A quote a day (or whatever stuff whenever I can)

[txomsy]

That's another one.

 

The "collective unconscious" of Jung (the body of mental traits shared by practically all humans --there are always exceptions) can be construed as referring to our common wisdom as well as to our common stupidity, misconceptions and prejudices. And much as we have witty sayings in all cultures, most of which (the sayings) have equivalent parallels in all cultures (meaning we all arrived at the same wisdom), we also share all many common faults.

 

We like to think well of ourselves, but should not forget we all share the same faults (or "Original Sin", for whatever that means --don't want to go down that road here) as well.

 

Hence Seneca's assertion makes full sense: "if you hate a wrongdoer (ignoring you carry the same low instincts and may unleash them as well), you are hating everyone (for everyone is alike and capable of the same)".

 

It would do us a lot of good if we tried to be aware of our own stupidity and carry that always in our mind (kinda like Socrates "I only know I know nothing").

 

Shamelessly hijacking @PuliMorgan's thread (I hope it is OK):

 

[PuliMorgan]

6 hours ago, txomsy said:

That's another one.

 

The "collective unconscious" of Jung (the body of mental traits shared by practically all humans --there are always exceptions) can be construed as referring to our common wisdom as well as to our common stupidity, misconceptions and prejudices. And much as we have witty sayings in all cultures, most of which (the sayings) have equivalent parallels in all cultures (meaning we all arrived at the same wisdom), we also share all many common faults.

 

We like to think well of ourselves, but should not forget we all share the same faults (or "Original Sin", for whatever that means --don't want to go down that road here) as well.

 

Hence Seneca's assertion makes full sense: "if you hate a wrongdoer (ignoring you carry the same low instincts and may unleash them as well), you are hating everyone (for everyone is alike and capable of the same)".

 

It would do us a lot of good if we tried to be aware of our own stupidity and carry that always in our mind (kinda like Socrates "I only know I know nothing").

 

Shamelessly hijacking @PuliMorgan's thread (I hope it is OK):

 

 

 

I enjoy your writing - both the content and the handwriting. Everyone is welcome to add their thoughts, handwritten or otherwise. So please don't think that you are hijacking 🙂

[PuliMorgan]

 

Yet another Marcus Aurelius quote. Final phrase is intentionally stricken off.

[bill88]

17 hours ago, PuliMorgan said:

Final phrase is intentionally stricken off.

 

 Why is that?

 

[txomsy]

I'd venture either a ) to comply with the forum rules, b ) a personal conception of what the last word means, c ) to avoid misinterpretation by people who understand the concept differently (it does indeed have way too many conflicting interpretations, hence "a )" ), d ) any combination or all of the above.

 

[bill88]

39 minutes ago, txomsy said:

I'd venture either a ) to comply with the forum rules, b ) a personal conception of what the last word means, c ) to avoid misinterpretation by people who understand the concept differently (it does indeed have way too many conflicting interpretations, hence "a )" ), d ) any combination or all of the above.

 

Sounds reasonable.

[PuliMorgan]

7 hours ago, bill88 said:

 

 Why is that?

 

 

5 hours ago, txomsy said:

I'd venture either a ) to comply with the forum rules, b ) a personal conception of what the last word means, c ) to avoid misinterpretation by people who understand the concept differently (it does indeed have way too many conflicting interpretations, hence "a )" ), d ) any combination or all of the above.

 

 

Option b.

[PuliMorgan]

 

🙁

[ParramattaPaul]

On 8/24/2021 at 3:12 AM, txomsy said:

Sorry, the "fascist" adjective woke me up.

 

Seems to me that there is much misunderstanding around Ancient Philosophy or, most likely, any Philosophy in general. Most currents have been distorted by clichés from their detractors or later "philosophers" who had little to add and needed to somehow "set aside" themselves; to the extent they are unrecognizable.

 

Stoicism is not that different from Buddhism once you look at both. Or from Cynicism when you get to the bottom. Or even from Christianity when you look at the overall message (I bring these not for their religious weight but for their tolerance, compassionate approach to Life.

 

When taken at face value (considering their historic-cultural context) I can hardly see anything "fascist" in any of them, specially when they say you should forgive offenders and build your life around your own virtue. Actually Christianism drank from Stoicism until the Modern Age (Seneca, for instance, was even considered a Church Father and proto-Christian Saint). St. Augustine cites Seneca saying "omnes odit, qui malos odit", (he who hates wrongdoers, hates everyone) which can only be understood as "do not hate anyone, not even wrongdoers" and hardly can be construed as a "hate" philosophy.

 

Yeah, you'll see signs of the times (which we must remember were quite different) in any philosophical system; and much picky misunderstanding (Seneca, for instance again, was accused of hypocrisy, but he made it clear his goal was to depend on nothing, not to renounce everything, Marcus Aurelius, being emperor, wasn't so openly criticized), which subsequent wannabee cult-creators will exploit to pursue their own agenda. But even so, in most cases you'll see they were more modern and encompassing than most current streams of thought; after all, they are the foundations over which modern thought is built, curiously, by adding upon, not by breaking with.

 

And it is only sensible: any successful line of thought must build upon the same universal principles that have worked for most people in most communities, and will include a core of similar or related behaviors (mixed with a hoard of differentiating 'peculiarities', of course). An idea which must not be so evident itself, considering it took until Jung in the 20th Century to verbalize it as a "collective unconscious" and even longer for people to understand what Jung was referring to.

 

The point is, "Great" philosophers (like great artists) experienced very complex, abstract feelings and subtle reasoning which matches collective sensibility , which they tried to express --verbally as knowledge-systems in the case of philosophers-- (i.e. everyone can express complex, abstract constructions, but the ones we consider great are the ones whose constructs match ours, and those who match most people's become truly "Great"); and which most subsequent and less-capable "successors" have struggled to understand, fit into their short-sighted schemes or disparage to make room for their own.

 

Shortly, applying "fascist" to philosophical system is a lame excuse not to discuss its actual content.

 

I agree with Puli.  You have provided us with a very articulate summation.  Thank you.

[ParramattaPaul]

4 hours ago, PuliMorgan said:

 

 

Option b.

Fair enough.  The word is, in truth, defined by ones' belief structure.

[PuliMorgan]

[ParramattaPaul]

'Tactics is planning one's next move.  Strategy is planning the end game.'  Anon.

[PuliMorgan]

2 hours ago, ParramattaPaul said:

'Tactics is planning one's next move.  Strategy is planning the end game.'  Anon.

 

Effectively it is the same message, because we never know the endgame.

 

It would be great if you can write these quotes and upload an image. The idea is to encourage the art of writing, at least a sentence a day 🙂.

[PuliMorgan]

[PuliMorgan]

 

OK, time for the serenity prayer (or rather, the serenity affirmation) again.

[brokenclay]

@PuliMorgan, I like how you present your quotes on all sorts of different papers!

[PuliMorgan]

4 hours ago, brokenclay said:

@PuliMorgan, I like how you present your quotes on all sorts of different papers!

 

Thank you. The last one was written on the left over piece from my son's school art work 🙂

[PuliMorgan]

[PuliMorgan]

[PuliMorgan]