MaJohn P138 - MontJohn Lorenzo

[OCArt]

Yes, Reddit user dhdhehdndkd posted this image of the pen "antiqued" with black acrylic paint

 

1 hour ago, Dan Carmell said:

No idea about ink capacity! I saw someone on Reddit’s FP forum had ‘antiqued’ the silver portions and I liked that look. 

 

[Dan Carmell]

10 hours ago, OCArt said:

Yes, Reddit user dhdhehdndkd posted this image of the pen "antiqued" with black acrylic paint

 

 

That was it!

[SLinkster]

On 3/4/2024 at 6:50 AM, SLinkster said:

What's the actual ink capacity? 

 

I can answer my own question. This morning before work I flushed my P138 and took the opportunity to measure the water from the rinse: a very scant 1ml. 

 

Guess I wish I had ordered the EF instead of the F - each fill would maybe go farther 😄

[Dan Carmell]

4 hours ago, SLinkster said:

 

I can answer my own question. This morning before work I flushed my P138 and took the opportunity to measure the water from the rinse: a very scant 1ml. 

 

Guess I wish I had ordered the EF instead of the F - each fill would maybe go farther 😄

Someone from this forum was finding they needed to re-set the piston on their piston fillers because they weren’t adjusted to fill as fully as they could be. I think that was @A Smug Dill and maybe he will comment on that, but whoever it was, he was pulling the mechanism out and adjusting it to fill more completely. As I remember, he showed very clearly the problem and solution. I’m wondering if that’s the case with the P138 because it certainly could hold more than 1 mm. 

[A Smug Dill]

41 minutes ago, Dan Carmell said:

Someone from this forum was finding they needed to re-set the piston on their piston fillers because they weren’t adjusted to fill as fully as they could be. I think that was @A Smug Dill and maybe he will comment on that,

 

Well, I didn't need to reseat the pistons in my HongDian, PenBBS, and now also Admok piston-filler models, just to make them work operationally and functionally as described. A piston-filler with a disappointingly or annoyingly low ink capacity is still objectively a piston-filler, as long as the manufacturer and/or retail did not ‘promise’ a specific minimum ink capacity in published product specifications. Not fully exploiting the potential of a product's hardware cannot be reasonably considered a defect in itself, including when the user and/or paying customer knows they aren't getting as much ‘value’ out of the asking price they paid for an item, when he/she sees or hears of fellow customers managing to tease more out of other units of the same product model.

 

55 minutes ago, Dan Carmell said:

As I remember, he showed very clearly the problem and solution.

 

I showed the ‘before‘ and ‘after‘ photos of one particular instance of such physical adjustment, as illustration of the why (as well as the result one could aim for), should he/she be discontented with the ink capacity of the pen as delivered on account of the length of the pen showing more promise than that. The description I gave of the solution procedurally was in text.

[SLinkster]

I successfully did this with my asvine p136, though it did take me a little fiddling. Might not do the same with this P138, at least not any time soon. 

[MisterSheaffer]

4 hours ago, Dan Carmell said:

Someone from this forum was finding they needed to re-set the piston on their piston fillers because they weren’t adjusted to fill as fully as they could be. I think that was @A Smug Dill and maybe he will comment on that, but whoever it was, he was pulling the mechanism out and adjusting it to fill more completely. As I remember, he showed very clearly the problem and solution. I’m wondering if that’s the case with the P138 because it certainly could hold more than 1 mm. 

Is it possible that the pen isn't a true piston filler with the ink filling into the barrel?  Perhaps a converter is glued in there to mimic a piston filling system? 

Similar to the Majohn F9? 

 

I would like to purchase this pen but I am waiting for someone to post a disassembly review of it first.

[Dan Carmell]

7 hours ago, A Smug Dill said:

 

Well, I didn't need to reseat the pistons in my HongDian, PenBBS, and now also Admok piston-filler models, just to make them work operationally and functionally as described. A piston-filler with a disappointingly or annoyingly low ink capacity is still objectively a piston-filler, as long as the manufacturer and/or retail did not ‘promise’ a specific minimum ink capacity in published product specifications. Not fully exploiting the potential of a product's hardware cannot be reasonably considered a defect in itself, including when the user and/or paying customer knows they aren't getting as much ‘value’ out of the asking price they paid for an item, when he/she sees or hears of fellow customers managing to tease more out of other units of the same product model.

 

 

I showed the ‘before‘ and ‘after‘ photos of one particular instance of such physical adjustment, as illustration of the why (as well as the result one could aim for), should he/she be discontented with the ink capacity of the pen as delivered on account of the length of the pen showing more promise than that. The description I gave of the solution procedurally was in text.

Well, “need” in this hobby is pretty subjective anyway. I have some of the pens you mentioned adjusting and I didn’t feel the need to adjust mine because I no longer need a well filled pen because I’m retired and my writing happens at home, while you do quite a bit of professional writing, if I remember correctly.

 

I am a bit of a dunce about mechanical things, so when I do understand something, I give big props to the author. (I trained as a technical writer but never worked as such. I did learn that writing straightforward descriptions and processes takes some care and effort.)

[Dan Carmell]

4 hours ago, MisterSheaffer said:

Is it possible that the pen isn't a true piston filler with the ink filling into the barrel?  Perhaps a converter is glued in there to mimic a piston filling system? 

Similar to the Majohn F9? 

 

I would like to purchase this pen but I am waiting for someone to post a disassembly review of it first.

Well, I wondered that as I filled them and then forgot about it. So I used that handy Asvine multi-tool (although it didn’t quite fit) and confirmed your suspicion, it’s a captive converter. Oh well. Saved you and probably most people on the fence about this pen some dollars toward the NEXT pen 😝 

[MisterSheaffer]

3 minutes ago, Dan Carmell said:

Well, I wondered that as I filled them and then forgot about it. So I used that handy Asvine multi-tool (although it didn’t quite fit) and confirmed your suspicion, it’s a captive converter. Oh well. Saved you and probably most people on the fence about this pen some dollars toward the NEXT pen 😝 

Thank you! That's a bummer because it's a nice looking pen. 

[SLinkster]

3 minutes ago, Dan Carmell said:

Well, I wondered that as I filled them and then forgot about it. So I used that handy Asvine multi-tool (although it didn’t quite fit) and confirmed your suspicion, it’s a captive converter. Oh well. Saved you and probably most people on the fence about this pen some dollars toward the NEXT pen 😝 

 

Ok, that's disturbing. I guess technically t that is a piston filler, but...

 

I'll be getting in AliExpress's customer service tomorrow about a refund. 

[Ron Z]

It's just joined the ranks of a bunch of very expensive pens, using the same filler system -only at a price of $37 or so on Ebay instead of 10 times that amount.... or more.

 

3/9 - read on.  It isn't a captive converter pen. 

[Dan Carmell]

30 minutes ago, Ron Z said:

It's just joined the ranks of a bunch of very expensive pens, using the same filler system -only at a price of $37 or so on Ebay instead of 10 times that amount.... or more.

It’s become quite common then, huh? You’d know!

[Ron Z]

I've seen captive converters in a number of pens, and not just a couple that were glued together so you couldn't open the pen.  At least you can open up the 138 and replace the converter.

 

I've always admired the faceted silver pens, but the Lorenzo de Medici is out of range for a pen mechanic.  So I bought the p138 and like it - but looking in the nib end on mine, the piston seal seems to be a lot bigger than with a captive converter, no narrow neck like you get with a converter, so I wonder.  I tried my MB tool, but it doesn't fit.  ...and the thread bushing is tight.  Is it right hand (MB) or left hand (Pelikan) threaded?  It looks right hand in the picture above.

 

We'll see how the pen holds up long term, but for a $37 pen (Ebay, shippied), it seems to be well made.  The clip grips very firmly, 0-rings on the nib unit (silicone) not bubblegum to seal the nib, and the cap and barrel line up when posted - just a bit off when closed.  A Bock or Jowo nib will go into the nib housing if you want to put one in, not that the Moonman nib are bad.  You will need to knock the nib out rather than pull to swap nibs. 

[Dan Carmell]

5 minutes ago, Ron Z said:

I've seen captive converters in a number of pens, and not just a couple that were glued together so you couldn't open the pen.  At least you can open up the 138 and replace the converter.

 

I've always admired the faceted silver pens, but the Lorenzo de Medici is out of range for a pen mechanic.  So I bought the p138 and like it - but looking in the nib end on mine, the piston seal seems to be a lot bigger than with a captive converter, no narrow neck like you get with a converter, so I wonder.  I tried my MB tool, but it doesn't fit.  ...and the thread bushing is tight.  Is it right hand (MB) or left hand (Pelikan) threaded?  It looks right hand in the picture above.

 

We'll see how the pen holds up long term, but for a $37 pen (Ebay, shippied), it seems to be well made.  The clip grips very firmly, 0-rings on the nib unit (silicone) not bubblegum to seal the nib, and the cap and barrel line up when posted - just a bit off when closed.  A Bock or Jowo nib will go into the nib housing if you want to put one in, not that the Moonman nib are bad.  You will need to knock the nib out rather than pull to swap nibs. 

I could get one prong of the Asvine tool into one of the slots and turned it counterclockwise, so that’s left, correct? The converter tube seems so tiny inside the barrel. 
 

It’s a nice pen and a captive converter doesn’t put me off, though I guess I’d want to know in advance. I like the Moonman EFs, haven’t had a bad one yet. 
 

Did you get the model with the riveted clip? I like its looks but as a posted writer, the lighter-capped model works better for me. 

[Ron Z]

I did get the riveted clip, and had to adjust it a bit so that it is a bit looser.   Very tight.  I have a Supra, so a heavy pen works for me.  Actually, the pen rests on the web between thumb and index finger nicely, and is short enough that unlike a Rotring 600, doesn't seem to tilt backwards.  My aging hands seem to like fat pens better than skinny ones. 

[A Smug Dill]

I don't quite get the concern or trepidation about “captured converters”, not that I necessarily agree with the characterisation of such in specific pen models, on a case-by-case basis.

1. A metal pen barrel cannot be used directly as (the wall of) a pen's ink reservoir. A plastic tube that fits inside the metal barrel is required.
2. How tightly that plastic tube fits (or is moulded) against the interior of the metal barrel does not change the (both technically and otherwise correct) description of the filling mechanism for the pen's reservoir. The volume of the plastic tube's cavity is likewise irrelevant to the filling mechanism.
3. Especially if you cannot remove the blind cap (such as in a Leonardo Momento Zero or Delta Sea Wood) to expose the end of a separate piston driver handle that can be justly characterised as part of a converter that is otherwise replaceable, in what way does a reservoir that isn't permanent fixed against the walls of the pen's barrel warrants the description of “captured converter”? I remember, specifically in the case of Santini Italia pen models, that some folks levelled accusations that those pens used captured converters and are not real piston-fillers. But what's inside those pens are Schmidt KFH450 units, which are not mere Schmidt converters taking the place of a replaceable cartridge as the ink reservoir but somehow affixed in place such that the user cannot detach it.

[Dan Carmell]

The only type of captive converter I actually dislike are those with a literal converter knob sticking out of the barrel when the blind cap is removed. I guess I do share the somewhat widespread prejudice against them, the notion that they are inferior and a cheat of sorts, but I own several (maybe more than I know!) and haven’t had problems with them.

[AceNinja]

On 3/7/2024 at 6:16 AM, Dan Carmell said:

confirmed your suspicion, it’s a captive converter.

Hi, may I know how does this photo shows that it's a captured converter? am I missing/mislook some feature?

[A Smug Dill]

7 minutes ago, AceNinja said:

Hi, may I know how does this photo shows that it's a captured converter? am I missing/mislook some feature?

 

In the absence of an upvote button, I just want to let you know I appreciate your asking the question. 👍🏼