Montblanc limited inks are...meh

[jonnybardo]

I must say, I've been a bit underwhelmed. I've bought four bottles so far, and only one is a standout for me. When I buy premium inks, in addition to good performance, I feel like I'm paying for two things: One, a really nice bottle (check); two, while it doesn't have to be truly unique, it should do something really well or in a distinct way. To me, Bungubox exemplifies premium inks that check all the boxes: Great performance, beautiful bottle, and distinct colors.

 

The Montblancs I own...

Brothers Grimm - a nice, dark foresty-olivy green, but not sure it stands out in any way from various similar Robert Osters, Diamines, and Kobes.

Muhammad Ali - a nice, bright green, but I was hoping for something a bit more blue-leaning, like the Pen Boutique sample implied. It is almost exactly the same color as Ink Institute's Songshan-Xindian line.

Starwalker Blue - Kind of boring, and not in a classy Roger Federer boring-but-elegant way, but more in a run-of-the-mill muted way.

Glacier Blue - my favorite of the four, as I like muted blues.

 

These retail for $45 a bottle, though I purchased all except Grimm at discounted prices in the $33-36 range. But for me they don't scream "distinct, original versions of classic colors" like, say, Kobe or Bungubox. Nice inks, but for premium bottles I'm a bit disappointed. I expected Bungubox and got Diamine...nothing wrong with Diamine, but they're a lot cheaper. I don't see myself buying any more unless something really grabs me (or on the off chance I ever find a bottle of Rudyard Kipling for an affordable price, as I love that shade of green).

 

What is your experience with Montblanc's limited inks? Is my experience a common one, or do people love them? 

 

[lapis]

I disagree (at least about 50%). They used to be good. A long time ago. Then, they were "affordable". Now they aren't affordable and also, since about 5-10 years nothing special anymore. Also, it sort of peeved me that when they bring out a "LE" every few months or so, then what's all that "Special" about it? Examples of such "oldies" which I still have and cherish:

Alfred Hitchcock

Carlo Collodi

Daniel Defoe

Diamond

Friendship

Honoré de Balzac

Jonathan Swift

Joy

Leo Tolstoi

Love you

Mahatma Gandhi

Meisterstück 90 Years

White Forest

William Shakespeare

[jonnybardo]

29 minutes ago, lapis said:

I disagree (at least about 50%). They used to be good. A long time ago. Then, they were "affordable". Now they aren't affordable and also, since about 5-10 years nothing special anymore. Also, it sort of peeved me that when they bring out a "LE" every few months or so, then what's all that "Special" about it? Examples of such "oldies" which I still have and cherish:

Alfred Hitchcock

Carlo Collodi

Daniel Defoe

Diamond

Friendship

Honoré de Balzac

Jonathan Swift

Joy

Leo Tolstoi

Love you

Mahatma Gandhi

Meisterstück 90 Years

White Forest

William Shakespeare

Well it sounds like you agree 100%, as far as the era I'm talking about! 

 

Anyhow, that's too bad. 

[AndyYNWA]

I have 2 LE Montblancs, Leo Tolstoy and The Beatles.
Leo Tolstoy is a nice interesting blue with nice sheen and good performance.

The Beatles is a nice purple, but not much more than that... Good performance, but quite boring.

It seems like their LE inks from some 5-10 years ago were much more interesting than their newer offerings.

[jmccarty3]

One of my favorite recent ones is the Elvis Old Glory Blue. At present it seems to be unobtainable.

[txomsy]

I think you made a mistake in English usage. One cannot say an ink "is" whatever because one does not like the color or some other property. There are many preferences and that almost (but not quite) amounts to alienating people with different preferences. Same about prices, it is not the same for all of us and some relativity is necessary.

 

Plus, an LE is only a limited production ink, something that is not going to stay in the continuing line up. It does not imply any specialty.

 

What I can say is that Montblanc inks are not expensive for me (I live in EU), at least not more than US inks sold here. They may be when compared with some other EU inks, but considering the cost -to me- of some Noodler's inks (which are deemed cheap in US), or some Japanese inks, they are certainly worth it. Some users have set a top price (e.g. on 20EUR/bottle) and complain that a 21 EUR MB bottle is too expensive, and they are right for them. For me (and I speak only for me, in my circumstances --like EU location), 25 EUR for a 60ml bottle is cheap compared with 28 EUR for a 50ml Edelstein bottle. And I've paid more for bottles from other vendors that were not LE and had less ink but I did like.

 

Everything is relative.

 

One of my preferred inks is Montblanc Meisterstück 90 Years Permanent Grey, LE. I reckon it has its quirks, but it works for me and so has any other ink: a "wet" ink may seem underwhelming in a "wet" pen, but not on a "dry" one, or with an EF nib, and so on. I could go on, but I think that suffices to show the point.

 

I do agree some colors may not be for me, while others I do really consider very attractive. I have to state my preference for permanent inks, so non-permanent LEs are not high in my preference list, and some colors.. but those are personal idiosyncrasies and in no way guarantee any generalization. I bet if you look, you will find lots of people who love them.

 

Actually, if you look around in the ink forums where people ask for recommendations about specific colors (e.g. the running dark red thread) or properties, I am sure you will find many persons recommending their favorite Montblanc LE ink, so they are not meh for many people.

[amberleadavis]

Hitchcock and the Beatles are two of my favorites.

[inkstainedruth]

I have a few bottles of their LE inks.  

I bought the Tolstoy ink when it came out, and have now been trying to find a close match for if and when I run out.  I liked the Beatles ink (although in retrospect it would be interesting to see a side by side with Edelstein Amethyst).  I ended up buying an almost full bottle of Encré du Desert at an estate sale company's showroom sale, figuring I could give it away (I mostly am not a fan of red/browns) -- but the lavender undertones really caught my attention when I tried it.  And of course I'm now ABSOLUTELY kicking myself for *not* buying a second bottle of the Jimi Hendrix ink at the time -- because it's GORGEOUS (and looks SOOOOOO good coming out of my Parker 75 sterling Ciselé, which has a B nib....

Ruth Morrisson aka inkstainedruth

 

[AndyYNWA]

I have both The Beatles and Edelstein Amethyst. Next time I change inks in my pens I will ink up both of them.
However, if my memory doesn't let me down, I don't think they are especially close... But both are lovely colours!

[Jjanek73]

On 12/6/2023 at 4:31 PM, txomsy said:

I think you made a mistake in English usage. One cannot say an ink "is" whatever because one does not like the color or some other property. There are many preferences and that almost (but not quite) amounts to alienating people with different preferences. Same about prices, it is not the same for all of us and some relativity is necessary.

 

Plus, an LE is only a limited production ink, something that is not going to stay in the continuing line up. It does not imply any specialty.

 

What I can say is that Montblanc inks are not expensive for me (I live in EU), at least not more than US inks sold here. They may be when compared with some other EU inks, but considering the cost -to me- of some Noodler's inks (which are deemed cheap in US), or some Japanese inks, they are certainly worth it. Some users have set a top price (e.g. on 20EUR/bottle) and complain that a 21 EUR MB bottle is too expensive, and they are right for them. For me (and I speak only for me, in my circumstances --like EU location), 25 EUR for a 60ml bottle is cheap compared with 28 EUR for a 50ml Edelstein bottle. And I've paid more for bottles from other vendors that were not LE and had less ink but I did like.

 

Everything is relative.

 

One of my preferred inks is Montblanc Meisterstück 90 Years Permanent Grey, LE. I reckon it has its quirks, but it works for me and so has any other ink: a "wet" ink may seem underwhelming in a "wet" pen, but not on a "dry" one, or with an EF nib, and so on. I could go on, but I think that suffices to show the point.

 

I do agree some colors may not be for me, while others I do really consider very attractive. I have to state my preference for permanent inks, so non-permanent LEs are not high in my preference list, and some colors.. but those are personal idiosyncrasies and in no way guarantee any generalization. I bet if you look, you will find lots of people who love them.

 

Actually, if you look around in the ink forums where people ask for recommendations about specific colors (e.g. the running dark red thread) or properties, I am sure you will find many persons recommending their favorite Montblanc LE ink, so they are not meh for many people.

I think jonnybardo was talking about LE inks specifically, so speak about 25EUR per 60ml bottle is not fair, as these are "standard" inks. Even here in EU LE inks are typically 39,50EUR per 50 ml bottle, which is nearly twice as much for... what?

I certainly agree with you about different preferences about colours.

Yours Jan

[txomsy]

Thanks for the pointer. I think I had understood it as well.

 

But I still think that that depends. I have got LE inks for lower prices here in EU. But even at those tags, non-EU inks in EU can be more expensive too. In some cases it is also a matter of availability: some inks which were considered cheap in US a few years ago were also rarely available in the EU and very expensive, but their price changed when demand increased enough to drive availability.

 

Plus, besides the price factor, sometimes you can get specific inks with no match in properties elsewhere and the price be justified for the buyer. And what is 'uninteresting' to one may be exactly what another seeks.

 

So, it ends being a relative, comparative problem (in space/time/economics) coupled with a matter of taste/preferences. That is what makes preferable to use relative assertions.

 

[Jjanek73]

Agree. Just have wanted to point out, that if we compare, we should compare "comparable" - Edelstein (which is "premium" in Pelikan ink line, as "standard" Pelikan is for mere 5EUR for 30ml) with LE Montblanc, not "ordinary" one... My contribution was about equal evaluation, not personal tastes.

Best regards

Jan

[txomsy]

Thanks, I agree with you.

 

Oh, and Merry Christmas!

[Mark from Yorkshire]

Just to say I love the Starwalker space blue by montblanc it is a blue-grey/ blue black and looks good on Midori MD paper and also the paper in my current journal from the inkpot. 
 

was just flicking through and also looking through the fountain pen fill list after updating for the Conway Stewart no.87 that I filled with Pelikan Edelstein Jade.

[jmccarty3]

On 12/19/2023 at 9:05 PM, inkstainedruth said:

I bought the Tolstoy ink when it came out, and have now been trying to find a close match for if and when I run out.

 

I found the Tolstoy ink to be a great color for my MB Blue Hour pen, so I bought some extra. Haven't seen anything else quite like it.

[inkstainedruth]

Someone recommended one of the KWZ regular line inks to me, Walks Over Vistula, but while the color was close, it wasn't QUITE the same.... 

Ruth Morrisson aka inkstainedruth

[Centurion]

In general, would you say Montblanc inks are similar to Iroshizuku inks, just not as wet, not as shading, and not as sheening? Would you also say, in general, Montblanc inks are well-behaved?

 

It was interesting to read that Montblanc permanent Blue and Black are particularly well-behaved, or perhaps they are particularly well-behaved only in certain pens.

 

I feel not much as been written about Montblanc inks because they're only available through Montblanc and Authorized Dealers, for example, JetPens doesn't write about them in their guides at all.

[inkstainedruth]

I think they are a little less flow-y than Iroshizuku.  Certainly I wasn't overly impressed with modern MB Permanent Blue Black, or with Toffee Brown.  I have an older bottle of Permanent Blue Black that behaves much better, but it could also be because the first sample was put in a pen with an italic nib and that was just not a good combination.

OTOH, when I started here, a lot of people said their go-to blue ink was Iroshizuku Asa-Gao.  And so I tried a sample, and HATED it.  It was drippy.  I'd write about a page and then watch a big fat blog of ink roll down the nib and go SPLAT.  And when I got my first Pelikan, a 1990s era M400 Brown Tortoise with an F nib, I had planned to use it to some extent for drawing.  And put Iroshizuku Yama-guri in it, but that was just too wet an ink for the pen.  But when I put Noodler's Walnut (originally put in a pen that turned out to be a very DRY writer, which was a horrible experience), into that same M400?  It was a match made in heaven!  The wet nib coaxed flow out of the ink, and the dry ink didn't drip or drool or go splat.  (Edelstein Smoky Quartz -- which is practically the same color as Yama-guri -- also works very well in that pen).

A lot of it is trial and error: see what pen(s) an ink works well in vs. what one(s) it doesn't work well in....

As for MB inks in general, most of my bottles I've gotten on discount somehow (the bottle of the Permanent Blue Black and the bottle of Encré du Desert were both full/practically full, but a fraction of the regular price because they were gotten at an estate sale company's showroom sale a while back; I was surprised how much I actually liked Encré du Desert because I'm normally not a fan of reddish browns or brown-leaning reds, and mostly bought it just on the grounds that I could give it away if I didn't like it).  

The only MB inks I think I've paid full retail price for was Lavender Purple and the Jimi Hendrix LE.  I think even the Beatles LE ink I may have gotten on sale someplace.  

Ruth Morrisson aka inkstainedruth

[txomsy]

I love MB Permanent Blue, it is one of my preferred inks, a workhorse. Yes, maybe a little drier than some others, but that is all relative and personal, one might as well say that some others are a little wetter than it.

 

So far, it and blue-black (the old one) have always worked nicely for me.

[jonnybardo]

On 12/6/2023 at 10:31 AM, txomsy said:

I think you made a mistake in English usage. One cannot say an ink "is" whatever because one does not like the color or some other property. There are many preferences and that almost (but not quite) amounts to alienating people with different preferences. Same about prices, it is not the same for all of us and some relativity is necessary.

...

 

Hi! Out of curiosity, is English your first language? For English users, the assumption is usually that when a person is talking about a matter of subjectivity like ink preferences, it is coming from their personal, subjective experience and opinion. In the internet era when opinions have flown around and "flame wars" have become the norm, and in addition to the rise of postmodernism, many people have emphasized subjectivity as a kind of necessary re-statement again and again, even used it as a weapon to negate viewpoints ("that's just your opinion, not fact"), but I find it a bit tedious to always qualify what is obviously my opinion with a statement as such.

 

So if I had written what I wrote and qualified it with "in my humble opinion," you probably would have interpreted what I said differently. But some folks, myself included, feel that such qualification is unnecessary - that it is assumed that an "is" statement from a subject (me) is unnecessary to convey that all I am merely doing is expressing my own opinion.

 

In other words, if you have to say it all the time, it doesn't actually need to be said. It should be assumed that a person is speaking their own opinion, and not trying to pass it off as objective fact - at least when it is an obviously subjective matter (like ink preferences). 

 

So rest assured, I fully realize that what I wrote was just my opinion! Or to quote the Big Lebowski, "That's just like your opinion, man!"

 

On 12/6/2023 at 10:31 AM, txomsy said:

Everything is relative.

 

 

Of course! But, not to get philosophical, isn't that statement also subject to your claim of relativity? In other words, if "everything is relative," does this not also apply to that assertion? (Philosopher Jurgen Habermas called this the "performative contradiction").