Lamy 2000 2021 edition?

[peroride]

Pure Pens gets the drop on #2793

• T53 Crystal Topaz ink looks like a match!
• Looks like Herr G.A. Müller was a bit forgotten 😕 I certainly appreciate his work with Lamy 👍
• Purdy, Purdy 🥰 but i did not take the plunge, my original black L2K would be jealous.

 

[A Smug Dill]

7 minutes ago, peroride said:

T53 Crystal Topaz ink looks like a match!

 

Lamy Topaz ink has already ruined two of my Moonman pens (by turning into something akin to unbreakable glue on the nib housings, even though it should not have been able to seep onto the external threads during filling or active use of the pens). Given that Lamy Benitoite has managed to make the piston mechanism in my Lamy 2000 blue Bauhaus edition pen rather resistant after just one fill, and I ‘had to’ disassemble the pen and give it a thorough cleaning and servicing to restore the smoothness of the piston motion, I certainly wouldn't recommend the use of Lamy Topaz in a limited edition (and pricey, too!) piston-filler. Anyone who is game should try it in a Lamy 2000 Makrolon first; at least that would be readily replaceable (for only a quarter or a fifth of the price of the 2021 LE pen) should worse comes to worst.

[Dione]

Yes Pure Pens sent me an email that included it. Shame it's F nib only

[Wayne H]

10 hours ago, A Smug Dill said:

 

Lamy Topaz ink has already ruined two of my Moonman pens (by turning into something akin to unbreakable glue on the nib housings, even though it should not have been able to seep onto the external threads during filling or active use of the pens). Given that Lamy Benitoite has managed to make the piston mechanism in my Lamy 2000 blue Bauhaus edition pen rather resistant after just one fill, and I ‘had to’ disassemble the pen and give it a thorough cleaning and servicing to restore the smoothness of the piston motion, I certainly wouldn't recommend the use of Lamy Topaz in a limited edition (and pricey, too!) piston-filler. Anyone who is game should try it in a Lamy 2000 Makrolon first; at least that would be readily replaceable (for only a quarter or a fifth of the price of the 2021 LE pen) should worse comes to worst.

Oh wow! So you recommend that I remove the Lamy Benitoite ink from my Lamy 2000 blue Bauhaus? I like the way it writes and it does not seem to have a flow issue but your statement concerns me. May I ask what ink you are using in your Lamy? Thanks

 

[A Smug Dill]

6 minutes ago, Wayne H said:

May I ask what ink you are using in your Lamy? Thanks

 

I'm not using my Lamy 2000 blue Bauhaus pen. I've only filled it once, and concluded that I don't like its EF nib; it's nowhere near fine enough for my tastes, and the architect nib style grind does the opposite of what I like. I still have a Lamy 2000 Makrolon (also with an EF nib) that I've never inked or used, and just waiting for the right opportunity to give it away. We have a family friend who is somewhat interested in fountain pens, and while she also likes fine and precise nibs, I don't think she's quite as particular as myself in that regard; so I might give (or at least offer) it to her, but we're deep in lockdown in Sydney at the moment, at least until the end of August, so it'll be months before we see her.

[peroride]

15 hours ago, A Smug Dill said:

I certainly wouldn't recommend the use of Lamy Topaz in a limited edition

Good to know and makes sense to test before commitment.  So looks like 2 colors of the T53 Crystal line: Topaz and Benitoite are sticky 😐, reviews seems to point a dry ink for both colors. I wonder if the rest of the colors are similarly affected.

[stephanos]

I have really enjoyed reading this thread.

 

Here are a few thoughts.

First, the nib. Some have complained that the Brown edition comes only with a Fine nib: for information, Fritz Schimpf offers a nib-swap option, though it delays delivery by two weeks. As of now, late afternoon Central European time on 1 August 2021, they are still showing the pen as being in stock. Other sellers may offer the same nib-swap service. So it is definitely possible to buy the pen with a different nib size. I have no relation to the store, apart from being a repeat customer.

 

Second, the packaging is huge. I don't think I've ever seen such enormous packaging before. Delta had some large packaging, but this is even bigger. Completely extravagant. If you like keeping boxes, you may have a space problem.

 

Third, aesthetics: the pen itself is lovely. The dark brown colour is pretty, and distinct enough from the standard model. And the brown clip adds value rather than detracting from the pen. The dark blue version had a polished clip that is also different from the standard clip. Your mileage may vary, but overall, I really like it.

 

Fourth, price. Yes, it's very expensive. Is is worth the money? No. Of course not. But also, yes, definitely. Fountain pens are luxury items. Most of the world would think you mad if you paid 'even' the price of a standard L2K for a fountain pen, with the possible exception of its being an extravagant gift. Honestly, if you wanted a fountain pen that was sold in line with its "intrinsic value" you'd probably buy a Preppy or perhaps splash out on a Prefounte; certainly nothing more expensive than a TWSBI Go. But of course I do occasionally buy unreasonably-expensive pens and typically have no regrets, making those purchases worth the money to me. As a buyer of fontain pens, I really dislike the trend of increasingly higher prices, and as a result there are plenty of pens that I like but which I simply refuse to buy, even if I can afford them. To me, overpricing tells me that a company no longer wants my business; sometimes this is a pity, but I don't typically get emotional about it. I like the idea of being a completionist and collecting every edition of a particular model, but I've managed to wean myself (mostly) of that mania. Having said all of that, I am well aware that playing with fountain pens is a great luxury that the overwhelming majority of the world's population will never have (pen pricing: #FirstWorldProblems).

 

Fifth, profit. Someone mentioned the need for companies to make a healthy profit in order to innovate. I'll add the following story from an interview that I saw some years ago with the founder of a beverage company, paraphrasing for brevity. When they started, they gave a large proportion of their profits to charitable causes (largely supporting development projects, via a foundation IIRC). Within a few years the company was facing collapse, as they were very limited in their ability to expand or innovate. So they reduced their charitable giving to a smaller proportion (10% IIRC) and the company recovered and thrived. And of course, the giving itself achieved greater longevity.

 

Finally, @ Dr Nanders9: Congratulations!

 

 

 

[N1003U]

1 hour ago, stephanos said:

 

Here are a few thoughts

Well said. Thank you for the thoughts.

[peroride]

Wonderful constructive thoughts, well said, thank you! 👋 

 

 

[1nkulus]

On 7/23/2021 at 1:03 AM, A Smug Dill said:

I don't think the brown Lamy 2000 limited edition is worth the asking price. I've decided not to buy one myself. It doesn't make me angry or disappointed at all that I don't gain anything — not profit, not satisfaction — from this limited edition release; and it's perfectly OK, from my point of view, for any particular self-styled “loyal fan” to not gain anything from it, while up to 3300 other Lamy customers (however else they identify) may get some enjoyment, pride of ownership and/or resale profit out of it. Nobody except Lamy is at risk of losing either money or their trusty writing instruments — namely the Lamy 2000 variants they already have, or have been using — from this; and if anyone is losing sleep over this, it's neither an affliction of Lamy's making nor one for others to share.

 

+1

 

On 7/23/2021 at 5:43 AM, IThinkIHaveAProblem said:

have at 'er

fill yer boots with your 700$ "200$" pen.

 

At this point, one of two things is happening

1) you guys honestly think paying too much is a good thing and will do anything to justify it

2) and the more likely one: you're all trolling me for comedic effect which I will no longer entertain you with

 

 

I don't think there is any trolling, the thread has simply progressed to an elevated discussion.

It is a forum and everyone is allowed to express their POV.

 

You do have a moral point but Lamy is a 'for profit' company and only they can decide how much profit is enough.

 

The blue version was 1919 units, this brown version has 3300 units.

I expect the next colour to be more expensive and 5000 units. Why? because 'they can'.

 

Labeling it 'LE' elevates the price and Lamy will keep pushing this price till the market can no longer sustain it.

Think of it as a contest for the top 3300 Lamy fans.

 

The price is not for the pen, but a chance to be different. What price can you put on that feeling?

There is no right answer, it is entirely subjective.

 

I consider it a L2K with a new paint job, but my feelings/thoughts are immaterial and I don't qualify as a 'top' fan.

 

Lamy still caters to the 'average' user with plenty of variety and the brown version is still a L2K.

They have not created a 'technically new' pen, so I see no reason for the 'average' user to feel short changed/left out.

The Makrolon and SS variants are still readily available at a reasonable/affordable price point for those wishing to experience them.

[austollie]

39 minutes ago, 1nkulus said:

I don't think there is any trolling, the thread has simply progressed to an elevated discussion.

I agree with that statement.  This thread has indeed evolved and I've really enjoyed participating in the discussion and reading the views that are different to mine.  As long as the exchange stays respectful, which it has, then I think that it's a good thing that we get to be exposed to so many passionately expressed views.

 

I, for one, will maintain my different opinion to that of the 3,300 purchasers of this LE (assuming Lamy finds that many buyers at a price that I consider to be exorbitant).  Good luck to those, who have a different view (which I am only too happy to read about).  I will continue to write with my black L2k Makrolon EF (filled with Lamy Petrol ink- oh if only Lamy made some more of that LE ink).

[A Smug Dill]

3 hours ago, 1nkulus said:

The price is not for the pen, but a chance to be different. What price can you put on that feeling?

 

Beautifully put! Thank you very much for that.

 

4 hours ago, 1nkulus said:

There is no right answer, it is entirely subjective.

 

Yep. Whether a prospective owner, or (uninterested?) fellow consumer in the market, chooses to see being different — in a ‘good’ way, or at least not also being below ‘average’ — as deliberate expression of one's character, self-image and/or ideals, and/or connote refinement, sophistication, distinction, exclusivity, snobbishness, flaunting being in a position to ‘have’ as opposed to being a ‘have-not’, displays of exclusionary mindset towards (some of) one's social equals, grab for attention that otherwise wouldn't be freely given, etc. will affect one's assessment of what possession of this pen is worth to oneself.

 

There is no inherent disrespect in someone else packaging some or all of the above together, in their evaluation of the product on offer, in a way that is different from one's own; they aren't telling me to fall in line to think/feel the way they do. The consequence may be that I get denied what I'd like, or be marginalised or even practically driven out of the market, or think hard and struggle internally as to whether to spend more than I'm comfortable so as not to feel I lost to them; but in my opinion respect is a question of intent, not consequence, whereas (legal, or otherwise prescribed, as opposed to I-feel-I-deserve-it) duty of care — which neither Lamy nor fellow customers owe me — is about consequences, and neither respect nor intent.

 

4 hours ago, 1nkulus said:

Think of it as a contest for the top 3300 Lamy fans.

 

For those who feel Lamy is being exploitative in the terms of its offer (including pricing as the number of units available), and that they themselves are not to be so exploited, nothing stops them from (I think accurately) regarding it as Lamy only exploiting those who actively want to be one of the 3,300 ‘connoisseurs’, and those the Lamy 2000 users/fans who don't want to play are beneath Lamy's notice for this particular initiative or promotion.

[1nkulus]

11 hours ago, A Smug Dill said:

For those who feel Lamy is being exploitative in the terms of its offer (including pricing as the number of units available), and that they themselves are not to be so exploited, nothing stops them from (I think accurately) regarding it as Lamy only exploiting those who actively want to be one of the 3,300 ‘connoisseurs’, and those the Lamy 2000 users/fans who don't want to play are beneath Lamy's notice for this particular initiative or promotion.

It is the same with memberships, they all have 3-4 tiers.

In the end, they are all members but there is still a difference.

 

Every product caters to a certain demographic and every manufacturer tries to cater to different price points. 

Success/failure of the strategy/product is a different matter.

A diamond studded Rolex is still a watch that just tells time, but it is easier to wear a $40-50K watch on your wrist than it is to carry the same amount in your pocket.

It isn't about the watch but just a condensed/convenient way to carry around $40-50K while letting the world know you are a person of means.

 

Lamy will continue to push as long as there is demand, same as any manufacturer.

When the demand ceases, price/product correction will, inevitably, ensue.

 

Unlike other manufacturers, at least Lamy is not launching entirely new products for the LE/collector clientele.

The LE market is essential because it helps with the cash flow for further development/launches which brings more variety to the 'average' user.

I welcome those 3300 buyers because they help me look forward to 1-2 new pen launches that I can afford.

[1nkulus]

15 hours ago, austollie said:

I agree with that statement.  This thread has indeed evolved and I've really enjoyed participating in the discussion and reading the views that are different to mine.  As long as the exchange stays respectful, which it has, then I think that it's a good thing that we get to be exposed to so many passionately expressed views.

 

I, for one, will maintain my different opinion to that of the 3,300 purchasers of this LE (assuming Lamy finds that many buyers at a price that I consider to be exorbitant).  Good luck to those, who have a different view (which I am only too happy to read about).  I will continue to write with my black L2k Makrolon EF (filled with Lamy Petrol ink- oh if only Lamy made some more of that LE ink).

 

11 hours ago, A Smug Dill said:

Beautifully put! Thank you very much for that.

 

[Intensity]

Quick question: is the FINE nib to which the brown Lamy 2000 is limited exactly the standard Lamy 2000 fine nib?  Or is it a more stubby fine nib?

 

The reason I ask is that some of the promo Lamy 2000 images show an obvious stub/italic nib.  But that's not actually an option for the pen.  Unless a vendor offers the nib swap service with purchase, of course.

 

I ended up ordering this pen on a black friday sale, and to be honest I do not care for the stock Fine nib one bit -- it's too broad for me.  Even the extra-fine is borderline too wide.  I'd rather have a stub or EF.  So while I'm excited about the pen, I'm less excited about the nib option it'll be coming with.

 

[arcfide]

16 minutes ago, Intensity said:

So while I'm excited about the pen, I'm less excited about the nib option it'll be coming with.

 

I believe that the entire L2K line is designed with nibs that are stub nibs. They aren't very sharp/crisp stubs, but I think all of the nibs are ground this way, which is where the L2K gets its "sweet spot" reputation. Basically, you can't get anything but a stub nib in the L2K, but they won't show the kind of line variation that a crisp stub will, especially in the fine and extra fine widths. 

 

The L2K is also very wet by default, which, combined with the nib grind and the like, will generally lead to pretty broad writing across the board, especially compared to the more controlled flow of some Japanese nibs or even some of the Lamy standard steel nibs (depending on what you get). 

 

 

[MuddyWaters]

I actually don't think the Lamy 2000 is that wet. It's nib is squared off unlike the ball tips of most pens these days, and that allows the ink to spread across the surface of the nib and the page, but it's not that wet, which is why Lamy 2000's are great to show off shading. 

 

Pilot nibs are wetter in my experience. That is an equivalent nib size will put out more ink. 

[Intensity]

I’ve had two Lamy 2000 EF nib pens so far: first I didn’t keep and the second was reground to a fine cursive italic.  Neither one put down a lot of ink.  I wouldn’t call them dry, but the flow was maybe a bit above average vs my other pens.  Being a piston filler with a larger capacity usually helps increase ink flow.  Neither EF had any noticeable line variation with the stock nibs.   I don’t believe medium and smaller have even stub-like variation: whatever variation  there is, it is very subtle.  Actually, if anything, my EFs were slightly architect-like rather that stub-like, but the difference in line width was not noticeable in practice.  An actual stub will not have one squinting at the writing, trying to decide it there’s line width variation: it will be apparent.

[maclink]

I have Lamy 2000’s with EF, F, M and OB nibs. I wouldn’t consider any of them stub or ‘stublike’ grinds while using them.  They are well adjusted nibs with good ink flow, making them suitable for even dryer inks. 

 

I should have gotten a B rather than OB nib since the B is the one reputed to write with a stubby quality. The OB was disappointing, writing like a sharpie. I have other OB nibs to compare and based on this experience, I doubt that it’s because I’m using the nib incorrectly. 

[maclink]

10 hours ago, Intensity said:

Quick question: is the FINE nib to which the brown Lamy 2000 is limited exactly the standard Lamy 2000 fine nib?  Or is it a more stubby fine nib?

Mine came with an EF nib (I initially thought it to be a F but ruled this out when I compared it with my F nibbed Lamy black). The nib doesn’t write with a stub or architect grind. 

 

It’s interesting that yours comes with a F nib. Even the Blue Bauhaus came with an EF nib. I wouldn’t go by the pictures.