Parker 51 Comeback 2020?

[maclink]

13 hours ago, Ferocity said:

I did, and I don't know why = ) 
the figure 8s right above the word "heavy," also had a hard start, plus a skip half way through it. 

Likely would have benefited from a flush before use. I did so with mine and it has been perfect. 

[Ferocity]

4 hours ago, maclink said:

Likely would have benefited from a flush before use. I did so with mine and it has been perfect. 

 

I bet! For now, I’m going to keep on using the fountain pens I have ink with, because I need to run out on one of those before I can start using this one for real!
I like how the grip section's purple plastic extends all the way into the inside male part that locks into to the converters and cartridges. That's pretty neat. I've attached a diagram(Credit to Julius M. Kahn Morris Levy ) of a totally different pen that kind of shows which purple part I'm talking about. I can't get a photo of the real physical 51 at the moment = ) 

[Heinkle]

Late to the party on this, but having just taken ownership of the midnight blue P51 reissue, I am genuinely shocked at:

• How light and cheap it feels
• How flimsy the plastic threads are

It's a different price point but the quality of the materials compared to the Centennial is really night and day. The Wing Sung 601 feels more robust.

 

Parker must be making a staggering mark-up. Oh well, it writes at least.

[como]

@HeinkleThe modern Parker Duofolds were no cheap pens. Back in the 80s, they were already priced at $300-350 for Centennial and $250-300 for International. That was over 30 years ago. The UK made Duofolds were greatest modern comebacks that Parker ever did.

[Estycollector]

I think the MB I bought in the early 1990's was near $300. 

[TheRedBeard]

1 hour ago, como said:

@HeinkleThe modern Parker Duofolds were no cheap pens. Back in the 80s, they were already priced at $300-350 for Centennial and $250-300 for International. That was over 30 years ago. The UK made Duofolds were greatest modern comebacks that Parker ever did.

Modern Duofolds are still not bad: I have got Centennial manufactured in 2016 and Centennial International 2020 - both are perfect, I can't complain.

While 2020 one was packed in cheaper Sonnet box, the entire pen is as great as Parker should be.

[TheRedBeard]

2 hours ago, Heinkle said:

Late to the party on this, but having just taken ownership of the midnight blue P51 reissue, I am genuinely shocked at:

• How light and cheap it feels
• How flimsy the plastic threads are

It's a different price point but the quality of the materials compared to the Centennial is really night and day. The Wing Sung 601 feels more robust.

 

Parker must be making a staggering mark-up. Oh well, it writes at least.

 

Have you bought Deluxe version?

[Heinkle]

32 minutes ago, TheRedBeard said:

 

Have you bought Deluxe version?

no, just the steel nib midnight blue

[Heinkle]

2 hours ago, como said:

@HeinkleThe modern Parker Duofolds were no cheap pens. Back in the 80s, they were already priced at $300-350 for Centennial and $250-300 for International. That was over 30 years ago. The UK made Duofolds were greatest modern comebacks that Parker ever did.

yes, they’re my favourite Parker pen - I have an early 90s green marble international, a ‘99 black CT international and the latest Big Red Centennial and they’re all built well. 

[ele]

45 minutes ago, TheRedBeard said:

 

Have you bought Deluxe version?

Is there really a difference? (Other than the seemingly stubbish nib, which is sorta cool.)

[TheRedBeard]

21 minutes ago, Heinkle said:

no, just the steel nib midnight blue

Thanks, I see.

[TheRedBeard]

8 minutes ago, ele said:

Is there really a difference? (Other than the seemingly stubbish nib, which is sorta cool.)

I have seen and touched basic version and also found it looking and feeling cheap.

And I read impressions and opinions of some FPN members (here on this thread, too) who purchased Deluxe one and did not find it looking/feeling cheap. 

 

[maclink]

15 hours ago, TheRedBeard said:

I have seen and touched basic version and also found it looking and feeling cheap.

And I read impressions and opinions of some FPN members (here on this thread, too) who purchased Deluxe one and did not find it looking/feeling cheap. 

 

My opinion only:

I have the deluxe version as well as several ‘original’ P51’s.  Any claim of feeling of cheapness of the Deluxe version I would take with skepticism. I don’t share that view. I guess I don’t care that much about the hoopla this new release has created since I didn’t live the time when the P51 was the innovation that it was. I don’t care for the P51s that much either.

[s_t_e_v_e]

IMHO, the latest P51 is a failed attempt. It may be a great pen for someone who didn't quite like the original P51 and would want to change some things on that pen or for those who have never used or handled a P51 before. For me, the original design is the quintessential P51. This new one is just another new modern parker that they decided to call the P51. I like modern Parkers, even the entry level Vectors are nice writers. The reviews I've seen have all been positive about the new P51's writing experience. Where it seems to fall short is the overall appeal.

 

I guess Parker could've just called the new P51 something else and avoid the negativity around it. The whole controversy has amplified due to the name choice. The Sonnet is essentially a P75 successor, has been a huge success for Parker and it doesn't pretend to be a P75. The P100, IMO, was a great pen with features similar to the P51, P61 and the like, and it didn't pretend to be any of those. Instead they made the P100 a more luxury version of the design. I think, a reasonably priced version based on the P100 would have been received better. The P51 is just too hard to live up to for the modern Parker brand.

[TheRedBeard]

6 hours ago, maclink said:

My opinion only:

I have the deluxe version as well as several ‘original’ P51’s.  Any claim of feeling of cheapness of the Deluxe version I would take with skepticism. I don’t share that view. I guess I don’t care that much about the hoopla this new release has created since I didn’t live the time when the P51 was the innovation that it was. I don’t care for the P51s that much either.

That's is good to know. And your opinion is in line with some other people here, who recently bought Deluxe version.

 

As I mentioned before, that is why I will have to purchase Deluxe version shortly and make my own opinion on this matter :)

[TheRedBeard]

1 hour ago, s_t_e_v_e said:

...

The Sonnet is essentially a P75 successor, has been a huge success for Parker and it doesn't pretend to be a P75. The P100, IMO, was a great pen with features similar to the P51, P61 and the like, and it didn't pretend to be any of those. Instead they made the P100 a more luxury version of the design. I think, a reasonably priced version based on the P100 would have been received better. The P51 is just too hard to live up to for the modern Parker brand.

 

IMO, early Sonnet was not bad and, of course, commercial success for Parker, but I find P75 much better pen.

Modern day Sonnet is just a faceless average pen, unfortunately :(

 

And I agree with you on P100 - it was a very good and nice pen though not so commercially successful.

 

 

[JCC123]

2 hours ago, s_t_e_v_e said:

IMHO, the latest P51 is a failed attempt.

 

The P51 is just too hard to live up to for the modern Parker brand.

It's not difficult to live up to at all. A complete doofus would have been able to do a reissue. All they needed to do was copy what they had. How hard is that? Just replace the filling system to cartridge/converter like they have and keep the rest as close to the original as possible. If they wanted to replace the nib to the jotter, they can. Just move it closer up against the hood. Use better plastics and keep it a push cap. Problem solved. See how easy that was?

[s_t_e_v_e]

46 minutes ago, JCC123 said:

It's not difficult to live up to at all. A complete doofus would have been able to do a reissue. All they needed to do was copy what they had. How hard is that? Just replace the filling system to cartridge/converter like they have and keep the rest as close to the original as possible. If they wanted to replace the nib to the jotter, they can. Just move it closer up against the hood. Use better plastics and keep it a push cap. Problem solved. See how easy that was?

Haha, I thought so too. I would assume they had the designs if not the machines and tooling to make the P51. If they went so far as to make a pen that looked like the P51, they might as well have gone the whole nine and made the real thing. The only place I am willing to compromise is the filling system, C/C is ok given that all their current pens use that.

 

[Glenn-SC]

16 hours ago, s_t_e_v_e said:

I would assume they had the designs if not the machines and tooling to make the P51.

 

Very hard and very expensive. 
all they had to do was to recreate all the old tooling that was mostly operated by hand, hire and train the machinists to run the machinery and get the materials to work with.

Then people would have complained that the “new” 51 costs 3 to 4 times what a vintage one could be bought for and accused Parker of being elitist and trying to rip-off modern consumers.  
🙄

[JCC123]

1 hour ago, Glenn-SC said:

Very hard and very expensive. 
all they had to do was to recreate all the old tooling that was mostly operated by hand, hire and train the machinists to run the machinery and get the materials to work with.

Then people would have complained that the “new” 51 costs 3 to 4 times what a vintage one could be bought for and accused Parker of being elitist and trying to rip-off modern consumers.  
🙄

Sorry but they had to retool and train for this piece of garbage as well. That money would have been better spent towards a better copy, even if it means investing a bit more. As it is, it looks like a money grab as the price they're asking for the pen is nowhere near the cost. This is greed, pure and simple. They took a $20 pen, jacked the price up 5 times banking on their name and reputation, and expected people to not know any better.

 

People, stop trying to defend the indefensible!