New 149 Expressive Nib released in December?

[gerigo]

Reading this tempts me into making the leap😂.

 

I just handled it at the drug dealer Montblanc store. Some observations of the nib.

 

The foot of the nib unfortunately isn't curved like a Naginata, rather its flat like an architect grind. Unfortunately for me, this will make it's usage for Chinese character writing pretty limited. The interesting innovation that other similar types of nibs don't have is the additional little semi-circular bump on the top surface of the nib. I think this will provide a really smooth and viable writing experience when the pen is flipped over. 

[axio]

10 minutes ago, gerigo said:

Reading this tempts me into making the leap😂.

 

I just handled it at the drug dealer Montblanc store. Some observations of the nib.

 

The foot of the nib unfortunately isn't curved like a Naginata, rather its flat like an architect grind. Unfortunately for me, this will make it's usage for Chinese character writing pretty limited. The interesting innovation that other similar types of nibs don't have is the additional little semi-circular bump on the top surface of the nib. I think this will provide a really smooth and viable writing experience when the pen is flipped over. 

Could you elaborate a bit how the flat vs curved foot may aid Chinese writing?

 

thanks

[gerigo]

3 hours ago, axio said:

Could you elaborate a bit how the flat vs curved foot may aid Chinese writing?

If you note the character 能 on the bottom row all the way to the left, this effect can only be achieved through a more curved foot that is very typical of Sailor's Naginata. This effect is a lot harder to achieve with a complete flat foot where the entire nib surface is in contact with the paper surface. 

[axio]

Interesting. Thanks for sharing @gerigo

I would love to see some sample writing in Chinese of this Montblanc curved nib.

[como]

I reserved one at the local MB boutique to try it. They let me dip-try. I played for a long while and ended up buying it. It was 950 Swiss francs, almost the same price as the 149C (which at the time was 955 Swiss francs, so the difference is probably just exchange rate fluctuations). I am really happy with it, easy to handle and very smooth.
 

 

The nib is exactly what another FPN member posted in other thread from a Japanese pen magazine. I can't find the thread on the FPN but I took a screen shot at the time.

 

 

A little bit of background: Since the 149C and thanks to Franco @fpupulin, I have been very interested in the series of "Calligraphy" nibs. In order to prepare myself for the Curved nib, I bought a few cheap pens just to see if I could possibly write with such things. So I bought some Sailor Fude de Mannen and another pen which was a modification of a Bock titanium nib, and even a nylon brush pen. I also tried once a Zoom nib. Initially I thought that they were too different from a brush pen and I really couldn't write with them. Then I saw that people were even able to write Chinese calligraphy with a pencil and a ballpoint on youtube (or somewhere I don't remember). So I thought what the heck, perhaps I didn't try hard enough :-)))))) 

 

Things I learned from trying:

 

1. You really can write Chinese calligraphy with any pen (except for the Italic, Music or anything that has too much vertical/horizontal difference). You have to vary pressure in your hand, not just varying the angle of writing.

 

2. The traditional rice paper designed specifically for Japanese/Chinese calligraphy is much better than the usual paper (including my favourite Tomoe River for journaling) for this kind of writing, or at least very much fun and different!

 

3. The pen (and Fude de Mannen etc, pens of this nature) is great for sketching. It's smooth and gives different line widths. 

 

Hope this gives some info from my first hand experience. Of course, it's just one person's point of view.

[A Smug Dill]

2 minutes ago, como said:

Things I learned from trying:

 

1. You really can write Chinese calligraphy with any pen (except for the Italic, Music or anything that has too much vertical/horizontal difference). You have to vary pressure in your hand, not just varying the angle of writing.

 

Thank you for sharing your insight! 👍

[axio]

Thanks @comofor sharing.

So the price on the Swiss side isn't lower due to the lower tax. How many copies our local Boutique still carries?

[a student]

@como A remarkably fine example of calligraphy. Congratulations

[Seney724]

10 minutes ago, como said:

I reserved one at the local MB boutique to try it. They let me dip-try. I played for a long while and ended up buying it. It was 950 Swiss francs, almost the same price as the 149C (which at the time was 955 Swiss francs, so the difference is probably just exchange rate fluctuations). I am really happy with it, easy to handle and very smooth.
 

 

The nib is exactly what another FPN member posted in other thread from a Japanese pen magazine. I can't find the thread on the FPN but I took a screen shot at the time.

 

 

A little bit of background: Since the 149C and thanks to Franco @fpupulin, I have been very interested in the series of "Calligraphy" nibs. In order to prepare myself for the Curved nib, I bought a few cheap pens just to see if I could possibly write with such things. So I bought some Sailor Fude de Mannen and another pen which was a modification of a Bock titanium nib, and even a nylon brush pen. I also tried once a Zoom nib. Initially I thought that they were too different from a brush pen and I really couldn't write with them. Then I saw that people were even able to write Chinese calligraphy with a pencil and a ballpoint on youtube (or somewhere I don't remember). So I thought what the heck, perhaps I didn't try hard enough :-)))))) 

 

Things I learned from trying:

 

1. You really can write Chinese calligraphy with any pen (except for the Italic, Music or anything that has too much vertical/horizontal difference). You have to vary pressure in your hand, not just varying the angle of writing.

 

2. The traditional rice paper designed specifically for Japanese/Chinese calligraphy is much better than the usual paper (including my favourite Tomoe River for journaling) for this kind of writing, or at least very much fun and different!

 

3. The pen (and Fude de Mannen etc, pens of this nature) is great for sketching. It's smooth and gives different line widths. 

 

Hope this gives some info from my first hand experience. Of course, it's just one person's point of view.

Wow, this is really great @como.  Thank you for sharing your information, insights and writing experience.

And, congratulations on your new pen with its incredible nib.  May it provide you with many happy hours of writing enjoyment!

[como]

To All: Thank you for your kind words. What I really like about this nib compared to some others that I tried is that:

 

1. It's easier to write the "down stroke diagonal tapering to a very fine line", which I couldn't do with the Fude. It may be that I am just not good enough, but this is my experience.

 

2. Very smooth throughout, even at reverse writing and also when pen is at vertical position tilting over 90 degrees.

 

3. I just love the size and feel of 149 for calligraphy. It makes longer exercises less tiring. Same with Sailor KOP which has a very girthy section too, but I don't have one of these super expensive nib/KOP combination.

 

I think the price is quite fair for such a specialty nib, compared to their regular 149 offering. I tried Chinese calligraphy with 149C and 146C after this, out of curiosity. The 149C/146C also work for this, but in a different way (with flex, not with writing angle). Very cool! I now look at 149C in a different light. I think 149C is my all time favourite modern pen (surely @fpupulin would agree :-)))) for its versatility in all aspects.

 

@axio MB pens at the boutiques here are at very similar prices as the EU Euro prices. Minus EU VAT plus Swiss VAT, it's not that much different. What's important for me is that I could try this in person. As with the 149C and 146C, some of the boutiques got a few pieces at initial launch.

 

 

[fpupulin]

1 hour ago, como said:

To All: Thank you for your kind words. What I really like about this nib compared to some others that I tried is that:

 

1. It's easier to write the "down stroke diagonal tapering to a very fine line", which I couldn't do with the Fude. It may be that I am just not good enough, but this is my experience.

 

2. Very smooth throughout, even at reverse writing and also when pen is at vertical position tilting over 90 degrees.

 

3. I just love the size and feel of 149 for calligraphy. It makes longer exercises less tiring. Same with Sailor KOP which has a very girthy section too, but I don't have one of these super expensive nib/KOP combination.

 

I think the price is quite fair for such a specialty nib, compared to their regular 149 offering. I tried Chinese calligraphy with 149C and 146C after this, out of curiosity. The 149C/146C also work for this, but in a different way (with flex, not with writing angle). Very cool! I now look at 149C in a different light. I think 149C is my all time favourite modern pen (surely @fpupulin would agree :-)))) for its versatility in all aspects.

 

@axio MB pens at the boutiques here are at very similar prices as the EU Euro prices. Minus EU VAT plus Swiss VAT, it's not that much different. What's important for me is that I could try this in person. As with the 149C and 146C, some of the boutiques got a few pieces at initial launch.

 

 

As usual, como, your posts are plenty of first-hand experience and personal thoughts and remarks, which make them of the greatest utility. 
 

In fact, you make me much more curious of what I was before. I had a short experience with economic fude de mannen nibs, and I remember that they were indeed quite special fir sketching, even though not particularly apt to the kind of calligraphic styles I prefer. But according to your report, I guess that the curved nib if the new 149 must be an experience of a totally different league. 

By the way, I like that the ‘calligraphic” sticker of the curved nib 149 is different from the eights of the flexible nib: a nice touch my MB.
 

Congratulations, my friend, for your new acquisition and for your natural curiosity… You have another splendid package to put under the tree…

[gerigo]

@como Thanks for the review. Really very helpful!

Curious whether you have used either the Sailor Naginata or Aurora Goccia nibs? These have rather curved foot as shown here from Sailor's website. I believe it's this shape that allows for the "down stroke diagonal tapering to a very fine line" as you described.  Does the rather flat foot of the new calligraphy nib provide what is basically a much smaller surface area, i.e. a point rather than a wider area of contact that is provided by the Naginata nib? 

[kaisede]

Hi all, 

 

I reserved mine at NYC store. I was told the price is $1035. Once I get the call to pick up I will confirm the price. 

 

Thanks, 

Andy

[como]

16 hours ago, gerigo said:

@como Thanks for the review. Really very helpful!

Curious whether you have used either the Sailor Naginata or Aurora Goccia nibs? These have rather curved foot as shown here from Sailor's website. I believe it's this shape that allows for the "down stroke diagonal tapering to a very fine line" as you described.  Does the rather flat foot of the new calligraphy nib provide what is basically a much smaller surface area, i.e. a point rather than a wider area of contact that is provided by the Naginata nib? 

@gerigo I once tried a group of these pens (Zoom, Naginata Togi, Cross Music, Cross Point(?)) at a shop. At that time I didn’t know what I was doing and what I would do with these nibs. My reaction was “what was I supposed to do with these things? They surely look very interesting”. I didn’t think that with practice I may enjoy them. I remember that I particularly liked Sailor Cross Music because it could make EF all the way to a really thick line! But it was on a smaller Specialty Nib pen body and quite expensive!! I think the real comparable here would be a Sailor KOP Naginata Togi that is offered at $1,700, which is, well, expensive. 
 

Tapering: With these Sailor specialty nibs that I tried, It seems to me that tapering is done (at least more easily) with the “toe” of the nib. Doing so with the “heel” which is the wider part is more difficult for me, in the case of Fude, Zoom etc. The interesting thing about this MB Curved is that the “heel” is also very good for tapering. It may be a matter of skills (you see people write beautifully with pencil and ballpoint!). Of course I picked the tool that works for ME. So you decide what works better for you.

 

The widest stroke with this Curved nib is about 1mm (maybe a bit more depending on the paper and ink). I didn’t have a chance to measure these Naginata or Cross Music etc what their widest widths are. That may be a kind of a limitation, but on the other hand, it’s easier to control a narrower range of widths than otherwise. For example, one can struggle to write all words in the same size, if he/she can’t write a consistent width. It’s like write a sentence with F and B at the same time!

 

I hope my explanations are at least somewhat clear (not so easy to explain this nib!). 
 

@fpupulin Thank you very much for your kind and encouraging words. I’ve learned so much from you! It’s great that Montblanc is continuing down this path of calligraphy nibs (Flexible, and now Curved). I can only imagine and hope that they will eventually do a real “Italic” (say at 2.4mm) which would be a fantastic thing to cover many scripts!! And at a similar price point.

 

I will put this pen under the Christmas tree (just let me play a little longer 😀).

[Uncial]

Would someone be kind enough to post some pictures of writing samples in print and cursive in english? It looks like this might manage Irish scripts.

[como]

Paper: Tomoe River 52gsm

Ink: MB Royal Blue

 

Two observations:

 

1. Reverse writing, the nib width is very thin. See first line compared to second line which (in red) was written with a Pilot Custom 912 with Spencerian grind, a needle point.

 

2. Line 7 was written with the “heel” of the nib, which the line interestingly tapers back to a similar width as when tilted 70 degrees. The heel has a distinctive edge/ridge. I think this design allows the nib to produce “tapering” on both the toe and the heel, toe tapering being a bit easier to do.

 

@Uncial I don’t know if you can do Irish or Celtic script with this pen. I can’t. Personally I think a more suitable nib would be an Italic of some sort.

[Seney724]

5 hours ago, como said:

Paper: Tomoe River 52gsm

Ink: MB Royal Blue

 

Two observations:

 

1. Reverse writing, the nib width is very thin. See first line compared to second line which (in red) was written with a Pilot Custom 912 with Spencerian grind, a needle point.

 

2. Line 7 was written with the “heel” of the nib, which the line interestingly tapers back to a similar width as when tilted 70 degrees. The heel has a distinctive edge/ridge. I think this design allows the nib to produce “tapering” on both the toe and the heel, toe tapering being a bit easier to do.

 

@Uncial I don’t know if you can do Irish or Celtic script with this pen. I can’t. Personally I think a more suitable nib would be an Italic of some sort.

Thanks @como  This is so helpful!  Please remind us, are you right handed or left handed?

How would you compare the writing experience with this "Curved Calligraphy" nib versus your Fritz-Schimpf Italic Edge?

[Uncial]

5 hours ago, como said:

I don’t know if you can do Irish or Celtic script with this pen. I can’t. Personally I think a more suitable nib would be an Italic of some sort.

 

Thank you. I think you're right; it won't work for Irish scripts. It is perhaps too wet, but I think it looks like it would be too difficult to control the gradient also. I've been using a blade with a sweep cut as italic nibs don't give satisfactory results, but the blade is also very difficult to use. 'Blade twirling' as opposed to nib twirling is a skill that takes considerable time to master.

[como]

@Seney724 Right-handed. The Curved belongs to the group of nibs most relevant to Japanese/Chinese calligraphy (Zoom, Naginata Togi, Fude etc). The Italic Edge belongs to truncated nib group, suitable for many western scripts. And of course the 149C is the Flexible group of nibs for Copperplate, Spencerian type of scripts.

 

@Uncial Is Irish script similar to Celtic? In the books I have, I can find ductus for Celtic/Uncial script, but not exactly "Irish". When I find the ductus, I should be able to learn how to write it. Are you using something like a Pilot Parallel type of nib? I bought some Parallel nibs to try. They are cheap and excellent for doing Gothic type of scripts. I just don't love the Pilot Parallel aesthetically. But of course I don't want to spend the money to buy MB signature nibs of various kinds widths. I just have the Italic Edge, and it's enough to play with (plus a few Parallels when I really want to write something super wide).

 

Personally I think that the MB Curved is good for: 1. Japanese/Chinese calligraphy; 2. Sketching with different widths in one pen; or 3. Just to have a pen that mostly writes like a very big architect grind and write from very thin EF to like a 4B on horizontal strokes. There are surely other pens that can do that too, but I like the MB 149 combo.

 

On my Curved, the widest horizontal stroke is about the same as the vertical stroke of Italic Edge (which is around 4B), perhaps ever so slightly wider, so let's say 4B+. But this can vary from pen to pen.

[Seney724]

4 hours ago, como said:

@Seney724 Right-handed. The Curved belongs to the group of nibs most relevant to Japanese/Chinese calligraphy (Zoom, Naginata Togi, Fude etc). The Italic Edge belongs to truncated nib group, suitable for many western scripts. And of course the 149C is the Flexible group of nibs for Copperplate, Spencerian type of scripts.

 

@Uncial Is Irish script similar to Celtic? In the books I have, I can find ductus for Celtic/Uncial script, but not exactly "Irish". When I find the ductus, I should be able to learn how to write it. Are you using something like a Pilot Parallel type of nib? I bought some Parallel nibs to try. They are cheap and excellent for doing Gothic type of scripts. I just don't love the Pilot Parallel aesthetically. But of course I don't want to spend the money to buy MB signature nibs of various kinds widths. I just have the Italic Edge, and it's enough to play with (plus a few Parallels when I really want to write something super wide).

 

Personally I think that the MB Curved is good for: 1. Japanese/Chinese calligraphy; 2. Sketching with different widths in one pen; or 3. Just to have a pen that mostly writes like a very big architect grind and write from very thin EF to like a 4B on horizontal strokes. There are surely other pens that can do that too, but I like the MB 149 combo.

 

On my Curved, the widest horizontal stroke is about the same as the vertical stroke of Italic Edge (which is around 4B), perhaps ever so slightly wider, so let's say 4B+. But this can vary from pen to pen.

Thank you @como  As always, your post in response to my inquiry is so very helpful and informative.  I am very grateful.