Very quickly getting hooked... not sure of the next step

[BJ Backitis]

Many years ago I was given a Waterman fountain pen (medium nib) which I used on occasion (after having to clean out the dried ink first), and over the years picked up a couple of cheapo Cross fountain pens to play around with (hated the ink in those cartridges and the converters for them were a disaster).  I finally decided to step up my game a bit (as a Notary Public I wanted to use a fountain pen I could trust) and recently picked up a Hongdian 1861 and a Lamy Safari, both with fine nibs (plus ink converter for the Lamy).

 

The Hongdian 1861 is okay, I guess... not happy with the ink flow (Noodler's Ink Brevity Black).  That Lamy Safari... NOW we're talking.  Got it in Red to use with my Noodler's Empire Red ink, and that sucker writes like a dream!!  The Waterman has blue ink in it (Noodler's 54th Massachusetts) but the medium nib is too heavy for my writing.  So I'm looking for a nicer (but still "budget") pen to use for my black ink notary work, then eventually another for the blue ink, both with fine nibs.  

 

Looking at a TWSBI Eco but I don't think it has quite the right visual "vibe" I'm looking for as a Notary... also looking at the Pilot Metropolitan.

 

Any recommendations would be greatly appreciated!!

[Sailor Kenshin]

I'm not familiar with the HongDian pen, but not all inks play well in all pens.  You might try a Waterman ink, or Monteverde, for the black and give that pen another go.

The Pilot Metropolitan's included black ink cart (eminently refillable) will give you a fine black line, even with the Medium nib.

 

Get some ink samples and welcome aboard.

[misterunix]

Hi,

I wish I could tell you which pen, but pilot metro is a heavy thinner pen that has a squeeze converter. You can get a pilot kakuno with an extra fine nib to swap to the metro, to get those extra thin lines.

 

Personally, I have several Jinhao 9019 from extra fine to medium. I like its bigger size; it fits my hand very well for long writing sessions, which I do every day. I would push you towards a Jinhao X-159 with an extra fine nib. It's a solid, heavy pen, comes with a converter. Buy it from a solid vender and not alibaba or temu. You could be getting a knock off that will never write well.

 

One of my metros is my daily carry. Being brass, it can take a beating. I always have one of my metros inked, and all my Jinhaos are inked all the time.

[misterunix]

2 minutes ago, Sailor Kenshin said:

Get some ink samples and welcome aboard.

I agree 100%. 

Try other brands besides noodlers. I like diamine and monteverde as well.

[fountain_new]

Welcome, I'm very new to the whole thing myself. Looking forward to hearing from you.

[Maurizio]

I am a Pilot fan and have several of their gold-nibbed pens (8) all of which I like. 

 

However, as you have already encountered with your Lamy, fountain pens with steel nibs - decent ones like Lamy - can provide a very satisfying fountain pen experience. Enjoyment of, and satisfaction with, fountain pens is a very subjective thing. One person’s moderate flowing nib is another’s too dry nib. Satisfaction with a fountain pen depends upon a confluence of factors including the nib, the ink, and the paper. Read up around here about those things.

 

You’ve already achieved some satisfaction with your fine-nibbed Lamy and are looking for more. As a reasonably experienced fountain pen user, let me suggest that you try some Pilots. A Metropolitan is a decent pen, though some consider it a bit heavy, while others like its brass-bodied heft. I recommend you try it in a medium nib. As a general rule, Japanese nibs run an increment finer than European nibs so that a Japanese medium is closely equivalent to a European fine like you have on your Lamy. 

 

I also recommend that you try a Pilot Kakuno. These have the same nib as found on the Metropolitan, but, since the bodies are plastic, cost roughly half the price of a Metropolitan. You can buy a Kakuno in both a medium and a fine nib for roughly the price of one Metropolitan and decide for yourself if you like the finer (and less wet) line produced by a Japanese fine nib or not. I have 3 of them ( 2 medium, 1 fine) and use them to put permanent black inks into such a Platinum Carbon Black for sketching that I don’t want to put into my gold-nibbed pens. Of course you have to get Con-40 converters for the Kakuno to use bottled ink; another cool thing about the Kakuno is that it accepts the excellent and larger capacity Pilot Con-70 pump converter. 

 

I also have a couple of TWISBI Echo’s and have had good luck with them. 

 

For inks, yes get some ink samples, and read around in the ink forums for some suggestions. Very generally, Pelikan and Waterman are non-problematic inks. Try some of the plethora of Diamine Inks, and the inexpensive standard Pilot inks (black, blue, red), and, of course the (more expensive) Pilot Iroshizuku inks are excellent. 

 

Keep exploring and have fun. 

[torstar]

Welcome!

 

If there are stores carrying pens near you, plan a visit and have a chat and they will gladly help you on your next purchase.

 

For some reason they open and keep afloat in Toronto, not sure how these days, but grateful. 

 

Things can get out of hand though.... my big spender phase was 20 years ago and now I enjoy the pens that were a bit outside my budget.

 

 

[langere]

I recommend a Pelikan, either a 200 or a 400.  For me, they shout "Notary" - nice, stolid colors and good-flowing nibs.  Also, if you like piston fillers, the ink will last a while.

 

The nibs run a bit broader than the Japanese ones.

 

Erick

[BJ Backitis]

Thanks to everyone for those responses and ideas!!  Will definitely be trying those out.  I was able to get the Hongdian pen working quite nicely, the ink flow was poor due to the slit between tines being too tight.  Now I'm quite happy with it, but still want to get something with the visual pop that screams "legal professionalism" 😀

 

Unfortunately, I live about 40 miles from even an Office Depot or Staples, so Amazon is my friend when it comes to getting these supplies.  I checked Hobby Lobby but was rather disappointed there as well (for many reasons).  But I'm pretty sure a Pilot Metro is the next to be acquired, and I'll put a couple other options on my wish list for any gift-giving (-getting) opportunities that may arise.

[FarmBoy]

Acquire a Parker 51. 

[Sailor Kenshin]

10 hours ago, BJ Backitis said:

Thanks to everyone for those responses and ideas!!  Will definitely be trying those out.  I was able to get the Hongdian pen working quite nicely, the ink flow was poor due to the slit between tines being too tight.  Now I'm quite happy with it, but still want to get something with the visual pop that screams "legal professionalism" 😀

 

Unfortunately, I live about 40 miles from even an Office Depot or Staples, so Amazon is my friend when it comes to getting these supplies.  I checked Hobby Lobby but was rather disappointed there as well (for many reasons).  But I'm pretty sure a Pilot Metro is the next to be acquired, and I'll put a couple other options on my wish list for any gift-giving (-getting) opportunities that may arise.

The Metro does come in boardroom black.  😉

[jvr]

Be careful. Before you know it, you go from a Lamy Safari (which I don’t like) to a pen costing way too much. 
 

Don’t know about notary public pens, but lawyers seem to prefer sharpies and the like. Fountain pen ink isn’t waterproof, generally speaking, so not a good choice for official docs.

[BJ Backitis]

22 hours ago, jvr said:

Be careful. Before you know it, you go from a Lamy Safari (which I don’t like) to a pen costing way too much. 
 

Don’t know about notary public pens, but lawyers seem to prefer sharpies and the like. Fountain pen ink isn’t waterproof, generally speaking, so not a good choice for official docs.

 

I've researched the inks for water resistance, forge resistance, etc, And this is really just for a little showmanship than anything else (my business card logo features a fountain pen nib, and I was getting asked why I don't use one!).   As for the warning on spending too much, my wife and CFO won't let that happen.

[Arkanabar]

I like to have more information before I make recommendations.  So, if you're willing:  What other kinds of pens do you like, and why?  Do you prefer pens with thick grips, or slim grips?  Lighter?  Heavier?  We already know you like a more dignified and serious appearance, and a narrow line.

 

As others have said, different inks will change the behavior of pens.  Samples are the best way to find the inks you like.  I have used some Noodler's, some Diamine, some Pelikan, some J. Herbin, Waterman, Sheaffer's, Parker, and Pilot and Iroshizuku.  It's not just each brand that is different, but each color in each brand (especially when it comes to Noodler's, Diamine, and Private Reserve).  

 

Paper will affect ink performance, too.  You may need to find an ink that limits feathering, depending on how much recycled content is in the paper you're working with.

[welch]

On 3/6/2024 at 6:25 AM, FarmBoy said:

Acquire a Parker 51. [Welch comment: original vacumatic or aerometric versions, I suspect]

 

Or the Parker 45. The 45 nib unit unscrews, so you can buy a variety of nibs. They last forever. They were designed so that each part could be swapped with a similar part from another 45, so even if a part breaks, you can easily replace it. Note that any Parker converter or cartridge will fit the 45.

 

I bought a P-45 for about $25 that is just like the one I had in junior high school in 1960.

 

FarmBoy is trying to lure you toward the best fountain pen ever made, and one that sells second-hand for roughly $100 - $175 refurbished. The aerometric Parker 51 usually works right off the bat...just flush with plain water. Most US-made 51s were made with a fine nib. 

 

For details on both the Parker 51 and the Parker 45, see https://parkerpens.net/

[inkstainedruth]

I've found Parker 51s in the wild for WAY less money than what welch has said.  Even with repairs on some of the 51 Vacs they didn't cost me as much as the prices he's citing.  The most I ever paid was about $120 US a few years ago at an auction at a pen show for a Navy Grey Aero with an OB nib.  And as little as $2 for a Forest Green Aero (plus another twenty bucks for some nib work).  

Admittedly, I got lucky, and it was also a few years ago at this point, but deals can happen if you keep looking for them.

But Parker 45s are also a good option, and have the advantage that they take various Parker converters (my first semi-vintage pen was a 45 that was also my first pen with a 14K nib, and it's a LOVELY writer -- that M nib on it?  With the right ink it's like dancing on ice across the page.  I suspect that if the OP is a Notary, a 45 will look sufficiently "professional" if you get a black or burgundy one (although, admittedly, I'd dearly love to get a bright pink one someday... ).

And the nice thing about 45s is that it's really easy to swap the nib units between pens (although I'm not sure how much it would set the OP back for an Accountant nib...).

Ruth Morrisson aka inkstainedruth

[FarmBoy]

2 hours ago, inkstainedruth said:

I've found Parker 51s in the wild for WAY less money than what welch has said.  Even with repairs on some of the 51 Vacs they didn't cost me as much as the prices he's citing.  The most I ever paid was about $120 US a few years ago at an auction at a pen show for a Navy Grey Aero with an OB nib.  And as little as $2 for a Forest Green Aero (plus another twenty bucks for some nib work).  

Admittedly, I got lucky, and it was also a few years ago at this point, but deals can happen if you keep looking for them.

But Parker 45s are also a good option, and have the advantage that they take various Parker converters (my first semi-vintage pen was a 45 that was also my first pen with a 14K nib, and it's a LOVELY writer -- that M nib on it?  With the right ink it's like dancing on ice across the page.  I suspect that if the OP is a Notary, a 45 will look sufficiently "professional" if you get a black or burgundy one (although, admittedly, I'd dearly love to get a bright pink one someday... ).

And the nice thing about 45s is that it's really easy to swap the nib units between pens (although I'm not sure how much it would set the OP back for an Accountant nib...).

Ruth Morrisson aka inkstainedruth

I once heard of someone here finding a Pkum for a few bucks. Apparently it happens. 

[inkstainedruth]

Yeah, a number of years ago someone snagged a full-size Plum on eBay for just over HALF what I'd paid for my Plum Demi (and I thought I'd done really well price-wise -- it never even hit my intermediate maximum bid); apparently I had a really good poker face on that auction....

And the worst part?  I'd seen that listing and since the header for the listing said the pen was black, I never gave it a second thought....  Or, a second look, for that matter.... 

Met the buyer at a pen show a few years ago after he overheard me tell the story to one of the venders, and we had a good laugh over it.  Especially since the same weekend I'd put the minimum bid on a black 51 Vac, jus to get the ball rolling, and (because it turned out to have the cap for a 51 Special on it) nobody ELSE bid on it....   

Ruth Morrisson aka inkstainedruth

[BJ Backitis]

On 3/7/2024 at 9:09 PM, Arkanabar said:

I like to have more information before I make recommendations.  So, if you're willing:  What other kinds of pens do you like, and why?  Do you prefer pens with thick grips, or slim grips?  Lighter?  Heavier?  We already know you like a more dignified and serious appearance, and a narrow line.

 

 

Well, as I'm kind of starting out it's hard to say what preferences I have... not much experience with various types to know the differences.  Just looking and measuring other pens that feel good in the hand, I'd say a grip that's not too thin (my Waterman is about 3/8" wide at the grip and I wouldn't want anything smaller).  As this isn't for long periods of writing weight isn't as much of a concern, but I do like posting the cap and wouldn't want the balance thrown off by that. 

 

Again, and I'm trying to be as honest here as possible, my "weighting" scale is 50% for professional appearance, 40% for writing performance, and 10%for "feel/comfort"  while staying in the $30-80 (USD) price range.  And, as you also said, the ink has an impact on the performance as well, so working well with the Noodler's BulletProof Black (ND-19001) and BulletProof 54th Massachusetts blue (ND-19071) will factor in on that part of it.

 

I hope that helps in any recommendations you would be willing to offer, which I will greatly appreciate reading!!!

[Penguincollector]

   Have you considered a Lamy Studio? They use the same nibs as the Safari, so if you like the writing experience, then the appearance will be a bit more professional while still being familiar. Some people don’t like the metal section. I don’t mind them, but I don’t have sweaty hands. You can upgrade the nib to a gold one (you can also fit these on a Safari) in the future, if you really like it; Endless Pens carries them for much less than other retailers. Amazon carries the Studio.