Pilot Custom 823 lubrication advice

[Asteris]

Hello, I'm planning to purchase a Pilot Custom 823 and while searching on how to clean and maintain the O rings, I saw lots of warnings on how even unscrewing the piston assembly once, with the right tool, can result in the barrel cracking (and ofc loosing the warranty). Is there any way to lubricate the O ring without this risk? Is lubricating the ring even necessary?

[langere]

Best is not to unscrew the piston assembly.  If you are cleaning the pen, just rinse out the ink from the reservoir.  That is enough.  Anything more is asking for unnecessary trouble.  

 

Keep in mind that the 823 was not made to be disassembled frequently.  

 

It's an amazing pen!  I've had mine since 2007.  No problems yet.

 

Erick

[arcfide]

My personal recommendation is to stick with Pilot's own recommendations. The best overall experience with the pen itself, IMO, comes from using the standard 70ml Pilot ink bottles with their reservoir specifically meant for the 823's vacuum filling system. 

 

Overcleaning your pens is a real thing in this hobby. Over a very long time, it may become necessary to do maintenance on an 823, but at that point, just sending it off to Pilot for a bit of a tune up would be fine. I wouldn't expect the need to do that more than once every 5 years under heavy use. 

 

The heaviest user I know of for 823's is Neil Gaiman, and he only had to send one 823 in to Pilot for a tune up once, because of either the seals or something like that (maybe a part breakage?), and he's used those things way more than most people do. 

 

In short, the 823 is basically maintenance free for all intents and purposes outside of simply flushing the pen with water when appropriate (every few months or when changing ink color), if you're using safe, standard, dye-based inks. 

[TMLee]

5 hours ago, Asteris said:

Hello, I'm planning to purchase a Pilot Custom 823 and while searching on how to clean and maintain the O rings, I saw lots of warnings on how even unscrewing the piston assembly once, with the right tool, can result in the barrel cracking (and ofc loosing the warranty). Is there any way to lubricate the O ring without this risk? Is lubricating the ring even necessary?

 

For whatever reason you need to lubricate the rubber piston to glide better, put sparingly that silicon grease that TWSBI supplies with their pen models that have similar rubber pistons.

 

[fabri00]

Fountain pens should not be disassembled unless a repair is needed.

[Asteris]

7 hours ago, TMLee said:

 

For whatever reason you need to lubricate the rubber piston to glide better, put sparingly that silicon grease that TWSBI supplies with their pen models that have similar rubber pistons.

 

Thanks for the answer! Is Parker Quink blue ok for the pen, since it's the ink I can find the easiest in my country? Or it's too "lowly" for a pen of this level?

[Asteris]

8 hours ago, arcfide said:

My personal recommendation is to stick with Pilot's own recommendations. The best overall experience with the pen itself, IMO, comes from using the standard 70ml Pilot ink bottles with their reservoir specifically meant for the 823's vacuum filling system. 

 

Overcleaning your pens is a real thing in this hobby. Over a very long time, it may become necessary to do maintenance on an 823, but at that point, just sending it off to Pilot for a bit of a tune up would be fine. I wouldn't expect the need to do that more than once every 5 years under heavy use. 

 

The heaviest user I know of for 823's is Neil Gaiman, and he only had to send one 823 in to Pilot for a tune up once, because of either the seals or something like that (maybe a part breakage?), and he's used those things way more than most people do. 

 

In short, the 823 is basically maintenance free for all intents and purposes outside of simply flushing the pen with water when appropriate (every few months or when changing ink color), if you're using safe, standard, dye-based inks. 

Also do I still have the warranty if I buy it from a 'non- official' retailer? There are no official Pilot stores in my place.

[Asteris]

9 hours ago, langere said:

Best is not to unscrew the piston assembly.  If you are cleaning the pen, just rinse out the ink from the reservoir.  That is enough.  Anything more is asking for unnecessary trouble.  

 

Keep in mind that the 823 was not made to be disassembled frequently.  

 

It's an amazing pen!  I've had mine since 2007.  No problems yet.

 

Erick

Do you have the medium nib? I've heard that the medium nib writes like a European medium and not a fine. The only other Pilot pen that I have is the metro in medium and I'm satisfied by its line width.

[khalev]

I have an 823 where the piston rod began to seize up to the point where I was having to apply considerable force to move it. In this case, it was necessary to lubricate the pen for it to be useful. The section on mine is glued in place, but using a size 7 wrench on the back allowed me to unscrew that assembly and use a tooth pick to apply some silicon grease to the barrel. I hand tightened the piston rod assembly back into place and the pen is working again. It did not crack. I am not sure why there is such negativity in this thread about servicing this pen... once the o-ring dries up you have to really bear down on the rod, which produces a hazard when you are applying that much force over an ink bottle. This is a pen that requires occasional lubrication (in my experience, at least once in the five years that I've had it).

[markofp]

I have disassembled every 823 I have ever had, in fact when I get one new before I even ink it I use a TWSBI wrench to unscrew the piston so that I can remove the conical plug at the tip. This allows the pen to keep writing without having to unscrew the end. I have also removed the pistons to relube them and I have never once cracked a barrel. But last year I sent one down to Jacksonville to have the nib replaced and THEY wound up cracking one to the point they had to send me a new pen. So it does happen . . . 

[Asteris]

1 hour ago, markofp said:

I have disassembled every 823 I have ever had, in fact when I get one new before I even ink it I use a TWSBI wrench to unscrew the piston so that I can remove the conical plug at the tip. This allows the pen to keep writing without having to unscrew the end. I have also removed the pistons to relube them and I have never once cracked a barrel. But last year I sent one down to Jacksonville to have the nib replaced and THEY wound up cracking one to the point they had to send me a new pen. So it does happen . . . 

Thanks for your answer. Is the back end glued and screwed in, like the grip section, or just screwed in?

[markofp]

Screwed in.

[langere]

8 hours ago, Asteris said:

Do you have the medium nib? I've heard that the medium nib writes like a European medium and not a fine. The only other Pilot pen that I have is the metro in medium and I'm satisfied by its line width.

I have a medium.  And yes, it writes more like a European medium.

 

Erick

[arcfide]

I think the tendency is to play too much with assembling and disassembling pens, and so I push for the opposite. 

 

But...I do think that we have a wide variety of inks and the like these days, and I have seen in some other pens that some inks are more likely to be less "lubricating" in the pen itself than others, and I've noticed that some converters will become harder to twist under the influence of some inks. However, after using more standard inks with appropriate lubrication, I have had them return to a nice, free-turning state. 

 

If you use inks that might accelerate piston wear or reduce lubrication in the pen itself you may need to service the pen more often. If you want to modify the function of the pen, as some above do, then you will obviously need to service the pen. In both cases, I consider this what might be termed "extraordinary" use. Common, yes, but outside the design boundaries of the pen, and thus subject to potential increases in maintenance and wear requirements. 

 

Because of the potential for cracking, Pilot obviously prefers to have those pens sent in for service if they need that, and you can obviously do it yourself, but with any pens, it's clear that user-servicing the pens can increase the likelihood of damage by quite a bit, and not just on the 823 (other brands suffer the same fate). So, to be safe, it's always easier to have the manufacturer do that servicing if you can. 

 

Servicing the pens yourself is a great thing to learn, but I think you have to be willing to take on the risk and also would probably benefit a lot from putting in the time to really learn how to do it with the least risk. For instance, many people don't realize that sometimes these pens are designed to be assembled or disassembled with certain amounts of heat, humidity, or torque values in a very narrow range. Some of the Japanese pens, for instance, have plastic feeds that are heat set with steam, which is not something that most people are prepared to do. There are often specific tools and jigs that the companies have arranged so that servicing them can be done in a very reliable manner. 

[TMLee]

11 hours ago, Asteris said:

Thanks for the answer! Is Parker Quink blue ok for the pen, since it's the ink I can find the easiest in my country? Or it's too "lowly" for a pen of this level?

PARKER Quink blue inks are OK , ie, well behaved , ie, unlike some inks which have more complex formulas, and or dyes.  I have good experiences with PILOT iroshizuku inks, i think they are very good inks, ie don't mess up my FPs terribly especially after long periods of dis-use.  You can read up on inks in the sub forums here  , very knowledgeable folks there. 

[TMLee]

11 hours ago, Asteris said:

Do you have the medium nib? I've heard that the medium nib writes like a European medium and not a fine. The only other Pilot pen that I have is the metro in medium and I'm satisfied by its line width.

the PILOT Metropolitan is a size #5 steel nib.

the 823 is a large size #15 gold nib. 
its different ( huge difference) .

 

Depending on how heavy your hand is , ie, you exert heavy pressure when writing, or a very light hand, your nib stroke widths will be directly impacted, especially when the nib is softer, ie, springy, which the 823 is. Its 14K gold and its larger size allows it to be less rigid, just compare with your Metro. 
 

so you are likely to experience some difference between your pens even tho both may be <M> . 
 

IIRC,  the 823 has cracking complaints. The cracking commonly occurs at that grip section. It seems to be thin and when overtighten, it naturally gives way and cracks. I don't know why PILOT don't seem to rectify this. ☹️
 

i have 2 , one of them is cracked ( very very fine) in its section. I cant remember how now. Whether i bought it cracked or i damaged it myself. 😩
 

like many owners, the 823 remains one of my fave writers. 👍
my guess is the successful combo of 

 - ergonomics , the shape , its weight, size 

- nib design , the size, flex ie, responsiveness to writing pressure

( so even when you swap out the nibs to say a <SU> or < FA>  , you find that the pen still writes very well in your hand )

enjoy your 823. Its a worthy purchase. 
it will sell easily as well, if you wish to part with it. 
🤭

 

 

[TMLee]

 

 

[Asteris]

On 2/6/2024 at 1:36 AM, TMLee said:

PARKER Quink blue inks are OK , ie, well behaved , ie, unlike some inks which have more complex formulas, and or dyes.  I have good experiences with PILOT iroshizuku inks, i think they are very good inks, ie don't mess up my FPs terribly especially after long periods of dis-use.  You can read up on inks in the sub forums here  , very knowledgeable folks there. 

Thanks for your answer. I'm thinking of getting a bottle of Pilot ama-iro. I've searched in the ink forums for suitable ink and looks like the Pilot iroshizuku and washable Parker inks are friendly enough for these kind of pens.

[The Elevator]

On 2/5/2024 at 4:18 AM, fabri00 said:

Fountain pens should not be disassembled unless a repair is needed.

In general this is true. However, I do recommend that you should disassemble *before* using in certain cases. I’ve had multiple TWSBI diamond series pens come to me with their nib sections or piston ends tighter than a car tire’s lug nut (ok not literally, but tight to the point that I was worried).

 

I suspect this is the reason that a lot of TWSBI pens end up cracked. 
 

Now, I do trust Pilot to stand behind their warranty more than TWSBI, so if I bought an 823, I wouldn’t disassemble it unless I first sent it to Pilot and they couldn’t fix it for whatever reason.

side question: 

Oddly enough though, Jetpens says the TWSBI 580 has more ink capacity than the 823. (1.2 mL vs 1.8) can someone confirm or deny this? If this is true, what’s the appeal of getting an 823 over the 1.1 mL Con-70 fill available in the 743 or the 912? 

[arcfide]

5 hours ago, The Elevator said:

If this is true, what’s the appeal of getting an 823 over the 1.1 mL Con-70 fill available in the 743 or the 912? 

 

I don't think it's true. I think the 823 has something along the lines of 2.2 or 2.5ml capacity in general.