Parker in 2024

[75-FP]

13 hours ago, Heinkle said:

A really interesting contribution to the thread.

 

I sometimes imagine what could be made of the Parker brand with the right buyout. For example (and many may disagree), creating a Duofold Centennial “Grande”, which would be a Centennial closer in size to a Pelikan M1000 or a 149. Oversized pens are in fashion and if we’re honest, they need a jump start because no mainstream fountain pen influencers are talking about Parker.

 

Look at the buzz around Montblanc’s 100th anniversary compared to the muted (overpriced) Parker release in 2021.
 

In any case, Newell must be making money from Parker as a corporate cost code, so wouldn’t sell. And you’re right that anyone with the resources to complete a takeover would similarly treat the brand as a cash cow to justify the investment.

I too have had pen business magnate daydreams about doing just the same. I would buy Waterman and some other of Newell's "brands" too, take them completely private and just focus on making good products at a reasonable profit. Unfortunately I am short of actually fulfilling this dream by several hundred million dollars.

 

My feeling is that when Parker was indeed headquartered/managed in the UK they had a better sense of what their markets wanted as a whole. This meant selling pens appealing to both the mass public as well as offering special, limited edition pens to collectors. I would cite the reissue of the 51 from the early 2000's as well as several special edition Duofold's as examples of this. On a whole I can't imagine the former US Parker operation would have come up with a pens like the Sonnet and modern Duofold in the first place. By the time they sold off the pen business I think they had really lost their focus on the pens business among some other issues. I see definite opportunity for low volume, high margin, special edition pens Newell is completely missing out on as you mentioned. Imagine a proper 51 reissue or a reformulation of Penman Sapphire ink. 

[Heinkle]

5 hours ago, 75-FP said:

By the time they sold off the pen business I think they had really lost their focus on the pens business among some other issues.

is this when the management buy-out team sold to Gillette in 1993 or the subsequent sale to Newell in 2000?

[75-FP]

7 hours ago, Heinkle said:

is this when the management buy-out team sold to Gillette in 1993 or the subsequent sale to Newell in 2000?

Neither: I was referring to when the US based Parker sold the entire organization to the UK management buy-out team in 1986. Sorry for any confusion on that one. I should mention I have spent an absurd amount of time researching the Parker company and so have a lot of thoughts about their history. To expand upon my point I feel like Parker as a US owned/managed organization started to struggle in the 1970's for a lot of reasons. Some of the reasons: outdated equipment, poor labor relations, a strong dollar, distracting non-pen related businesses, competition with lower priced ballpoint pens, etc. and just ran out of steam by the 80's. On the flip side the UK team really seemed to have been genuinely profitable and had a better grasp on their market. 

[Heinkle]

3 hours ago, 75-FP said:

On the flip side the UK team really seemed to have been genuinely profitable and had a better grasp on their market. 

 

i wonder why they sold to Gillette so (relatively) soon after taking over - 7 years? Maybe a "too good to say no" offer? They were presumably doing well enough commercially to attract interest. 

 

In any case, Newell will have owned Parker for 25 years next year, and I think most would agree it's been a downward trend for the brand (even if bottom-end sales are strong).

[75-FP]

6 hours ago, Heinkle said:

 

i wonder why they sold to Gillette so (relatively) soon after taking over - 7 years? Maybe a "too good to say no" offer? They were presumably doing well enough commercially to attract interest. 

 

In any case, Newell will have owned Parker for 25 years next year, and I think most would agree it's been a downward trend for the brand (even if bottom-end sales are strong).

 

I will quote from Tony FischIer's excellent Parker Penography website:

 

The Parker company in the US bought Manpower in 1976 a venture that proved very successful, generating a lot more revenue than the pen division. A strong dollar and 75% of all Parker pens sold abroad, the Americans decided to sell the writing Instrument division. A group of directors for Parker in the UK decided to try a takeover. They initially went for the European Operations but this was turned down by Parker US. It was all or nothing, according to Malcolm Troak in his book Pen to Paper. Venture capital was obtained and the takeover took place in january 1986 but venture capitalists as major shareholders weren't really an option in the long run.

uring the six years Parker had been run from the UK they had turned the business from losing money into making money. In the spring of 1993 Parker was sold to Gillette in Boston, who also owned Waterman. Gillette immediately began making changes and the Product developement and Design departments were moved to Boston. Gillette now owned two premium brands and had to decide which should be the leading brand. They decided on Waterman. In 1996 the French Parker factory in Merú, France, was closed down, integrated with the Waterman plant in Nantes. In 1999 the Janesville factory was shut down. In 2000 Parker was reorganised with new products, the much loved "Duck egg" logo was redesigned and both Parker and Waterman was sold again, this time to Newell Rubbermaid's stationary division, Sanford. In 2007 nearly 200 workers at Parker Newhaven was made redundant when Sanford moved production elsewhere, including China. Although the high-end models are still being produced in Newhaven.

[Beechwood]

By way of not very much, I had a terrible experience with Parker, I love their cheap pens, hate the expensive ones.

 

I had a new Sonnet, constant leaking into the cap caused by a loose gold ring on the section, sent it back explaining the problem. I had to pay postage both ways which was £10. Pen came back, still leaked, sent it to them again, another £10. this went on four times. Then a note came back that said, 'sorry, we cannot fix this'. Phoned them, I said there is a lifetime warranty, fix it or replace the faulty section, pen was under six months old. They refused. I  issued a summons for the Small Claims Court, their lawyer rang, 'what would you like us to do'. I felt like saying, 'Sort yourselves out, a summons should never be necessary for a company that depends on its reputation' They sent a new Sonnet, same bad design with the gold ring on the section that was liable to move when the cap was pulled off. Sold it, last premium Parker I ever owned.

 

It is said that the designer for the Sonnet was let go when the Sonnet was first issued and it was criticised so much and had  poor sales. He went to Sheaffer and learned from his mistakes to produce the Prelude, head and shoulders better than the Sonnet.

[Sheptonian]

6 hours ago, 75-FP said:

 

I will quote from Tony FischIer's excellent Parker Penography website:

 

The Parker company in the US bought Manpower in 1976 a venture that proved very successful, generating a lot more revenue than the pen division. A strong dollar and 75% of all Parker pens sold abroad, the Americans decided to sell the writing Instrument division. A group of directors for Parker in the UK decided to try a takeover. They initially went for the European Operations but this was turned down by Parker US. It was all or nothing, according to Malcolm Troak in his book Pen to Paper. Venture capital was obtained and the takeover took place in january 1986 but venture capitalists as major shareholders weren't really an option in the long run.

uring the six years Parker had been run from the UK they had turned the business from losing money into making money. In the spring of 1993 Parker was sold to Gillette in Boston, who also owned Waterman. Gillette immediately began making changes and the Product developement and Design departments were moved to Boston. Gillette now owned two premium brands and had to decide which should be the leading brand. They decided on Waterman. In 1996 the French Parker factory in Merú, France, was closed down, integrated with the Waterman plant in Nantes. In 1999 the Janesville factory was shut down. In 2000 Parker was reorganised with new products, the much loved "Duck egg" logo was redesigned and both Parker and Waterman was sold again, this time to Newell Rubbermaid's stationary division, Sanford. In 2007 nearly 200 workers at Parker Newhaven was made redundant when Sanford moved production elsewhere, including China. Although the high-end models are still being produced in Newhaven.

 

VC involvement - there's your answer. With venture capital there is always an exit strategy and six years is a long time in that world.

[mr T.]

On 4/9/2024 at 10:09 PM, Heinkle said:

Not a single influencer or pen YouTuber has mentioned it or been lent one to review. I just cannot fathom what the retail strategy is here - selling a £1200 pen to the five people who know of its existence?

Maybe the strategy is to sell these pens in the first place in a country where YouTube is permanently blocked? Or sell them to portential users/customers that are not really the YouTube target audience? And why let your product be trashed by some 'influencer' that is very biased toward overpriced but low quality brands that are not Parker? 

[welch]

On 5/14/2024 at 5:06 PM, mr T. said:

Maybe the strategy is to sell these pens in the first place in a country where YouTube is permanently blocked? Or sell them to portential users/customers that are not really the YouTube target audience? And why let your product be trashed by some 'influencer' that is very biased toward overpriced but low quality brands that are not Parker? 

I think Parker sells expensive, glitterized, Duofolds to Chinese CEOs, and that the CEO will buy expensive Sonnets for their staff. That's how the Chinese business was described in the last Newell Annual Report I read. 

 

Of course, a CEO or their purchasing assistant does not bother with "influencers" on YouTube. 

 

A focus on expensive pens? Sure. They are the most profitable. Parker sold oodles of the Parker 45, but decided to offer the P-75 because they made more money in the gift-pen / graduation pen / professionals market. I think Tony Fischier explains it. (About then, Montblanc cut away all their offerings below the Meisterstucke 145, 146, and 149.) 

[inkstainedruth]

And the flip side of MB's business model is that was that a friend of mine gave me a NOS Pelikan M200 with the Bayer logo on the barrel that she found of Freecycle and gave me as a gag gift, not realizing how much that was probably a $100 US (or more) pen (even the box was in mint condition).  Obviously some sort of corporate gift -- and the recipient was likely thinking "What the heck am I going to do with THIS?" and stuck it in a drawer....  And eventually that person (or the person's heirs) eventually found it and put it up on Freecycle and my friend snapped it up and gave it to me.

Ruth Morrisson aka inkstainedruth

[Beechwood]

4 hours ago, inkstainedruth said:

And the flip side of MB's business model is that was that a friend of mine gave me a NOS Pelikan M200 with the Bayer logo on the barrel that she found of Freecycle and gave me as a gag gift, not realizing how much that was probably a $100 US (or more) pen (even the box was in mint condition).  Obviously some sort of corporate gift -- and the recipient was likely thinking "What the heck am I going to do with THIS?" and stuck it in a drawer....  And eventually that person (or the person's heirs) eventually found it and put it up on Freecycle and my friend snapped it up and gave it to me.

Ruth Morrisson aka inkstainedruth

 

The manager of a MB London Boutique tells me that he sells every special edition pen that is sent to him,  he calls the same people when the pens arrive. They always come in to the store within a day and pay. He expects that the  pens are kept in a drawer or a safe perhaps and never used.

 

This sounds a mercenary practice by the store slightly eased by the Manager studying whatever vintage pen I have in my pocket when I visit, he looks at and tries my Vacumatics as I wander the store looking at fine leather goods, watches, jewellery and pens.

 

I made the mistake, only once, of going in there with someone in 2012 when there was a new pen on display, it was made of carbon fiber and cost around $1000, it wasn't my cup of tea, at all, I lied and said it was interesting.

 

My birthday was the following  week and they had bought me that pen as a gift. My car, with its spare set of alloy wheels was in storage in her garage, she had sold the wheels to buy the pen.

 

Morally, It is difficult to throw something sharp at someone when they have just given you a $1000 pen.

[Heinkle]

4 hours ago, Beechwood said:

 

Morally, It is difficult to throw something sharp at someone when they have just given you a $1000 pen.

 

Even if they sold your property to fund the purchase?

[Beechwood]

1 hour ago, Heinkle said:

Even,  if they sold your property to fund the purchase?

 

 

I was as mad as a box of frogs, she sold a rare set of unused Jaguar pattern Minilite alloys that were worth big bucks for a pen that I didn't want. Took it back and swapped it for a MB necklace.

 

 

[Chris Koukeas]

I have been making pens for the last 15 years - all turned on my lathe and used various pen kits. I did a couple of bespoke ebonite pens, but user rollerball refills... I didnt know what nibs were available other than those in the pen kits. Neither of the fountain pens i made had a an excellent writing/sketching experience though and sold them all to people who like the looks and not necessarily the writing experience.  
 

I do sketch notes a lot and stick to my old ebonite custom with a black Pilot Hi-Tecpoint 0.7 refill when only recently some of my customers asked why I dont write with my own fountain pens - honest answer is I haven't found a nice nib on a pen yet. 
 

Thus began my search... what's important for this discussion is that if you ask for Parker... the puzzled look might just as well answer 'Oh you mean Spiderman!' It's old and teens or tweens don't know it. 
 

So I picked a Vector XL Black from the glass cabinet under the counter in the art store - seems to be the cheapest - just to evaluate the writing experience. If it is any good I might use the nib in one of my new resin or ebonite pens - who knows?
 

The one puzzling question though is: 'What is the thread size on the grip section where it screws into the barrel?"

[Azulado]

2 hours ago, Chris Koukeas said:

honest answer is I haven't found a nice nib on a pen yet. 

 

If I am not mistaken, the Vector does not have a screw-in unit.
I don't know how you can say there are no nib screw-in units available for your kit pens. You have Jowo, Schmidt, Bock, Hondiang, Jinhao, etc. If none of those are satisfactory to you, forget about fountain pens.

[inkstainedruth]

3 hours ago, Chris Koukeas said:

So I picked a Vector XL Black from the glass cabinet under the counter in the art store - seems to be the cheapest - just to evaluate the writing experience. If it is any good I might use the nib in one of my new resin or ebonite pens - who knows?

I've seen those on eBay and was wondering what they were like.  I'm a huge fan of the standard size Vectors (especially the UK production ones.  My first "good" pen was a Vector and I don't understand why people sneer at them for being "school pens" because mine are fun little workhorses (although I can see if someone has large hands having trouble with a skinny pen like that they'd have trouble) that write well but are still inexpensive (I think the most I ever paid for a Vector was about $18.50 US).

Ruth Morrisson aka inkstainedruth

[mr T.]

On 5/26/2024 at 7:05 PM, Azulado said:

If I am not mistaken, the Vector does not have a screw-in unit.

The Parker Vector XL has a friction fit feed and nib. The diameter on the outside of the grip is 9.7 mm. The nib units are sold as seperate part/accessory.

[Heinkle]

As we approach the end of 2024, I would argue Parker are as irrelevant as ever in the fountain pen world. 

[Beechwood]

26 minutes ago, Heinkle said:

As we approach the end of 2024, I would argue Parker are as irrelevant as ever in the fountain pen world. 

 

 

Not sure I would agree with the two words 'as ever'

 

Hugely dominant in the pen market 1920-1940 with new designs and effective marketing, changed the way that the world wrote in 1940s with the 51 and created some new and interesting designs 1955 to 2000, a loss of direction with the Sonnet, Duofold and other models, many were instantly forgettable.

 

 

[Heinkle]

2 hours ago, Format said:

 

 

Not sure I would agree with the two words 'as ever'.

 

there is perhaps as a misunderstanding here - my point was, Parker in 2024 is perhaps the most irrelevant it has ever been in its history.