary copperplate   calligraphy ten in her time I guess.

If you look at Paul Antonios and  Zuzanne Cunnigham's work they have a very different Copperplate styles . 

 

If you have << Sheila Water's beautiful "Foundations of Calligraphy" book >> it is a great start . 

So to my knowledge there's not one rule for  writing but first of all you have to identify what is the base and master it to  a level so that you can show up with some thing you can call this the way   I want my copperplate.

 

 

[PhiloPlume]

  On 8/17/2024 at 9:25 PM, Inkyways said:

f you have << Sheila Water's beautiful "Foundations of Calligraphy" book >> it is a great start . 

So to my knowledge there's not one rule for  writing but first of all you have to identify what is the base and master it to  a level so that you can show up with some thing you can call this the way   I want my copperplate.

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What a coincidence that I was just searching for legible, elegant script and I found a couple links to the FPN forum, one of which was this of mine! And noticed that I had a reply from you!  I find Copperplate with all the extreme (my description) flourishes to borderline on illegible and distracting.  I also am going to offend fans of Spencerian saying the same thing about that script:  Mostly illegible. The shading is distracting and draws the eyes away from the letters. Look at the banner of the home page of IAMPETH.  I think both require a trained eye to accept and read both scripts.  "Yeah, I think that says XXXX but that letter I think is supposed to be a p looks like an h.  I think I can make that out now...".

 

To my eyes and brain, this is barely legible and readable and decipherable, and this is only one letter:

 

I do have that book!!  I have about 20 pages with post-it tabs on them!  I keep wanting to go back to Italic for elegant stuff. I think pages 120, 130, 131 and others are beautiful!  In fact, I really should get another copy and leave it unmarked.  Maybe put it behind glass 🙂

 

Your examples that you embedded are exactly what I am looking for and want to be able to do!  As beautiful and elegant as penmanship gets, as far as I am concerned.  I want to learn that but haven't been able to find the resources to do so.  Yesterday, I spent time searching for English Roundhand and Roundhand. 

 

Thank you very much Inkyways!!

 

-paul

[PhiloPlume]

Once again, confirmed and affirmed that Copperplate and Spencerian is cryptic to her 🙂  I went a guitar lesson and I was asked what I was up to (besides practicing, of course! Always a good answer! hehe)) and I said I was trying to learn some calligraphy,  The wife of my teacher immediately told me that she has trouble reading calligraphy, especially deciphering some letters.  She had trouble making sense of a lot of what she has seen.

 

So more proof that I really need to come up with my own variation and style of some sort of elegant writing.  Probably change what I have seen of Copperplate and cut back or get rid of the shading of Spencerian.

 

🙂

 

[Anne-Sophie]

French cursive is an easy version of Copperplate.

 

Below is the link to a whole thread about it on a subforum on the Fountain Pen Network.

 

 

[PhiloPlume]

  On 2/3/2025 at 10:34 AM, Anne-Sophie said:

French cursive is an easy version of Copperplate.

 

Below is the link to a whole thread about it on a subforum on the Fountain Pen Network.

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Never heard of it!  Sounds promising!  Thanks!!