3-in-1 vs Eyedropper

[Karmachanic]

@K Singh  Thank you for the clarification.

[tommym]

On 7/18/2023 at 7:58 PM, K Singh said:

I mentioned to check with Mr.Kandan first because the website isn't regularly updated. He himself told once that the website work was done for free by an FP enthusiast and as such he can't make modifications easily to the site. There were bugs with Indian pricing earlier and even until a few months ago it wasn't fixed. That's why it's best to contact them first to avoid any hassles.

 

Mr. Kandan did respond to my queries. 

 

They still make dedicated eyedropper pens with friction-fit nibs/feeds (no threaded housing). But, not all 3-in-1 pens are available in a corresponding dedicated eyedropper. Not sure why not. And he stated that some of their largest pens, such as the Majestic and Bheem (Giant Samurai), are unavailable as a dedicated eyedroppers. Again, I'm not sure why not, as I think their biggest pens would have the most meat in the section to accommodate friction-fit nibs/feeds. Surprisingly, one of their smallest pens, the 4CS, of which I have three, is available as a dedicated eyedropper.

 

Tommy

[K Singh]

11 minutes ago, tommym said:

 

Mr. Kandan did respond to my queries. 

 

They still make dedicated eyedropper pens with friction-fit nibs/feeds (no threaded housing). But, not all 3-in-1 pens are available in a corresponding dedicated eyedropper. Not sure why not. And he stated that some of their largest pens, such as the Majestic and Bheem (Giant Samurai), are unavailable as a dedicated eyedroppers. Again, I'm not sure why not, as I think their biggest pens would have the most meat in the section to accommodate friction-fit nibs/feeds. Surprisingly, one of their smallest pens, the 4CS, of which I have three, is available as a dedicated eyedropper.

 

Tommy

Thanks for the update. I have sold all my Rangas anyway, but good to know they still offer few eyedroppers with friction-fit setting. 

[Aravind_A_2310]

11 hours ago, tommym said:

 

Mr. Kandan did respond to my queries. 

 

They still make dedicated eyedropper pens with friction-fit nibs/feeds (no threaded housing). But, not all 3-in-1 pens are available in a corresponding dedicated eyedropper. Not sure why not. And he stated that some of their largest pens, such as the Majestic and Bheem (Giant Samurai), are unavailable as a dedicated eyedroppers. Again, I'm not sure why not, as I think their biggest pens would have the most meat in the section to accommodate friction-fit nibs/feeds. Surprisingly, one of their smallest pens, the 4CS, of which I have three, is available as a dedicated eyedropper.

 

Tommy

Most probably the reason might be due to burping. Usually in these larger eyedroppers, the pen begins to burp around the half-way mark. So the effective use of the pen is diminished. I have a gama supreme with a friction fit ebonite feed, and it burps right around the half way point. Which, make no mistake, is a significant amount of writing. Also the demand for traditional simple eyedroppers are far diminshing in favour of the 3-in-1 style, and more recently, with moonman introducing the C4, japanese style eyedroppers with shutoff valves. as these are far better at eliminating burps and lets you use the full capacity of the pen.

[tommym]

2 minutes ago, Aravind_A_2310 said:

Most probably the reason might be due to burping. Usually in these larger eyedroppers, the pen begins to burp around the half-way mark. So the effective use of the pen is diminished. I have a gama supreme with a friction fit ebonite feed, and it burps right around the half way point. Which, make no mistake, is a significant amount of writing. Also the demand for traditional simple eyedroppers are far diminshing in favour of the 3-in-1 style, and more recently, with moonman introducing the C4, japanese style eyedroppers with shutoff valves. as these are far better at eliminating burps and lets you use the full capacity of the pen.

 

I've heard of burping in the past. How does this "shutoff valve" work?

 

Tommy

[Aravind_A_2310]

7 hours ago, tommym said:

 

I've heard of burping in the past. How does this "shutoff valve" work?

 

Tommy

If You've heard or seen pens like the namiki emperor or any Opus88 pens, You might be familiar with the concept.

But for the sake of clarity, Take note of the image below, It's the Moonman/Majohn c4

 

Here, you fill just like any eyedropper, but the differentiator is a rod that close off the section leaving the entire ink chamber as one sealed unit. When you want to write, just twist the end knob to break the seal. this is Immensely useful for travel with air pressure changes. Just close off the ink chamber, and you're good to go.

 

Hope this helps.

Regards,

Aravind

[tommym]

5 hours ago, Aravind_A_2310 said:

If You've heard or seen pens like the namiki emperor or any Opus88 pens, You might be familiar with the concept.

But for the sake of clarity, Take note of the image below, It's the Moonman/Majohn c4

 

Here, you fill just like any eyedropper, but the differentiator is a rod that close off the section leaving the entire ink chamber as one sealed unit. When you want to write, just twist the end knob to break the seal. this is Immensely useful for travel with air pressure changes. Just close off the ink chamber, and you're good to go.

 

Hope this helps.

Regards,

Aravind

 

Thanks for the explanation and image.  

 

Tommy

[Lora]

On 7/17/2023 at 11:48 AM, K Singh said:

Yes, the 3-in-1 pens also perform very well as eyedroppers. Though personally I prefer the old style friction-fit ebonite feed and nib for my eyedropper pens. 

 

Most of my eyedropper pens don't burp out ink anyway, and even if they are about to burp I stop writing and then pointing the nib upwards I open the barrel a little, and then the excessive ink in the feed goes back into the barrel. And if the pen is a heavy burper I just replace the feed with a sheaffer one and this solves the issue.

 

Like mentioned in above comment, I find the breather hole in cap to be unnecessary for modern pens.

 

Though Indian penmakers used to prefer the basic ebonite feed for the eyedropper pens, now many are moving towards 3-in-1 pens; a trend which I personally am not a fan of, but I can understand why they are doing it since most people prefer 3-in-1 pens over eyedroppers today.

 

In this hobby, it's best to try out some things on your own to get a clear idea about how things work. Who knows what type of nib/feed setup you will end up liking 🙂

Where do you buy the Sheaffer feeds from? Are they available for Indian No. 4, No. 5.5, and No. 6/35 nibs?
In case Sheaffer feeds are difficult to find, are there easily available generic plastic / ebonite feeds that would achieve the same results?

[K Singh]

2 hours ago, Lora said:

Where do you buy the Sheaffer feeds from? Are they available for Indian No. 4, No. 5.5, and No. 6/35 nibs?
In case Sheaffer feeds are difficult to find, are there easily available generic plastic / ebonite feeds that would achieve the same results?

They are hard to find these days. You will have to look around at various pen shops for broken Sheaffer pens and such and take out the feed out of them. As far as I know no one sells these feeds separately today.

 

The sheaffer nononsense feeds are compatible with Indian no.8(28mm) and 35mm nibs. Even the regular Bock/Jowo/Schmidt nib units work very well in eyedropper mode and prevent burping. 

[Lora]

23 minutes ago, K Singh said:

They are hard to find these days. You will have to look around at various pen shops for broken Sheaffer pens and such and take out the feed out of them. As far as I know no one sells these feeds separately today.

 

The sheaffer nononsense feeds are compatible with Indian no.8(28mm) and 35mm nibs. Even the regular Bock/Jowo/Schmidt nib units work very well in eyedropper mode and prevent burping. 

The thing is I just discovered the Kanwrite nibs and I absolutely like them (soon to order more) and I also read how great Ambitious nibs are, so I'd love to try them as well. I've seen JoWo the readed nib units withKanweire nibs, but not with Ambitious.

 

I also tend to like thinner pens, whose section is too thin to take threaded nib unit, and some of them call for No. 4 nibs (international No. 2) which I haven't seen in threaded nib unit...

 

Are you aware of any modern plastic nibs that would perform similar to Sheaffer ones and may serve as a decent replacement?

[K Singh]

2 hours ago, Lora said:

The thing is I just discovered the Kanwrite nibs and I absolutely like them (soon to order more) and I also read how great Ambitious nibs are, so I'd love to try them as well. I've seen JoWo the readed nib units withKanweire nibs, but not with Ambitious.

 

I also tend to like thinner pens, whose section is too thin to take threaded nib unit, and some of them call for No. 4 nibs (international No. 2) which I haven't seen in threaded nib unit...

 

Are you aware of any modern plastic nibs that would perform similar to Sheaffer ones and may serve as a decent replacement?

The jowo/Schmidt/Kanwrite/bock units I mentioned have plastic feeds only. But if you are talking about standalone plastic feed that can be used in friction-fit setting in eyedropper pens then I have no idea honestly. 

[Lora]

22 minutes ago, K Singh said:

The jowo/Schmidt/Kanwrite/bock units I mentioned have plastic feeds only. But if you are talking about standalone plastic feed that can be used in friction-fit setting in eyedropper pens then I have no idea honestly. 

Thank you for your help.

[subbu68]

On 8/6/2023 at 9:15 AM, Aravind_A_2310 said:

Most probably the reason might be due to burping. Usually in these larger eyedroppers, the pen begins to burp around the half-way mark. So the effective use of the pen is diminished. I have a gama supreme with a friction fit ebonite feed, and it burps right around the half way point. Which, make no mistake, is a significant amount of writing. Also the demand for traditional simple eyedroppers are far diminshing in favour of the 3-in-1 style, and more recently, with moonman introducing the C4, japanese style eyedroppers with shutoff valves. as these are far better at eliminating burps and lets you use the full capacity of the pen.

I have now a Gama Jumbo Demo inked up. It is half way now. Two weeks back it was Gama Supreme. I wrote near to the end of the tank before I got bored with the ink.  Never ending... Also is a Wality 71 JT the that is half way done now. 

 

I followed the instruction on Gama website to fill up, Fill to the thread, screw in the section till last two threads, invert the pen to the bottle and screw in the section complete and tight draining a few drops of ink in to the bottle. No burps till now on any pens. No hard starts either. Writing wet as ever. 

 

I carry the pens in my pocket upright. Yesterday, my Gama Demo was lying flat in my bag. A drop of ink in the cap. Other than that no mishaps till now. 

[Aravind_A_2310]

20 hours ago, subbu68 said:

I have now a Gama Jumbo Demo inked up. It is half way now. Two weeks back it was Gama Supreme. I wrote near to the end of the tank before I got bored with the ink.  Never ending... Also is a Wality 71 JT the that is half way done now. 

 

I followed the instruction on Gama website to fill up, Fill to the thread, screw in the section till last two threads, invert the pen to the bottle and screw in the section complete and tight draining a few drops of ink in to the bottle. No burps till now on any pens. No hard starts either. Writing wet as ever. 

 

I carry the pens in my pocket upright. Yesterday, my Gama Demo was lying flat in my bag. A drop of ink in the cap. Other than that no mishaps till now. 

The climate also plays a role here. In hotter days, the pens won't burp until the last ounce. But on cooler days the pens will burp as soon as half way. I love in Kerala, and I've been able to write my airmail 71JT till empty in the summers but the same airmail will barf out ink halfway in the 

Monsoon.

[MuddyWaters]

6 hours ago, Aravind_A_2310 said:

The climate also plays a role here. In hotter days, the pens won't burp until the last ounce. But on cooler days the pens will burp as soon as half way. I love in Kerala, and I've been able to write my airmail 71JT till empty in the summers but the same airmail will barf out ink halfway in the 

Monsoon.

imagine us here in Canada who try Indian eyedroppers 😋

[Aravind_A_2310]

18 hours ago, MuddyWaters said:

imagine us here in Canada who try Indian eyedroppers 😋

If the pen has a no.6/no.35 nib and standard ebonite feed, then it might be worth scouring for old no-nonsense pens to extract their feed from. It's a drop in replacement to the ebonite feed and does an excellent job at preventing burps.

[subbu68]

2 hours ago, Aravind_A_2310 said:

If the pen has a no.6/no.35 nib and standard ebonite feed, then it might be worth scouring for old no-nonsense pens to extract their feed from. It's a drop in replacement to the ebonite feed and does an excellent job at preventing burps.

Even any Parker Frontier, Sonnet or Insignia feeds. I broke my Gama Eyas feed while trying to extricate it. Was sad to see the Eyas "skeleton" lying in the box. Parker Frontier feed with ASA Pens supplied No.35 nib doing wonders now. 

[subbu68]

On 10/8/2023 at 8:42 AM, Aravind_A_2310 said:

The climate also plays a role here. In hotter days, the pens won't burp until the last ounce. But on cooler days the pens will burp as soon as half way. I love in Kerala, and I've been able to write my airmail 71JT till empty in the summers but the same airmail will barf out ink halfway in the 

Monsoon.

I cannot test in different climatic conditions since we live and work in same "climate" in the buildings here - air conditioned 🙂 temperature is 22 to 25 deg C depending on where one is and pressurized if the a/c is running. In modern large buildings with a lot of thermal intertia and common area cooling even without a/c it is around 27 deg C max. 

 

Maybe that's why even the last drop of ink is usable for me. 

 

[cvk]

On 10/8/2023 at 4:28 AM, MuddyWaters said:

imagine us here in Canada who try Indian eyedroppers 😋

Use a shearer nn feed and forget about the weather