Calculated Risk Or Beginers Mistake Pelikan 101N

[OMASsimo]

I started wrongly. I am in no position to complain really. I paid a decent nib price for it. I can still cap it and put it in display box if I want, no harm done. It is actually extremely nice pen, 101 tortoise in general, (those who had a chance to see one of those in person knows what am I saying) with great "fake" tortoise pattern. One of the kind, as each old time 101-101N tortoise was.

 

What I wanted to know is, do you, seasoned collectors take (sometimes), a sort of calculated risks, buying such a rare pen, despite that you did not have a chance to see it in person or the photos and descriptions are on the scarce side, and despite you know that there are damages that will need serious work.

 

You are right Christof, 2 of the 3 parts that define tortoise 101 are damaged. I imagine that someone repaired the filling mechanism unscrewing it without knowing that the treads orientation is reversed on this old Pelikans. I will clean up the mess on the section/ink window, to what happen there. It needs a new part anyway.

BTW: these are really close up photos. Damage/crack on the cap is small, more than reparable one. I have seen it on the photographs at first time. There is a number worst caps of this model, with multiple repaired cracks on hi dollar 101 pens. I wood not mind having this one on well preserved tortoise 101.

 

After a few chats, I decided that the pen will be repaired. I will send a shot or two after that. Till later, thanks.

 

The short answer is: Yes

 

Some rare, sought-after pens are offered for horrendous prices, restored or not. If you can find them at all. And often enough you can't be sure how well the pen was "restored". So, I'm always glad to find a gem in the raw if the price is in the range of the spare parts it provides. I always figure in what I can restore myself and what is beyond my skills. Some scars may remain that are a testimony of a long life. It doesn't look like your pen is a hopeless case and I hope you'll get it back into shape.

 

Just an example. I bought a pen lot on ebay for a song containing this Kaweco Sport 11 from the early 1950s.

 

 

 

I think it's obvious why the interest in that lot was rather limited. The pen also had a crack in the cap which was not obvious from the pictures. It was a relatively easy job to get it back into shape at no additional cost. And you can convince yourself that it was worth it:

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Please let us know how your restoration project turns out. I think it's a pen worth some effort.

[IThinkIHaveAProblem]

 

The short answer is: Yes

 

Some rare, sought-after pens are offered for horrendous prices, restored or not. If you can find them at all. And often enough you can't be sure how well the pen was "restored". So, I'm always glad to find a gem in the raw if the price is in the range of the spare parts it provides. I always figure in what I can restore myself and what is beyond my skills. Some scars may remain that are a testimony of a long life. It doesn't look like your pen is a hopeless case and I hope you'll get it back into shape.

 

Just an example. I bought a pen lot on ebay for a song containing this Kaweco Sport 11 from the early 1950s.

 

I think it's obvious why the interest in that lot was rather limited. The pen also had a crack in the cap which was not obvious from the pictures. It was a relatively easy job to get it back into shape at no additional cost. And you can convince yourself that it was worth it:

 

Please let us know how your restoration project turns out. I think it's a pen worth some effort.

nice job. the pen looks great!

[Marijan]

 

The short answer is: Yes

 

Some rare, sought-after pens are offered for horrendous prices, restored or not. If you can find them at all. And often enough you can't be sure how well the pen was "restored". So, I'm always glad to find a gem in the raw if the price is in the range of the spare parts it provides. I always figure in what I can restore myself and what is beyond my skills. Some scars may remain that are a testimony of a long life. It doesn't look like your pen is a hopeless case and I hope you'll get it back into shape.

 

 

 

Thanks. I certainly will report about the progress. Nice K.Sport you have there. So underrated high quality pieces of engineering.

I still have 3 pieces set, pen, pencil, ballpoint pen in original leather "bag". I tried to sell the set once (ok, not always the value indicator) but there was no interest.

 

Three pens of mine, that are on the way to the Eric Wilson for servicing, are momentarily lost from any postal tracking service. I still need to wait 4 days to make official complaint. Hopefully Eric will get them or it will be returned to me.

Because of that I made few small steps further with this 101, doing some of the disassembly work by myself. This is the latest update of work, made by me. The reason of the mess on the pens ink window was the crack just under the beginning of the sleeve. It actually cracked back on that spot in my hands while removing the piston assembly. No real harm since replacement was required anyway (ink window cracks). Things are pretty much prepared for some serious restoration work. Donor barrel (with amber window - early stuff) needed, and some fusing, bonding and filling. Nothing that can not be done anymore. Few shots of the 101n spare parts waiting on the table. Still trying to save the section, but I am unsure if this is integral barrel part or it can be removed.

[Seney724]

Sure. Eastern Europe - former communist country.

I cannot speak for anyone but myself, but with all due respect, it always really irritates me when someone goes to the trouble to make a post documenting the work of an untruthful, unethical seller (aka scammer, thief, etc.) and then he or she does not share sufficient information so that others here will not fall victim to that same seller, as well.

 

I think it's fine to show your pen and ask opinions about what should be done. After all, that's one of the most important reasons for the existence of this Forum. But, if you don't plan to share the important information about the thief then don't let us know you got scammed. Just leave that part of the information out of your post.

[mana]

Still trying to save the section, but I am unsure if this is integral barrel part or it can be removed.

It can be removed, the barrel (celluloid) and the section (ebonite) were originally two parts. But, do look for a new barrel though, that one is deformed a bit in places, getting a replacement one might bring you close to the truth in the sense that you could have what amounts to a specs/measurements wise a more true barrel.

 

Then you could just use white paint on it and put the binde on the barrel as it was originally supposed to fit (having fixed the crack in the binde prior). The white paint underneath is there to give a canvas for the celluloid so that its colors come true (instead of just having something behind the binde that just sucks the light out instead of reflecting it back).

Edited May 15, 2020 by mana

[mana]

I cannot speak for anyone but myself, but with all due respect, it always really irritates me when someone goes to the trouble to make a post documenting the work of an untruthful, unethical seller (aka scammer, thief, etc.) and then he or she does not share sufficient information so that others here will not fall victim to that same seller, as well.

 

I think it's fine to show your pen and ask opinions about what should be done. After all, that's one of the most important reasons for the existence of this Forum. But, if you don't plan to share the important information about the thief then don't let us know you got scammed. Just leave that part of the information out of your post.

 

Ever thought of PMing him? Just saying...

[Marijan]

It can be removed, the barrel (celluloid) and the section (ebonite) were originally two parts.

 

Thanks. I tried to save the section but the barrel was in such a bad shape that was literally impossible to grab (just by hands , warped in the rubber band) the ink widow part to try to unscrew the section out, without breaking in to the pieces. Worst thing was that both, section and barrel treads, fused together (I had hard time separating them even after the break occurred) so when ink window and barrel treads went into the few pieces, the section tread followed. I did soaked the barrel section in the cold water over night.

 

Information about the white colour on the barrel will be more than helpful when putting the pen together. Do you have any information, what kind of paint was used. At first, I thought it is some kind of grease, helping to put the sleeve on the barrel more easily.

Although I know that real tortoise shell , when used (historically) as an overlay material usually had some kind of »ground« under it to enchase the colour an contrast of the TS - paper was used, geso ground, white pigments, and on high end objects gold leafs (I even had to restored a tortoise shell parts of the 1796 Neapolitan mandolin few years ago, using gold leafs us under-layer) – It didn`t occur me that it can be the same thing here with artificial tortoise. Anyway, thanks. I never had a chance to see the »naked barrel« before, with sleeve just taken off, not cleaned yet.

 

[Marijan]

I cannot speak for anyone but myself, but with all due respect, it always really irritates me when someone goes to the trouble to make a post documenting the work of an untruthful, unethical seller (aka scammer, thief, etc.) and then he or she does not share sufficient information so that others here will not fall victim to that same seller, as well.

 

I think it's fine to show your pen and ask opinions about what should be done. After all, that's one of the most important reasons for the existence of this Forum. But, if you don't plan to share the important information about the thief then don't let us know you got scammed. Just leave that part of the information out of your post.

Reading things can be useful. There is just one sentence, concerning the seller in all of my posts (post no.2). Nine words. And even those in slightly sarcastic, more like« self accusing« manner. Hardly screaming SCAM!?? All of the rest was just questioning myself, did I made beginners mistake, and asking those with years of collecting experience what do they do in similar situation, and what they suggest to do with pen in this condition. No more no less.

 

Pen was bought through the add (full of used domestic stuff, cups, knives, shoes...) on a locally oriented small internet »flea market« web-site in a neighbouring (EE-FC) country. I even had problems convincing the man to send me a pen across the boarder. From his photographs was clear enough that the pen is badly damaged. Did he hold the other sides of the item back intentionally or not, I can not say. I decided to buy pen anyway.

And you think that I should publicly expose some poor sod »p******ff324« nick name, here on FPN,... to achieve what?

Only documenting in my posts is few photos, I somehow thought that may be of some use and interest to someone dealing with similar things, problems... Well perhaps I should think twice.

[OMASsimo]

Don't worry, I think your posts are perfectly fine.

[Carrau]

Like many threads, there is much to be learned here, about careful reading of descriptions, careful examination of pictures, the need to ask for additional views. Also to be learned is the need to examine one’s reasons for buying and enjoying pens (vintage or otherwise), and respect for the ability to see the potential beauty in broken down old pens, and the patience and devotion some have for restoring them to some measure of their former glory.

 

“For there is nothing lost, that may be found, if sought.” -Edmund Spenser

[Marijan]

Perhaps not related to this particular pen only, but Pelikan pens and their production in general. I read that Pelikan, from it`s start always used threaded nib rings so the feeder/nib/ring unit was simply unscrewed from the section. I know that there supposed to be an attempt with 400N pen to use friction nib mounting, but did not last long.

 

This pen has 100N feed with slotted middle lamella (not broken away like it was suggested in one of the sites dealing with historical Pelikans), one that was used (with small difference against early 100 feed) from the beginning (1929) and in to the year 1937 (look at the close up shots where you can see material maker and nib type stamped). It has corresponding I think EF type 3 nib (if I figured it out correctly). Perhaps most of you is familiar with those facts. But what is uncommon (that is why I am posting this photos) for Pelikan 100/100N is that the nib/feed in this pen was friction fitted in the section which does not allow the use of the nib ring. Section looks identical as others used in early 100/100N pens with amber window but without the inner thread (and space) for nib ring. Nib and feed are perfect friction fit to the section and without doubt Pelikan product. Section is curious Pelikan section, later unoriginal addition or ....? Profile photos of the section is shown on other photos. Any suggestion or thought?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[mana]

Information about the white colour on the barrel will be more than helpful when putting the pen together. Do you have any information, what kind of paint was used?

No idea of what it is, unfortunately. Pelikan did make artists paints so it could be gesso as that was widely available then but can't really tell for sure.

[Marijan]

No idea of what it is, unfortunately. Pelikan did make artists paints so it could be gesso as that was widely available then but can't really tell for sure.

 

I doesn't really matter too much probably, although, after 80+ years, that "paint" it still easily removed from the barrel, with finger nail. One will need something that will stick to the barrel good enough to stay in place, while putting the sleeve back on, and will not change colour a lot due the oxidation and other chemical, time depending processes in all those years. I guess that some modern equivalent of the old stuff can be used? I still need to go in that slightly deeper.

 

Thank you. Most helpful.

Edited:

p.s.

any idea about friction - threaded nib section?

Edited May 18, 2020 by Marijan

[Estycollector]

Excellent thread and thank you for sharing. The progress to date is impressive.

 

Personally, I would rather read threads like this that seller bashing threads. You owe no one an explaination. :)Or, you don't owe me an explanation.

Edited May 18, 2020 by Estycollector

[christof]

p.s.

any idea about friction - threaded nib section?

 

 

Tom Westerich told me once that friction fit nibs are often found on 101N for the portugese market. I have on as well:

 

 

Pelikan 101N Tortoise Short Cap Top von -C.M.Z-

 

PS: you actually are creating a very interesting thread about an almost death pen. This is not bad at all and FPN could see more of threads like this. Kudos to you.

Edited May 19, 2020 by christof

[christof]

pps: friction fit nib units from Pelikan 400 look completely different:

 

Pelikan 400 friction fit nib unit von -C.M.Z-

 

c.

Edited May 19, 2020 by christof

[Marijan]

Excellent thread and thank you for sharing. The progress to date is impressive.

 

Thank you, I just hope it will be even more impressive, when donor barrel is found and celluloid repairs completed I believe it has a chance to become really nice, historically correct pen.

 

 

You actually are creating a very interesting thread about an almost death pen. This is not bad at all and FPN could see more of threads like this. Kudos to you.

 

Thank you. You can never be sure with all those funny birds, Dodos, Pelikans, Phoenixes. Sometimes they just look death...

 

Beautiful 101 you have there.

 

If TW say that it was made with friction nib for Portugal than I would not be surprised if it was sold like that to other countries too. This kind of data can be scarce. But again, unfortunately, I owe no subject related books, that are probably more detailed and precise than web sites I have access to.

Feed on the pen I have (posted one) was used with nib ring too. This is the pen I sold to Westerich years ago, with a couple of others, when I had to sell out my collection (health issues). It had identical feed with slotted middle fin, but was friction fitted to the ring and ring than screwed to the early version of the section.

You can also see on this photograph the result of the rotation of the sleeve scraping away that white ground I learned about few days ago from mana.

 

 

 

Edited May 19, 2020 by Marijan

[christof]

This is a very nice set. Sad that you had to sell...

I've got mine from Miroslav Tischler, about ten years ago.

C.

[Marijan]

I hope you got it for a decent price : - ))). I tried to buy a nib for Penkala safety pen from him years ago. Nice, friendly guy to talk to, lot of knowladge I guess, but, 100 eur for that nib. It is a pride of Croatia, "Penkala" company, I know that, but that was quite a price for me... still have that pen somewhere in the desk without the nib.

 

Small progress on the 101N. Still some polishing to be done, but the sleeve is in one piece again and cap crack (`s - two of them) is solidly restored with MEK/celluloid mixture (used in sleeve filling too), polishing also needed. Cap glued and tighten with rubber band, than left on the piece of wooden dowel and Al foil to keep the shape, and to cure.

 

If you take a look to the extent of damage (first two posts of the topic) this is a step forward. Now seriously looking for donor pen/barrel.

 

 

 

[IThinkIHaveAProblem]

nice work!