Any idea what's going on with La Couronne du Comte?

[A Smug Dill]

53 minutes ago, TSherbs said:

No one denies that sometimes people get screwed over and are treated unfairly. For sure, that is the way it sometimes goes. I am saying that that sucks. 

 

My issue is you appeared to assert that it's unfair for credit card providers to set a 60-day limit on the window for claims, as opposed to it's unfair for merchants or artisans to not deliver their end of the bargain after taking the customers' money in full.

 

The credit card provider offering the customer any protection at all, and clearly stating the terms and limitations of that protection upfront in material published well before the orders in question were placed, is fair — commercially, legally, and I'd say ethically — in the relationship the customer has with their credit card provider.

 

[inkstainedruth]

On 9/23/2022 at 12:59 PM, SpecTP said:

 

even a physical check can be recalled/cancelled. Not so much with strictly cash transaction.

True, but banks often charge a fee for stopping payment on a check.  I found this out the hard way when paying for the repairs on the minivan yesterday.  Normally I pay the mechanic with a credit card, but his credit card company charges 15%.  So for a really large bill (critters got into the engine and chewed a bunch of the wiring and the car had to be towed home by flatbed and then again down the hill to the mechanic's.  The guy has been waiting for something like a MONTH for the parts to come in (and is now fighting with the insurance company over what he claims were completely unrealistic prices for the modules by the claims adjuster).  So when we went to get the vehicle yesterday, I paid by check.  Only then last night the mechanic called us up in a panic, to ask if we had accidentally taken the check home (no) because he couldn't find it!  So we had to go to the bank this morning to stop the check and will write him a new one on Monday.  Stopping the check cost us $35 US.  Although that's still less expensive than some thief trying to cash a check that large.

Ruth Morrisson aka inkstainedruth

 

[inkstainedruth]

On 9/23/2022 at 3:36 PM, bunnspecial said:

I bought a new weedeater a month or so back from a local outdoor equipment shop, and the shop owner told me before he'd even tell me the price on it that he was charges a 3% card fee. I went out and grabbed a checkbook out of my car to pay for it! A lot of other small local businesses around here don't, but I've largely gone to paying them in cash or check as I know CC fees eat into their bottom line quite a bit.

Ironically, back when I was in college, I went shopping one time in a local mall and went to buy a pair of shoes.  The clerk had to call the store owner/manager because I wanted to pay by check.  I didn't have a credit card back then (heck, my parents didn't even have credit cards other than maybe a couple of store specific cards at most, until I was in high school) -- and they didn't put stuff on layaway either.  If they didn't have the money?  The item didn't get bought.  So I told the clerk that if they didn't want to accept my check (with my college ID and out of state driver's license?  Well, I didn't have to buy the shoes at ALL (shrug).  And to tell the store manager I said that.  

Nowadays?  If you want to pay with a (possibly stolen) credit card, nobody blinks an eye.  Because of the swipe machines, people don't even check if the credit card has a signature on it (back years ago when I worked at a local Jo-Ann Fabrics, I had a customer one time who HADN'T signed her credit card and said she NEVER did!  Don't know what she thought when I pointed out that if her card got *stolen*, the thief could have put ANY signature on it and then of course the signature on the multi sheet carbon paper credit card receipt would match what was on the card.

Ruth Morrisson aka inkstainedruth

[TSherbs]

2 hours ago, A Smug Dill said:

 

My issue is you appeared to assert that it's unfair for credit card providers to set a 60-day limit on the window for claims, as opposed to it's unfair for merchants or artisans to not deliver their end of the bargain after taking the customers' money in full.

 

The credit card provider offering the customer any protection at all, and clearly stating the terms and limitations of that protection upfront in material published well before the orders in question were placed, is fair — commercially, legally, and I'd say ethically — in the relationship the customer has with their credit card provider.

 

Just because.....no, nevermind.

 

 

[Lam1]

5 hours ago, TSherbs said:

Jeez. I'm really sorry. That 60-day limit screws over every person who pays in full for a commision that takes longer than 60 days to complete. Seems unfair, arbitrary, whatever...

 

I guess moving on is the only option, but it ires me (my empathetic response)...

 

Thank you, @TSherbs. It is really appreciated.

 

You are right, moving on is the way to go.

Even though the amount lost is very significant for me, I decided not to dwell on it.

In the end I'm lucky to be able to enjoy the hobby and the many pens I have. 

Cheers!

[SpecTP]

I reached out to my cc and one of them already refunded me. The other one told me to send a written request to their HQ. Both of my orders were over a year old.

[Lam1]

8 hours ago, SpecTP said:

I reached out to my cc and one of them already refunded me. The other one told me to send a written request to their HQ. Both of my orders were over a year old.

 

Oh, that is good to know. Thanks.

I'll reach out to mine again.

[SpecTP]

9 hours ago, Lam1 said:

 

Oh, that is good to know. Thanks.

I'll reach out to mine again.

 

gather all your information of the transaction, put it all on paper and write a letter to HQ billing disputes of your cc. They will have more leeway to grant the request than the helpdesk billing dispute response.

[A Smug Dill]

PayPal just refunded all of my claims in ‘full’, i.e. for the disputed amount in each transaction, for unfulfilled and partially fulfilled orders. Presumably the curator of what's left of LCdC didn't bother responding at all to the claims (or inquiries) sent by PayPal on my behalf; and PayPal is not waiting until it (successfully or unsuccessfully) claws funds back from the failed business as an unsecured creditor, before issuing me the refunds.

 

Phew!

 

[TSherbs]

6 hours ago, A Smug Dill said:

PayPal just refunded all of my claims in ‘full’, i.e. for the disputed amount in each transaction, for unfulfilled and partially fulfilled orders. Presumably the curator of what's left of LCdC didn't bother responding at all to the claims (or inquiries) sent by PayPal on my behalf; and PayPal is not waiting until it (successfully or unsuccessfully) claws funds back from the failed business as an unsecured creditor, before issuing me the refunds.

 

Phew!

 

good news

[NeverTapOut]

I filed a dispute with PayPal. Since it was cash in my PayPal account and not a credit card do I still have a chance to get something back?

 

Here is a moral question...if Dennis knows that he is filing bankruptcy at what point does he stop taking money.

 

 

[A Smug Dill]

2 hours ago, NeverTapOut said:

I filed a dispute with PayPal. Since it was cash in my PayPal account and not a credit card do I still have a chance to get something back?

 

I think PayPal will treat your disputes in the same manner, irrespective of the payment source. Using a credit card as the payment source simply means there is a fallback position, by requesting a chargeback directly with your credit card provider, if PayPal doesn't come through.

 

2 hours ago, NeverTapOut said:

Here is a moral question...if Dennis knows that he is filing bankruptcy at what point does he stop taking money.

 

I think you need to separate Dennis the individual from LCdC the company. The day LCdC files for bankruptcy is when the company must halt trading, which means it must stop taking orders and payment from customers; and that is probably the day when the checkout functionality in LCdC's web shop was disabled (and disingenuously attributed to ‘malfunction’). Until such a point, the company was still trading. I don't think it makes any sense, morally or otherwise, to stop taking orders because a come-to-Jesus moment is looming on the horizon based on business/financial projections alone, before the company's management (in this case, Dennis) has come to a final conclusion of whether the company is insolvent and must file for bankruptcy; nor would it have made sense to warn customers that any orders (fully paid for, or otherwise) taken from that point are likely to fall through.

 

Where I have a real problem with the ethics is where refunds have already been requested — and those requests acknowledged by a member of LCdC's staff, not just a system's automated reply — weeks before the ‘malfunction’, but were not actioned even though the customer was told it will be done. (Disclosure: About a quarter of what PayPal gave me back should have been refunded by LCdC before the ‘malfunction’. LCdC's handling of the remainder of what it owed me ought not have been any different from payments received from other customers since the refund was expressly promised to me; I didn't and don't expect priority there.) I understand I'm far from the only customer in that position, being given hollow promises of refunds that just weren't issued, and follow-up requests silently ignored.

 

Maybe the company simply didn't have the funds in its accounts to pay out the refunds at the time; but if it continued trading, accepting new orders and taking payments, then presumably it had incoming cash flow to pay someone. I hope at least it means employees who may have been owed backpay at that point got paid with those funds, ahead of LCdC filing for bankruptcy. Notwithstanding the seeming incompetence of some of the staff members, as employees they still deserved to get paid their wages.

 

Here is a moral question for you: if Dennis knows that the company is in real trouble and teetering on the brink of collapse, should he as the executive and the employer look after LCdC's employees ahead of its (loyal, new, or otherwise) retail customers, while it is still trading?

[NeverTapOut]

Smug...I see your point.  I did not look at it from that perspective...

 

[Mew]

On 9/23/2022 at 1:36 AM, Linger said:

I have this little nagging voice in the back of my head telling me that it is not very likely that LCDC had to prepay their orders with Montblanc or Pelikan or Pilot…my assumptions is that is is more likely they first order and only pay upon delivery….and after yesterday’s news, i doubt that Montblanc c.s. would ship an unpaid order to a company in bankruptcy.

 

Ii feel like a victim, because I am a victim here, but I hate that feeling…my money is gone and there is only a very slight chance I might get a little bit of it back…

 

@Linger - I know another Dutch retailer whom I have been buying from since he opened his shop, and he told me this. At least with MontBlanc, they ask you to pay as soon as your order is ready to be shipped. No prior payment is required. 

[Linger]

Well, that is good news I guess. If the same applies with Pilot and Sailor, then maybe something is possible. I don't have my hopes up high though. It is not uncommon in the final phase before bankruptcy that “new” money is used to cover “old” debt. And two out of my three outstanding orders are from August…

[Mew]

On 10/8/2022 at 8:51 PM, Linger said:

Well, that is good news I guess. If the same applies with Pilot and Sailor, then maybe something is possible. I don't have my hopes up high though. It is not uncommon in the final phase before bankruptcy that “new” money is used to cover “old” debt. And two out of my three outstanding orders are from August…

 

I also have an outstanding order with them from last year, a MontBlanc Ferrari, the silver one. Never paid for it since I had switched to prompt payment 2-3 years ago when goods are ready to be dispatched. 

[The Phoenix 924]

On 10/10/2022 at 5:22 AM, Mew said:

 

I also have an outstanding order with them from last year, a MontBlanc Ferrari, the silver one. Never paid for it since I had switched to prompt payment 2-3 years ago when goods are ready to be dispatched. 

Same here; I'm wondering if I should be trying to get a refund from PayPal or my CC because I *did* pay. I'm guessing that's going to be a no-go, but it's worth asking. 😕

[TSherbs]

6 hours ago, The Phoenix 924 said:

Same here; I'm wondering if I should be trying to get a refund from PayPal or my CC because I *did* pay. I'm guessing that's going to be a no-go, but it's worth asking. 😕

 

I'm pretty sure that A Smug Dill reports above that he requested and already received his refund. Don't delay! Ask for it--you are entitled to it! 

[TSherbs]

On 10/4/2022 at 3:19 AM, A Smug Dill said:

PayPal just refunded all of my claims in ‘full’, i.e. for the disputed amount in each transaction, for unfulfilled and partially fulfilled orders. Presumably the curator of what's left of LCdC didn't bother responding at all to the claims (or inquiries) sent by PayPal on my behalf; and PayPal is not waiting until it (successfully or unsuccessfully) claws funds back from the failed business as an unsecured creditor, before issuing me the refunds.

 

Phew!

 

 

@The Phoenix 924 See?

[The Phoenix 924]

On 10/12/2022 at 4:50 PM, TSherbs said:

 

@The Phoenix 924 See?

Unfortunately, PayPal said they couldn't do anything for me because it's well over the 180 day limit. I'll be contacting my cc provider to see if they can do anything this week.