EFNIR: De Atramentis Document Dark Blue

[LizEF]

Extra Fine Nib Ink Review: De Atramentis Document Dark Blue

This is review #200 in my series.  Here's the YouTube video:

Post-recording notes: When making the slide and swatch (done a day before inking the pen), the pipette didn't stain, so I risked using the Prera for this ink.  Cleaning required some scrubbing, though - some ink had dried in the converter and it took a swab to get it out. I used a brush on the feed when more flakes came off on the towel after rinsing (yes, I removed the nib and feed). And there was a pink film in the section that needed a swab and pipe cleaner (behind that tab in Pilot sections) to get it off.  When cleaning off the microscope slide, after soaking in water for an hour (usually plenty of time for ink to re-wet), I had to scrape this ink off the slide and cover slip with my fingernail.  It came off in flakes.  This suggests to me that this ink is super-waterproof when dry and that you do *not* want it drying in your pen!

Screenshot: Text is a bit too dark.

Scan: Close when zoomed in on the ink, but the overall image seems too saturated to me.

Zoom: Quite close, possibly a little too saturated (the ink definitely has a grey or muted cast to it)

Absorbent Paper & Copy Paper: Both seem too saturated - lacking the grey-ness of the ink on paper. Ink was paler on this paper than on the FP-friendly paper.

The line width measurement is one of the lines used for dry time.  Magnification is 100x.  The grid is 100x100µm.  The scale is 360µm, with twelve divisions of 30µm each.  The line width for this ink is roughly 338µm. (For the curious, with 200 inks measured, the average line width is 294µm.)

The slide images were interesting, sort of like clouds or silt in a river delta or something.  There were bits of pink and blue, but the pink didn't show up well.  Colors don't match what I saw.  Really need a better microscope (camera?).  Smear #2 is at 400x.

And here is a screen of the final result, for those not interested in the video:

Scan of Completed Review:

Zoomed in photo:

Absorbent Paper Closeup (top is puzzle paper like thick newsprint, bottom is old 20lb copy paper):

Line width measured via microscope at 100x:

Microscope slide at 100x:

Microscope at 400x, different area:

Water test results:

Images also available on Instagram: @zilxodarap.

Previous Review: Private Reserve Infinity Green.

Want to influence the inky sequence?  Take the "next ink" poll.

View a list of my inks, complete with review results in this google sheet.

Need to catch up on The Adventures of Quin and Makhabesh?  Find the whole story here.

Hope you enjoy.  Comments appreciated!

[InesF]

Thank you @LizEF - there seems to be hope for Makhabesh!😋

Puh, the most important is said.

 

Now to the minor topics:

This ink has a beautiful and saturated colour and seems to deal well with absorbent paper. The problems with cleaning seem to be obvious. The microscopic image is nice - I like these structures. Most of the waterproof binders tend to shrink during drying, the deAtramentis binder seems to be no exception.

 

Some years ago I chose the R&K sketch inks to be my fountain pen waterproof inks, never regretted and have not emptied a single bottle so far. But I will consider deAtramentis for the next shopping trip.

[yazeh]

Happy 200! Bravo! Amazing job 

I knew Essri and Makhabesh would become begrudging friends, reminds me of Donkey and Puss, from Shrek

 

I had the misfortune of letting a De Atramentis document ink (Dark red) drying in a couple of pens. It took a couple of days of soaking in a solution to clean it up. The ink as you said, sticks to the feed.

 

Really like those slide colours. Cool.. The ink looks really nice but I have my KTC, so I'm fine

[Sailor Kenshin]

Yay Essri!   Are we channeling a bit of The Incredibles?  (“Throw me!”).
 

The microscopes slides?  Coral reefs!  At a slant!  Then clouds!  Coooool.

 

 But not, I fear, an ink for me.  I'd be scared of it.  
 

Thanks as always for the review and serial.  Even if it is not an ink I want, it's always fascinating.

[LizEF]

5 hours ago, InesF said:

Thank you @LizEF 

You're very welcome!

 

5 hours ago, InesF said:

there seems to be hope for Makhabesh!😋

Puh, the most important is said.

Exactly!

 

5 hours ago, InesF said:

Some years ago I chose the R&K sketch inks to be my fountain pen waterproof inks, never regretted and have not emptied a single bottle so far. But I will consider deAtramentis for the next shopping trip.

So far, I've only reviewed two of the sketchINK line (but have two more on the poll) and have tried many of the DAD inks - generally, I find the DAD inks to be wetter and better flowing, though DAD Black refused to flow.  This is consistent with De Atramentis inks in general - quite wet.  FWIW.

[LizEF]

3 hours ago, yazeh said:

Happy 200! Bravo! Amazing job 

Thank you!  (I don't feel a day over 150! )

 

3 hours ago, yazeh said:

I knew Essri and Makhabesh would become begrudging friends, reminds me of Donkey and Puss, from Shrek

Any similarity with other fictional characters is entirely subconscious (can't even remember Shrek)...

 

3 hours ago, yazeh said:

I had the misfortune of letting a De Atramentis document ink (Dark red) drying in a couple of pens. It took a couple of days of soaking in a solution to clean it up. The ink as you said, sticks to the feed.

Yes, very resistant stuff.  I was really surprised that it flaked off the glass rather than re-wetting.

 

3 hours ago, yazeh said:

Really like those slide colours. Cool..

Yeah, every now an then, an ink does something different.

 

3 hours ago, yazeh said:

The ink looks really nice but I have my KTC, so I'm fine

Your ink and the cockroaches may one day be all that's left of our planet for aliens to find...

[LizEF]

52 minutes ago, Sailor Kenshin said:

Yay Essri!   Are we channeling a bit of The Incredibles?  (“Throw me!”).

Not sure I ever saw The Incredibles.  If I did, I have no (conscious) memory of this.

 

53 minutes ago, Sailor Kenshin said:

The microscopes slides?  Coral reefs!  At a slant!  Then clouds!  Coooool.

Right!?  Neat stuff.

 

53 minutes ago, Sailor Kenshin said:

But not, I fear, an ink for me.  I'd be scared of it.

Personally, I'm sticking with Sailor Souboku, but for love, not fear.

 

54 minutes ago, Sailor Kenshin said:

Thanks as always for the review and serial.  Even if it is not an ink I want, it's always fascinating.

You're very welcome!  And thank you.

[Tas]

Wooo hooo!!

[LizEF]

8 hours ago, Tas said:

Wooo hooo!!

😊🥰  Thanks, @Tas!

[NeverTapOut]

Thank you Liz for all your hard work : )

#200 WOW!

[LizEF]

56 minutes ago, NeverTapOut said:

Thank you Liz for all your hard work : )

#200 WOW!

You're most welcome!

[CoolBreeze]

When I first got into fountain pens, this was my second ink I think I used. I bought it for its waterproofness. I originally had private reserve tanzanite (a color which I loved). That ink would dry smear for days (a trait which I hated). I just thought that was a trait of all fountainpen inks so I thought I needed waterproofness, so I bought this. I mixed it with DeA document magenta? and got a color close to blurple. As you mentioned, the ink is super waterproof but.......it feathers like crazy and has the chalk/grey cast to it and stains converters. I eventually fell out of love with it for more vibrant inks. I do use some of their none document inks in EF nibs and I love their extra flow in those circumstances to get a saturated line.

[LizEF]

1 hour ago, CoolBreeze said:

When I first got into fountain pens, this was my second ink I think I used. I bought it for its waterproofness. I originally had private reserve tanzanite (a color which I loved). That ink would dry smear for days (a trait which I hated). I just thought that was a trait of all fountainpen inks so I thought I needed waterproofness, so I bought this. I mixed it with DeA document magenta? and got a color close to blurple. As you mentioned, the ink is super waterproof but.......it feathers like crazy and has the chalk/grey cast to it and stains converters. I eventually fell out of love with it for more vibrant inks. I do use some of their none document inks in EF nibs and I love their extra flow in those circumstances to get a saturated line.

  The staining is a consequence of the permanence, no doubt.  Yes, a lot of the De Atramentis Document inks seem to have that chalky appearance to them, but that's apparently not a necessary consequence of permanence (see Sailor's pigmented inks, for example).  I think the bleed and feather are partly caused by whatever flow-aid is in De Atramentis inks, which tend to be wet.

 

Thanks for sharing your story - always fun to remember "how we were" when we were newbies.

[inkstainedruth]

On 9/27/2022 at 3:03 PM, LizEF said:

Your ink and the cockroaches may one day be all that's left of our planet for aliens to find...

Yeah, I describe KTC as being "everything proof"....

Too bad that it's so badly behaved in other respects....  And I have yet to find an ink that is close to it as far as color.

Ruth Morrisson aka inkstainedruth

[yazeh]

4 minutes ago, inkstainedruth said:

Yeah, I describe KTC as being "everything proof"....

Too bad that it's so badly behaved in other respects....  And I have yet to find an ink that is close to it as far as color.

Ruth Morrisson aka inkstainedruth

I have had it for almost a year in a Kaweco Navy as an eyedropper. Whenever, I go out and need something dependable I have it. It always writes and works fantastically. 

[inkstainedruth]

Good to know.  I've tried it in various pens and the best bet has been a Noodler's Charlie eyedropper.  I had had high hopes for the Noodler's Boston Safety pen, but the only ink that I've found so far which worked well in it was Noodler's Luck of the Draw -- which I think was an LE ink for the Baltimore-Washington Pen Show a few years (and I'm not overly enamored of the color).

Ruth Morrisson aka inkstainedruth

[yazeh]

3 hours ago, inkstainedruth said:

Good to know.  I've tried it in various pens and the best bet has been a Noodler's Charlie eyedropper.  I had had high hopes for the Noodler's Boston Safety pen, but the only ink that I've found so far which worked well in it was Noodler's Luck of the Draw -- which I think was an LE ink for the Baltimore-Washington Pen Show a few years (and I'm not overly enamored of the color).

Ruth Morrisson aka inkstainedruth

Sorry to hear that. I knew of a dear departed friend used to have Whaleman's Sepia in the Boston Safety Pen. In my expeirece any pen with a good seal works. So, for me for any pigment/bulletproof etc. pen a good seal is the first thing I look for. And Kaweco are a cheap practical option. Preppies and Plaisirs are very good too. 

[inkstainedruth]

19 hours ago, yazeh said:

Sorry to hear that. I knew of a dear departed friend used to have Whaleman's Sepia in the Boston Safety Pen. In my expeirece any pen with a good seal works. So, for me for any pigment/bulletproof etc. pen a good seal is the first thing I look for. And Kaweco are a cheap practical option. Preppies and Plaisirs are very good too. 

I loved the color of Whaleman's Sepia when I got a sample of it.  But the ink just would not flow (I think I had it in one of the Konrad or maybe one of the FPCs).  Very disappointing.

I have a few Preppies (they came free with 4 oz. bottles of Noodler's Ink before the Charlie eyedroppers came out).  I had them set up with the rollerball heads for a project, but have been underwhelmed by the performance (and one of them cracked badly without having been used much -- it was nib upright in a canister of other pens that were in rotation.  I also did not much like my Plaisir (I have one of the older style ones with the color-match coated nibs, and the coating started to flake off so I was afraid to keep using it for fear of contaminating the ink).  And the cap band is very cheesy looking.   Mine also is a very dry writer (don't know if that's due to the coating on the nib).

Kaweco Sports didn't really wow me, but I know people who really like theirs.  Turning one into an eyedropper might be the way to go if I ever decide to get one (I haven't heard great things about their converters).

Ruth Morrisson aka inkstainedruth

[yazeh]

9 minutes ago, inkstainedruth said:

I loved the color of Whaleman's Sepia when I got a sample of it.  But the ink just would not flow (I think I had it in one of the Konrad or maybe one of the FPCs).  Very disappointing.

I have a few Preppies (they came free with 4 oz. bottles of Noodler's Ink before the Charlie eyedroppers came out).  I had them set up with the rollerball heads for a project, but have been underwhelmed by the performance (and one of them cracked badly without having been used much -- it was nib upright in a canister of other pens that were in rotation.  I also did not much like my Plaisir (I have one of the older style ones with the color-match coated nibs, and the coating started to flake off so I was afraid to keep using it for fear of contaminating the ink).  And the cap band is very cheesy looking.   Mine also is a very dry writer (don't know if that's due to the coating on the nib).

Kaweco Sports didn't really wow me, but I know people who really like theirs.  Turning one into an eyedropper might be the way to go if I ever decide to get one (I haven't heard great things about their converters).

Ruth Morrisson aka inkstainedruth

Thanks for sharing your experience. I was mentioning cheap pens. I am sure there are much better pens, I had a list somewhere. 

[inkstainedruth]

14 minutes ago, yazeh said:

Thanks for sharing your experience. I was mentioning cheap pens. I am sure there are much better pens, I had a list somewhere. 

Well the Preppies came with four oz. bottles of Noodler's ink (as did some cheapie Kuretake brush pens) back then.  

A few weeks ago I was talking with a woman in my choir who does a lot of calligraphy projects -- she was looking for inks that did well on pergamenata (vegetable parchment) and was trying to pick my brain about inks to work well and  also inexpensive pens to point new scribes at (she didn't like the Pilot Parallels much, and I found out from Pilot USA that the ink packaged with those is a different formulation from Pilot/Namiki Black (to help facilitate mixing colors).  She was looking at the Pilot Plumix model but I have no experience with them (or Parallels, for that matter).  Unfortunately she won't be back at choir until next month (she's a high school music teacher who has "wind ensemble" rehearsals on Monday nights).  I was going to have her try my Metropolitan with the 1 mm stub (a bit more expensive than a Plumix) because I gather the nibs are the same (currently inked up with Namiki Black -- but my husband has stashed his bottles away in his office somewhere and can't find them....  

NOT really looking forward to buying a THIRD bottle of Namiki Black but looks as if I might have to....

Ruth Morrisson aka inkstainedruth