What pen(s) are you using today?

[Mark from Yorkshire]

@PAKMAN that is one nice looking fountain pen

[51ISH]

An early Parker 25 with blue trim that hasn't seen any use since school in the '70's 😄

 

I notice they are calling them 'Vintage Parker 25'  on Ebay 🤣

 

A couple of rinses with an ear bulb, and filled with Pelikan 4001 Bl/Blk  she seems to write much better than when I was in school. 🤣

[USG]

16 hours ago, essayfaire said:

Muscle weighs more than fat.

LatetothePartyMe was going to say that too....  🤪

[USG]

2 hours ago, PAKMAN said:

 

It's so nice.... I'm closing my eyes and resisting.......  🙈

[Mercian]

On 2/7/2023 at 1:43 AM, USG said:

One of the problems I find with looking at scanned colors and reading ink reviews is that the lighting and the color of the paper are critical.  In your pic, you're using  a vintage paper and I'm guessing the lighting is a yellowish light as opposed to white light or daylight.

A lot of what you wrote looks like the same color as my sample, so there's that.

The color difference starts when you begin to thin out the ink to the point where the color of the paper (showing through) and the lighting are having an effect.

 

My preference is to judge the color of an ink from a medium nib, where the color becomes stable.   Sure, if you write with Havana light enough, there may not be enough color on the page for it to look brown, and  the light brown may not look brown anymore.

 

I have since changed to white LED light.  Now I really don't know your light source but the the pic is not evenly illuminated nor bright enough to really see the color of the ink except at the bottom where it's brighter and I'm going to call that light brown and not red, because I know Havana is a brown ink.🙂

 

As for your Havana, the samples in the pic you posted, where there was enough ink on the page to see the true color was the same as the color on my samples, written with a medium nib on a dip pen. I don't think a pale version of a color should be considered its true color.  So if a pale enemic line from a fine nib, on yellow paper, under yellow light, looks maroon to you, it's because you haven't laid down enough ink to see the true color of Havana. 🙂

I’ve edited the above quote a bit, to compress it.

 

Believe it or not, I took my photo in direct daylight 😮

Or at least what passes for daylight at this time of year in the Midlands of England. No wonder I have S.A.D., eh? 😉

 

The paper is indeed ‘vintage’, but it’s the paper in my ‘ink testing notebook’, because it is a very white paper that doesn’t have a hard coating or optical brighteners. It does tend to suppress any shading from an ink, but it also showcases the colour of any ink very accurately.

 

On your substantive point about the ‘weight’ of ink being deposited, I agree with you.

In the words that I wrote slowly with the Vector with the italic nib, I do indeed perceive Havana to be quite brown on that paper. Where I wrote at my usual (impatient) pace with the italic nib, or with the Parker 45 with its ‘M’ nib, I perceive the Havana to be ‘maroon’ - as you say, a ‘dark red’ colour.

 

OK, so my 45 is from the late 1970s, and its ‘M’ nib is narrower and ‘drier’ than are the ‘M’ nibs on my later Parkers, but with my ‘wettest’ Parker ‘M’ nib - the one on my 1980s French Parker 75 - I still perceive Havana to be ‘maroon’. I also perceive it to be ‘maroon’ from the ‘M’ nibs of my 1990s Vector, 2000s Jotter, and 2000s Frontier.

 

My conclusions:

I think that my perception of Havana as being more ‘maroon’ than brown is attributable to two things:

 

1- the fact that my handwriting is a rushed and impatient scrawl, coupled with the fact that I use ‘narrow’/‘dry’ nibs, means that my hand does not give my pens enough time on the paper to lay down enough ink for the ‘true’ colour of ‘Havana’ to become evident;

 

2- my ‘expectation’ of a ‘brown’ ink was defined by my experience with my first ‘brown’ ink (Penman Mocha), and it has been reinforced by my later experiences with Diamine Chocolate Brown and Pelikan Edelstein ‘Smoky Quartz’.

I am glad to be living in a time when so many different inks are available - it means that I can find inks that are dark enough and ‘wet’ enough for me to perceive them as ‘brown’ even with my rushed scrawl 🙂

 

As such, I think that Waterman ‘Havana’ may well be the ideal ink for me to use when trying to learn calligraphic hands - because its colour properties will ’nudge’ me to s-l-o-w d-o-w-n my impatient scrawl! 😁

[USG]

17 minutes ago, Mercian said:

I’ve edited the above quote a bit, to compress it.

 

Believe it or not, I took my photo in direct daylight 😮

Or at least what passes for daylight at this time of year in the Midlands of England. No wonder I have S.A.D., eh? 😉

 

The paper is indeed ‘vintage’, but it’s the paper in my ‘ink testing notebook’, because it is a very white paper that doesn’t have a hard coating or optical brighteners. It does tend to suppress any shading from an ink, but it also showcases the colour of any ink very accurately.

 

On your substantive point about the ‘weight’ of ink being deposited, I agree with you.

In the words that I wrote slowly with the Vector with the italic nib, I do indeed perceive Havana to be quite brown on that paper. Where I wrote at my usual (impatient) pace with the italic nib, or with the Parker 45 with its ‘M’ nib, I perceive the Havana to be ‘maroon’ - as you say, a ‘dark red’ colour.

 

OK, so my 45 is from the late 1970s, and its ‘M’ nib is narrower and ‘drier’ than are the ‘M’ nibs on my later Parkers, but with my ‘wettest’ Parker ‘M’ nib - the one on my 1980s French Parker 75 - I still perceive Havana to be ‘maroon’. I also perceive it to be ‘maroon’ from the ‘M’ nibs of my 1990s Vector, 2000s Jotter, and 2000s Frontier.

 

My conclusions:

I think that my perception of Havana as being more ‘maroon’ than brown is attributable to two things:

 

1- the fact that my handwriting is a rushed and impatient scrawl, coupled with the fact that I use ‘narrow’/‘dry’ nibs, means that my hand does not give my pens enough time on the paper to lay down enough ink for the ‘true’ colour of ‘Havana’ to become evident;

 

2- my ‘expectation’ of a ‘brown’ ink was defined by my experience with my first ‘brown’ ink (Penman Mocha), and it has been reinforced by my later experiences with Diamine Chocolate Brown and Pelikan Edelstein ‘Smoky Quartz’.

I am glad to be living in a time when so many different inks are available - it means that I can find inks that are dark enough and ‘wet’ enough for me to perceive them as ‘brown’ even with my rushed scrawl 🙂

 

As such, I think that Waterman ‘Havana’ may well be the ideal ink for me to use when trying to learn calligraphic hands - because its colour properties will ’nudge’ me to s-l-o-w d-o-w-n my impatient scrawl! 😁

 

First of all we have to agree that Waterman Havana belongs in the family of Brown inks and not in the family or Red inks.

 

If we can agree, Here's the deal.  You're misusing the term Maroon. 

 

Maroon is  a shade of red into which blue/violet or Brown have been added.

 

Havana is a brown ink in into which red has been added. 

 

As Havana thins out it naturally gets lighter and lighter and could easily be misinterpreted as belonging to the Maroon family of red.

 

But, since Havana, is a brown ink, it started out with a higher ratio of brown to red and no matter how much you thin it out the ratio of brown to red stays the same.

 

The color you're incorrectly calling Maroon is really a light reddish brown.  There may be other names for that color but Maroon is not one of them.

 

In order to be Maroon, a brownish red,  it would have to have higher rations of red to brown, the opposite of the ratios in Havana.

 

Nevertheless, if you want to call Havana, Maroon, I will know what you mean. 😃

[Mercian]

51 minutes ago, USG said:

The color you're incorrectly calling Maroon is really a light reddish brown.  There may be other names for that color but Maroon is not one of them.

If you perceive ‘Havana’ to be ‘pure brown’ that’s great, and (as I wrote before) I am happy to accept that I perceive it as ‘maroon’ because I rush my handwriting, and so the line produced on the page when I write with it is insufficiently saturated for enough ink to be laid down to make it appear ‘brown’, but…

 

according to what you yourself quoted on pg163 of this thread:

 

“The Wiki says:

 

"The Cambridge English Dictionary defines maroon as a dark reddish-purple color while its "American Dictionary" section defines maroon as dark brown-red or burgundy color.”

 

When I use ‘Havana’ to write with my pens I perceive it to be a dark brown-red.

Which matches what your source cites as the ‘American’ definition of ‘maroon’, no?

 

 

[AmandaW]

I still think it could be a mis-translation. The original being marron = brown, that someone inadvertently made maroon on an English version of the packaging.

 

Or just a typo (like Private Reserve's Avacado).

[PAKMAN]

Mine said Marron on the packaging when I bought it here in the USA.

[USG]

21 minutes ago, Mercian said:

If you perceive ‘Havana’ to be ‘pure brown’ that’s great, and (as I wrote before) I am happy to accept that I perceive it as ‘maroon’ because I rush my handwriting, and so the line produced on the page when I write with it is insufficiently saturated for enough ink to be laid down to make it appear ‘brown’, but…

 

according to what you yourself quoted on pg163 of this thread:

 

 

“The Wiki says:

 

"The Cambridge English Dictionary defines maroon as a dark reddish-purple color while its "American Dictionary" section defines maroon as dark brown-red or burgundy color.”

 

When I use ‘Havana’ to write with my pens I perceive it to be a dark brown-red.

Which matches what your source cites as the ‘American’ definition of ‘maroon’, no?

 

 

 

I see, you don't want to agree that Waterman Havana belongs in the family of Brown inks and not in the family or Red inks.  You still insist on misusing the term Maroon. 🙂

 

Haha, I told you there was controversy... but only in the world of dictionary definitions of what shade of RED Maroon is.

 

 

In Maroon the base color is red and in Havana the base color is brown.

 

Havana Brown can express itself in a range of reddish Brown shades,  not a range of brownish Red shades as you imply by calling it Maroon.

 

Maroon is defined as A dark reddish purple or a dark brown-red or a burgundy color.

 

Purple, red and burgundy doesn't magically turn Maroon into the reddish Brown of Havana ink.  In each case notice what the BASE color is.

 

(btw calling purple a color is a misnomer because purple is a range of colors not a single color)

[essayfaire]

23 hours ago, Ceilidh said:

Haha! Ya beat me to it!

😅

[essayfaire]

1 hour ago, AmandaW said:

I still think it could be a mis-translation. The original being marron = brown, that someone inadvertently made maroon on an English version of the packaging.

 

Or just a typo (like Private Reserve's Avacado).

This makes sense.  Marron=chestnut brown, which does actually have a warm glow to it.

[kazoolaw]

On 2/10/2023 at 7:40 PM, A Smug Dill said:

 

Just don't over-indulge! 😶 I did more running in the past seven days than my slacking weekly average for the past year… and, when I weighed myself just now, my weight has gone up! 🤔

All muscle no doubt.

[Penguincollector]

Today is a special day- I have a dozen out of fourteen penguin themed fountain pens inked for a pen club show and tell this afternoon. While none are super expensive and most are school pens, there are a few that have a cool spin on them, like erasable ink, stress relief, and character faces that attatch to the clip. Then, there’s George the penguin.

[finalidid]

On 2/6/2023 at 1:56 PM, Mercian said:

 there is this comment by @finalidid, in which ...he recounts the experience of having had Havana dry out to a green crust in some pens (follow the link to see more details).

 

I haven't logged in to Fountain Pen Network in several years. My previous post was nine years and two months ago. Today I returned for a reason unrelated to this thread (wanting a repair on a P51) but saw one notification that I'd been quoted.

 

Amazing serendipity, my return happens less than a week after I got quoted, and that's the only citation which happened in the entire interim. A fifteen-year-old post of mine (literally!) somehow called to me from the webvoids ... (My ancient comment about browns is still legit, BTW.)

 

[51ISH]

6 hours ago, Penguincollector said:

Today is a special day- I have a dozen out of fourteen penguin themed fountain pens inked for a pen club show and tell this afternoon. While none are super expensive and most are school pens, there are a few that have a cool spin on them, like erasable ink, stress relief, and character faces that attatch to the clip. Then, there’s George the penguin.

That sure sounds like some special day. Hope you all had a great day!

[51ISH]

I was so impressed with the shading of the  Pelikan 4001  Blue/Black in my humble Parker 25 I think I'll be using this combo for a while 🙂 I've not used the Pelikan Blu/blk in a long while, and the Parker 25 in 50 years....👍

 

 

 

k

[AmandaW]

Today's journal is another I think of as 'the pen equivalent of comfort food' - it may not be exciting to anyone else, but for me it writes reliably and well.

 

It's a vintage Sailor Pocket pen inked with Sailor Doyou. The nib is smooth with just a hint of pencil-like feedback, without feeling at all dry.

 

[51ISH]

8 minutes ago, AmandaW said:

Today's journal is another I think of as 'the pen equivalent of comfort food' - it may not be exciting to anyone else, but for me it writes reliably and well.

 

It's a vintage Sailor Pocket pen inked with Sailor Doyou. The nib is smooth with just a hint of pencil-like feedback, without feeling at all dry.

 

Not exciting ?? I think a vintage Sailor Pocket Pen is much more exciting than the Parker 25 I'm using 👍

[Penguincollector]

@51ISH, thanks- it was less stressful than I expected, and very fun. It’s funny that both you and @AmandaWkinda pooh-pooh your pens but I have been looking for both the blue and green Parker 25s and have lately been taken with Japanese pocket pens.  They are both cool!