The Meisterstück 149 Calligraphy Appreciation Thread

[Frank C]

Thanks for the photos of the MB Scarlet ink. I like darker reds; the first image of Scarlet that I saw had an orange tinge to it. It reminded me too much of Modena Red. I'm also glad it worked well in the Calligraphy 149

 

Today turned out to be Calligraphy 149 Pen Cleaning Day for me, too. I usually practice my calligraphy, using @fpupulin's alphabets for guides, on Sunday morning while I'm watching online church—one of the benefits of Covid-19, in my opinion. Both my pens—I admit to having two, thanks to all the great leads I received in this topic—ran out of ink. This is what happens. I alternate using them until one runs out and then I just write the other one out of ink. The blue always runs out first; I may have a slight preference for blue ink. 

 

After rinsing each pen until it ran clear, I filled it with water and put the nib and section in a shot glass in the ultrasound. Each pen produced a glassful of dark water after one hour. I attribute this to all the nanoparticles coming out of the feed. I examined the ink windows with a loupe and did see some spots on the plastic, but far fewer than on your pen. The pens are getting their second baths in the ultrasound currently. I will post photos of them after they come out. 

 

I know that there are people who follow this topic who know far more about this than I; I always appreciate any comments or suggestions. 

[Carrau]

3 hours ago, Frank C said:

in the ultrasound. Each pen produced a glassful of dark water after one hour.

Are you leaving them in the Ultrasound for an hour straight?  If so, you may want to check the water temperature.  I think I remember reading somewhere that running the ultrasound more than a few minutes can significantly increase the water temperature.  

[Frank C]

1 hour ago, Carrau said:

Are you leaving them in the Ultrasound for an hour straight?  If so, you may want to check the water temperature.  I think I remember reading somewhere that running the ultrasound more than a few minutes can significantly increase the water temperature.  

It does get to be warm, like bathwater warm. Mine has a heater, but I don't turn it on. Just the friction of the water molecules is enough to produce heat. There may be a little more heat coming from the ultrasonic transducers, too.

[Frank C]

@invisuu, I checked my pens after two trips in the ultrasound. The ink windows are completely clean. I do see some water droplets, but there is nothing with any color in it. I tried to photograph them, but the combination of holding a cell phone camera, holding a fountain pen, getting the light right and focusing proved to be too much for me. 

[invisuu]

Thank you, Frank C. The problem is I don't have an ultrasonic cleaner, and I can't get rid of the ink with water alone. Any recommendations on the ultrasonic cleaner?

[como]

@invisuu Glad to hear that you are enjoying your Calligraphy. Ultrasonic cleaners are best used when parts are fully disassembled for cleaning. Have you tried some pen flush liquid first (you can buy some on some pen sites). If my pens get dirty and can’t be flushed well with just water, I use diluted ammonia. You can buy at pharmacy 10% diluted ammonia, then dilute it further 10:1. Flush repeatedly but don’t keep this solution in the pen (no soaking). I don’t use ultrasonic machine. I am afraid that it can be too aggressive. In any case if I ever do, I would use only to clean fully disassembled parts, if they are structurally sound. 
 

This would be my personal preference so please take it as just a different view: before putting permanent ink in a new pen, I would first flush pen with water, then fill it with a normal ink (say MB Royal Blue, or Pelikan 4001 Blue etc). Use it for a while, then fill with Permanent ink. Don’t leave the ink inside for too long and always flush with water thoroughly afterwards. @fpupulin mentioned that he flushes 20 times. I find this adequate. The barrel stays clear, the silicon seal has a very slight hint of blue stain. This for me is satisfactory.

 

I hope that you can clean out the stain. Please let us know how it goes. Good luck!

[invisuu]

Thank you como, that's really great advice. I believe I have J. Herbin's pen flush fluid home, actually. I'll give that a try first.

[Karmachanic]

53 minutes ago, invisuu said:

I have J. Herbin's pen flush fluid home

 

Or Rapido Eze.  Whilst these will certainly clean the innards, I've not come across any evidence that they will remove the "soot" in the feed.

 

I have recollection of a post by @A Smug Dill having a Pilot(?)  filled continuously over a long period with a carbon ink with no effect on useabilty or function.  He put it in an ultrasound with similar result, as mentioned above.

 

As a penurious retiree I'd not subject a 149 to 20 flushes twice a month ad infinitum.  Fortunately, for me I have no interest in calligraphy, and won't be purchasing an MB Calligraphy.  If one was offered I'd happilly accept however, and regulalry use a non-permanent ink. Ancient Copper or Tobacco Sunburst perhaps.

[como]

I wish to clarify that 20 flushes means, in one cleaning session, moving piston up and down (drawing and expelling water) 20 times. This is what I understood what Franco meant. I do about the same level of cleaning for permanent ink. A bit less for normal ink. I do until I see water and ink window being clear.

[A Smug Dill]

1 hour ago, Karmachanic said:

I have recollection of a post by @A Smug Dill having a Pilot(?)  filled continuously over a long period with a carbon ink with no effect on useabilty or function.

 

I have several pens filled with Platinum Carbon Black ink continuously over extended periods of time. The most expensive pen was my prized Pilot Hannya Shingyo, in which a single fill of PCB lasted well over six months, during which it never hard-started on the occasions when I uncapped and wrote with it. I also had it in a UEF-nibbed Platinum #3776 Century since maybe the beginning of 2021, until I cleaned the pen out last week after the last bit of ink in the converter was depleted.

 

If the pen is fit for purpose and has good cap seal effectiveness, then I have every confidence the feed won't get clogged and the pen won't hard start from being inked with Platinum Carbon Black.

 

Cleaning whichever pen out thoroughly after a fill is a different matter. I wouldn't like to be trying to clean PCB ink out of a Platinum Preppy or Plaisir pen, or worse, a Monami Olika or Penna.

[Karmachanic]

37 minutes ago, como said:

I wish to clarify that 20 flushes means

 

This is my understanding also.

[invisuu]

I can not, for the life of me, understand how Montblanc sells ink that stains their own pens. It's not like I forgot the ink for months. It was in there just 1 day. This is a basic 149 body with a nifty nib, that's all, so permanent blue then stains all of their pens. That's really odd to me. And nobody mentioned this in this thread either...

[A Smug Dill]

1 minute ago, invisuu said:

I can not, for the life of me, understand how Montblanc sells ink that stains their own pens.

 

If Noodler's can, then what can't Montblanc do that as well?

[Frank C]

@invisuu, here is a photo of my inspiration for using an ultrasonic cleaner from http://www.indy-pen-dance.com/Ultrasonic-Soaking-Jars.html 

 

 

I saw them at a pen show and copied their technique. I just use water; I no longer let my pens dry out with ink in them. After flushing the pens with water, I fill them completely with water and then submerge the nib and section in the jar which is partly filled with water. I agree with @como, you have to be careful with an ultrasonic cleaner. I have a Montegrappa that had a frozen piston. I submerged the entire pen for about one hour in the ultrasonic cleaner. When I returned, the piston was free, lots of rehydrated ink came out, and a little silver disc at the tip of the piston knob had vibrated out. The piston felt gritty, so the remaining parts of the pen took a trip to Italy for repairs. 

[invisuu]

3 hours ago, A Smug Dill said:

 

If Noodler's can, then what can't Montblanc do that as well?

Noodler's is a one man band, trying stuff out, selling pens for $2 for fun or adding one for free with purchase of an ink bottle. His schtick is selling cheap ink by the boatload, price/performance is the #1 metric of his brand.

 

Montblanc is an enormous company worth all of the moneys with a legion of extremely well paid people working on making the experience the best possible, to retain the image of a luxury brand, where everything is supposedly magical and perfect, so they can sell you pens that noone uses anymore for thousands of dollars.

 

If I buy a 30 years old beater car to get me from A to B, my expectations are different than if I buy a brand new quarter of a million Rolls Royce. 

[como]

I was browsing for something else when I came upon the care recommendations on Montblanc’s site. Regarding use of permanent ink: “Important note: It is particularly important to clean the fountain pen regularly if permanent ink is used, as the high solids content of the ink can lead to deposits forming in the feed system. It should be cleaned approximately every two weeks.”

 

https://www.montblanc.com/en-us/customer-service/writing-instruments

 

 

[fpupulin]

After reading the last posts, started by invissu, about the staining of his 149 Calligraphy's ink window with Blue Permanent ink, I decided to check the status of my pen.

 

I compared the ink window of my Calligraphy (on the left), with those of a 149 Fine which I bought in 1979, a 149 EF circa 1984 and a 149 of the mid 2000.

 

My 149 Calligraphy has been filled with Montblanc permanent inks, both Black and Blue, for more than one year now.

 

The 149 with F nib I bought new, and it was never filled with any permanent inks.

 

The other two 149 have been bought used, so I do not know the previous history of the inks used to fill them.

 

 

The inner wall of the ink window of the EF nib is completely and uniformly scratched. I received it this way: I guess it was scratched by the friction of a non-original retaining ring of the piston. The window of the M nib, even though one of my most recent 149s, is obviously ambered by the use, in the past, of some type of brown ink.

 

The window of my old 149 F is in extraordinary conditions, notwithstanding its continuous use with a lot of different inks for more than 40 years! The pen has been regularly cleaned, any time I changed the ink, with 10 flushes. I guess I have cleaned this pen some 500 times (or more) during its life, and the pen has never been serviced.

 

Also the window of my Calligraphy holds well, clear and transparent, despite the tens of refills with Montblanc Permanent inks. I clean it at every refill, both when I change ink or not, with 20 flushes in simple water.

[invisuu]

11 hours ago, como said:

I was browsing for something else when I came upon the care recommendations on Montblanc’s site. Regarding use of permanent ink: “Important note: It is particularly important to clean the fountain pen regularly if permanent ink is used, as the high solids content of the ink can lead to deposits forming in the feed system. It should be cleaned approximately every two weeks.”

 

https://www.montblanc.com/en-us/customer-service/writing-instruments

 

 

 

Right, but I literally flushed the ink thoroughly after just 1 day, after which the ink window was already stained.

 

I see fpupulin doesn't have any issues whatsoever. So then what could it be? The water I'm flushing with (I sometimes use tap water, but typically I used distilled water)? I don't understand the difference. Or is it just a bad batch of ink I got?

 

[como]

@invisuu Have you had any luck getting the stain out? If not, I would take it to a Montblanc Boutique to sort it out. It’s under warranty and you used their brand ink. I expect that they will take care of it free of charge. If this were out of warranty, I would use the special wrench to unscrew the piston from the back end, then use a barrel brush to clean it. But you don’t have to do that (and shouldn’t, because then you void the warranty).

[invisuu]

@como I have not gotten rid of the stain. But I also don't want to send the pen back, because then I'll be without it for at least 4-6 weeks.  So right now I'm battling with my inner self if I should just accept the stain and live with it (I have no plans whatsoever to sell it, so resale value is meaningless to me), or be without the pen for 4-6 weeks and get rid of the stain. It's not an easy decision for me, because I use the pen daily and I really, really enjoy it.

 

There's also the option to just flat out use permanent blue in this pen and not seeing the stain anyway