Extra Extra Fine (European)

[Flagstaff Tom]

Is the Lamy 2000 EF the finest/sharpest nib one can find, in the European pens? Or does someone make an EEF as a stock item? 

[A Smug Dill]

25 minutes ago, Flagstaff Tom said:

Is the Lamy 2000 EF the finest/sharpest nib one can find, in the European pens?

 

No. For starters, Lamy's other EF nibs write finer; but, of course, they aren't the finest nibs to be found on European pens out-of-the-box either.

 

You were wise to exclude American brands from this discussion, by the way.

 

28 minutes ago, Flagstaff Tom said:

Or does someone make an EEF as a stock item? 

 

Yes. European, no less. 

[Recursion]

You can order the Scribo Piuma with an EEF nib

[Flagstaff Tom]

2 hours ago, A Smug Dill said:

 

No. For starters, Lamy's other EF nibs write finer; but, of course, they aren't the finest nibs to be found on European pens out-of-the-box either.

 

 

Which nibs do you find the finest out of the box?

[A Smug Dill]

On 12/25/2021 at 6:57 AM, Flagstaff Tom said:

Which nibs do you find the finest out of the box?

 

Within the strict scope of “the European pens”, i.e. excluding Japanese, Chinese, and American brands? The EF nib on my Diplomat Aero is very fine.

Some Aurora stainless steel EF nibs are quite fine out-of-the-box, but I would not make that a general comment pertaining all Aurora stainless steel EF nibs, much less all Aurora EF nibs (i.e. including 14K and 18K gold nibs).

 

Some of the Lamy stainless steel EF nibs are OK.

 

With both Aurora and Lamy nibs, I think the black PVD-coated nibs tend to write finer because the finish seem to make the ink flow a bit less wet.

 

However, I wouldn't generally look to European pens when I'm trying to put down the finest lines. Japanese pens from any of the Big Three brands would be the first place I'd look. Many Chinese pens with physically small-sized nibs write finely, including but not limited to those that use German-made Schmidt gold-coloured stainless steel EF nibs (with or without rebranding; but my statement does not pertain to the silver-coloured nibs). Small-sized HongDian and Delike stainless steel nibs, too. Opus 88 from Taiwan supply small-sized, JoWo-made stainless steel EF nibs on its Picnic and Koloro models that write finely out-of-the-box. The “JoWo #6” stainless steel EF nibs on Fine Writing International (also from Taiwan) Planets series pens write finely out-of-the-box. The nibs on the Cross Peerless 125 is made by Sailor Pen, and perform similarly to the gold nibs Sailor fits on the brand's own pens. (I'd imagine Taccia pens, which also sport Sailor-made nibs, would be in the same boat.) The EF nib on my Edison Pen Co. Collier pen writes so finely that it matches or perhaps even surpasses some Japanese EF-nibbed pens. 

[Bo Bo Olson]

Good post.

 

Aurora use to be the thinnest of the European nibs, near as narrow as Japanese..............but you would have to go semi-vintage and it might well be semi-flex, which unless you have a Very Light Hand, would make your EFF into EF or F.

 

I have to admit I don't know anything about modern stiffer than semi-flex Aurora nibs. I never got around to getting a semi-flex Aurora 88.

I tend to doubt if their modern nibs are regular flex...would WAG they make the common semi-nail and nail nibs out side the rip off "flexi" nib.

 

I don't care for Spiderweb and Baby Spiderweb nibs; but if I did I'd go Japanese.  Some say Sailor is the Fat Japanese nib... again I don't know which is the skinniest Japanese nib.

 

For super skinny nibs you need very wet ink..................imo Japanese inks are expensive.................but you have to match ink to the nib, no matter what company nib you buy.

 

One could always send one's pen off to a nibmeister and there are some in Europe, and have your nib made EEF....western which is only EF Japanese. Japanese EFF = XXXF European.

[A Smug Dill]

5 hours ago, Bo Bo Olson said:

For super skinny nibs you need very wet ink..................imo Japanese inks are expensive.................but you have to match ink to the nib, no matter what company nib you buy.

 

In my experience with my wife's and my around 100 Japanese pens and 375 commercially available inks, no, one does not have to match the brand, or even country of origin, of the ink with that of the pen and/or nib, other than for personal preferences. Any number of my German, Italian and Chinese fountain pens will write happily with Platinum Carbon Black and Sailor Seiboku inks; and I have had no issues with putting Diamine Oxblood in my EF-nibbed Pilot Elite 95S, Diamine Graphite in my F-nibbed Monteverde Monza, etc. I had Noodler's X-Feather black ink in my EF-nibbed Rotring 400 for years on end; and, come to think of it, that was/is one of the finest European nib out-of-the-box, but of course the brand has long since exited the fountain pen market.

[Bo Bo Olson]

R&K costs me E8-50, Pelikan 4001 @ E5-6 or so. Herbin has jumped in price but is still affordable.

 

Kno Peki cost me E-25 which I find expensive as all hell.

 

MB shoe jumped form 15 to 19 to E-23 in three years. LE's from 25 to E-33 or more.

 

I have made a personal border, no inks over at or over E20.

The Japanese ink was just to try it. I'll not be buying anymore.

It is as said a real wet ink to be used in a real narrow nib. Like Waterman ink was a wet ink for the narrow for western nibs.

 

Pelikan Edelstein has jumped from E16.50 to E 18.50 so there will come a day soon when it hits E20 and I stop buying it.

 

High ink price has nothing to do with 'inflation'; just greed; some idiots are buying over priced inks.

 

GvFC, Cd'A so MB has to keep up with the Jones and the Japanese inks have always been E22-25 after amazon started delivering the E-78 inks 'cheap'. E-78 was the normal price of Japanese ink here in Germany 3-4 or so years ago.

So I never worried about it.

 

 

I was happy my kon-peki shaded, didn't expect it.

 

With 90 inks, 70+ ink bottles many still mostly full. I am set for ink.....can't use them all....unless I live to be 90. So it's not going to kill me to use common sense in ink buying.

Besides which there is those Paris inks, Polish inks and even Diamine. All affordable.

Not counting those three, Hell I never got my basic 100 mainland inks so never chased Diamine, but I've just put that on my ink list also.

[Inkysloth]

In my experience, Kaweco nibs can be variable re: sizing, but I've now had two Kaweco EFs that were very fine - finer than my Lamy 2000 or Safari etc EFs, though marginally thicker than my Sailor Pro Gear Slim EF.