Parker 51 Comeback 2020?

[Ron Z]

11 hours ago, FarmBoy said:

Parker told repairmen to test both vac and aero filled 51s with the same ink capacity test guage.   Parker claimed they hold the same amount. 

 

...and using a test gauge on a regular basis after restoration, I can confirm that they do hold the same amount of ink.

[TheRedBeard]

2 hours ago, NumberSix said:

Correct. The new model, received not long ago from my preorder. 

Thanks, noted.

Have you managed to solve the issue, or does it still persist?..

[NumberSix]

1 hour ago, TheRedBeard said:

Thanks, noted.

Have you managed to solve the issue, or does it still persist?..

I think I have. Nothing on the pen is loose, the way I originally thought. But I see it feels kind of weird as the cap's being unscrewed, and I mistook that for something with the pen itself. Hard to describe. It's just me not being used to screw-caps for a 51/21 body style, perhaps! 

 

It's fine. I actually quite like this pen, and I might consider getting another one (in another color) at some point. I have no problem using it alongside my Aero 51s. 

[TheRedBeard]

10 minutes ago, NumberSix said:

I think I have. Nothing on the pen is loose, the way I originally thought. But I see it feels kind of weird as the cap's being unscrewed, and I mistook that for something with the pen itself. Hard to describe. It's just me not being used to screw-caps for a 51/21 body style, perhaps! 

 

It's fine. I actually quite like this pen, and I might consider getting another one (in another color) at some point. I have no problem using it alongside my Aero 51s. 

That sounds great :)

 

[Jerome Tarshis]

8 hours ago, Estycollector said:

 I suspect the 21 was meant as a school pen. 

 

A reasonable thought in the America of 2021.

 

As one who was 12 years old in 1948, when the Parker 21 was introduced, I think I can say it wasn't introduced as a school pen, but rather as a less-expensive Parker pen. The Parker pens of the 1930s and 1940s aspired to a certain dignity, which totally disappeared for me with the Vector and the Reflex.

 

A more important idea is that although the German language has the word Schulfueller, which means "school pen," the phrase "school pen" was not in colloquial use in the America I was born into. 

 

My first fountain pen was some kind of one-dollar pen, most probably a Wearever, and my second was a two-dollar pen, like an Esterbrook. Those were not especially children's pens; they were also normally used by adults. During the years after the Depression and World War II, there was much less money around than there is today. Many American adults, having no need to write in ink, wrote in pencil.

 

Americans who did office work requiring them to write in ink most commonly used inexpensive fountain pens, although my father wrote with a 1920s Duofold. It wasn't all Esterbrooks.

 

What children used varied according to parental ideas about children losing things and also with family income. Some of my elementary-school classmates wrote with Parker 51s; others used Wearevers or Esterbrooks, as I did until I got a 51 at the age of 13. 

 

I would be mildly interested to learn when and how the idea of the school pen actually called a school pen was imported from Europe.

[eciton]

9 hours ago, TheRedBeard said:

 

Hi Anthony,

 

Thank you for sharing your first impressions with us

It is interesting to hear ones from a person who is not affected by previous experience and "legacy" of using an original glorious P51

Based on information and reviews from your blog I assume you are not a fan of Parker pens And it seems you are not fond of vintage pens either

 

BTW, you run a quite nice blog

 

 

 

 

 

Believe me I have nothing against Parker — I wouldn't have ordered the 51 with my own money if I wasn't at least hoping to like it!  I very much disliked the Jotter FP, I have owned a Sonnet that dried out, and I have owned two modern Duofolds that I just didn't click with (despite the very pretty nib). I have very fond memories of all the Parker pens I used when growing up!

 

My attitude to vintage pens is based on pragmatism and self-knowledge. I respect their heritage, beauty, ingenuity, materials and writing experience, and I love looking at people's posts about them. But I know that even the most robust vintage pen would cause me anxiety, and furthermore I generally prefer to buy my pens new so I know they haven't been messed with. So I have nothing at all against vintage pens, I just know they're not for me :).

[TheRedBeard]

16 minutes ago, eciton said:

 

Believe me I have nothing against Parker — I wouldn't have ordered the 51 with my own money if I wasn't at least hoping to like it!  I very much disliked the Jotter FP, I have owned a Sonnet that dried out, and I have owned two modern Duofolds that I just didn't click with (despite the very pretty nib). I have very fond memories of all the Parker pens I used when growing up!

 

My attitude to vintage pens is based on pragmatism and self-knowledge. I respect their heritage, beauty, ingenuity, materials and writing experience, and I love looking at people's posts about them. But I know that even the most robust vintage pen would cause me anxiety, and furthermore I generally prefer to buy my pens new so I know they haven't been messed with. So I have nothing at all against vintage pens, I just know they're not for me :).

Thanks for the open response, I perfectly understand :)

In spite of being a devoted Parker user and collector for decades I should agree that modern-era Parkers (except Duofolds Centennial) are no longer among the top pens.. :(

 

However, for you it might be worth trying Parker 100 - while it is no longer in production, it is not considered as vintage yet and still can be found boxed in NOS condition (though most likely in the US).

[Estycollector]

2 hours ago, Jerome Tarshis said:

 

A reasonable thought in the America of 2021.

 

As one who was 12 years old in 1948, when the Parker 21 was introduced, I think I can say it wasn't introduced as a school pen, but rather as a less-expensive Parker pen. The Parker pens of the 1930s and 1940s aspired to a certain dignity, which totally disappeared for me with the Vector and the Reflex.

 

A more important idea is that although the German language has the word Schulfueller, which means "school pen," the phrase "school pen" was not in colloquial use in the America I was born into. 

 

My first fountain pen was some kind of one-dollar pen, most probably a Wearever, and my second was a two-dollar pen, like an Esterbrook. Those were not especially children's pens; they were also normally used by adults. During the years after the Depression and World War II, there was much less money around than there is today. Many American adults, having no need to write in ink, wrote in pencil.

 

Americans who did office work requiring them to write in ink most commonly used inexpensive fountain pens, although my father wrote with a 1920s Duofold. It wasn't all Esterbrooks.

 

What children used varied according to parental ideas about children losing things and also with family income. Some of my elementary-school classmates wrote with Parker 51s; others used Wearevers or Esterbrooks, as I did until I got a 51 at the age of 13. 

 

I would be mildly interested to learn when and how the idea of the school pen actually called a school pen was imported from Europe.

My first 21 was a gift from a person whose parents give her the pen in the 1960’s. That’s probably colored my opinion/perception. 
 

thank you for your insight. 

 

 

m

[corniche]

4 hours ago, NumberSix said:

I think I have. Nothing on the pen is loose, the way I originally thought. But I see it feels kind of weird as the cap's being unscrewed, and I mistook that for something with the pen itself. Hard to describe. It's just me not being used to screw-caps for a 51/21 body style, perhaps! 

 

It's fine. I actually quite like this pen, and I might consider getting another one (in another color) at some point. I have no problem using it alongside my Aero 51s. 

 

Hi #6,

 

I like mine, too. I liked it so much; I bought a Midnight Blue set for more money than I paid for my teal set.

 

 

I haven't noticed anything loose on the fountain pens, but the steel cap on both ballpoints has a "loose" feel to them, though.

 

 

- Sean 

 

[corniche]

Hi all,

 

I wrote my teal one dry - no further issues with it; the flush/usc seems to have solved my problem with it. 👍

 

And so far, the Midnight Blue one has had no issues at all.

 

 

- Sean 

[corniche]

On 3/2/2021 at 4:43 PM, eciton said:

I received my teal steel-nib today, and having never used an original 51, I was still underwhelmed. The teal colour is nice, the finish is decent, well polished.

 

No converter, minor annoyance. On the small side, to be expected. Cap threads don't feel like they'll last. But the biggest reason I'm underwhelmed is the writing experience. The nib is smooth but definitely on the dry side. Lacking in personality. I'll give it some time, but wanted to share my first impressions.

 

Hello Eciton,

 

Dryness, hard starts, skipping and stalling seem to be a trending problem with this pen. I had these issues, but was able to solve them by giving the pen a good flush and a 4-minute cycle in my ultrasonic cleaner and haven't had any problems since. 

 

There are also more drastic cures mentioned in this thread, such as using a razor blade the spread the tines a little. If the flush doesn't increase the wetness; insert a razor blade between the tines and leave it there a few hours so the metal's memory will be changed. 

 

Have you flushed it yet?

 

What ink are you using?

 

 

- Sean 

[es9]

7 hours ago, Jerome Tarshis said:

 

A reasonable thought in the America of 2021.

 

As one who was 12 years old in 1948, when the Parker 21 was introduced, I think I can say it wasn't introduced as a school pen, but rather as a less-expensive Parker pen. The Parker pens of the 1930s and 1940s aspired to a certain dignity, which totally disappeared for me with the Vector and the Reflex.

 

A more important idea is that although the German language has the word Schulfueller, which means "school pen," the phrase "school pen" was not in colloquial use in the America I was born into. 

 

My first fountain pen was some kind of one-dollar pen, most probably a Wearever, and my second was a two-dollar pen, like an Esterbrook. Those were not especially children's pens; they were also normally used by adults. During the years after the Depression and World War II, there was much less money around than there is today. Many American adults, having no need to write in ink, wrote in pencil.

 

Americans who did office work requiring them to write in ink most commonly used inexpensive fountain pens, although my father wrote with a 1920s Duofold. It wasn't all Esterbrooks.

 

What children used varied according to parental ideas about children losing things and also with family income. Some of my elementary-school classmates wrote with Parker 51s; others used Wearevers or Esterbrooks, as I did until I got a 51 at the age of 13. 

 

I would be mildly interested to learn when and how the idea of the school pen actually called a school pen was imported from Europe.

 

My dad grew up in the same timeframe and had a similar experience.  From elementary school until at least high school, he wrote with Esterbrooks fitted with duracrome renew-points.  (He said he always managed to drop the pen and kill a nib right when it had smoothened how he liked it.)  Eventually he was "promoted" to the tipped 9XXX nibs and eventually to a Parker 21 in college.  He wrote with a number of pens throughout his, but his priority was always utility.  For example, he liked the Sheaffer TD TM more than the Snorkel because they were much cheaper to fix.  He eventually got an MB 149 and loved the way it wrote, but always seemed uncomfortable with its perceived gaudiness.  

 

[FarmBoy]

13 hours ago, Ron Z said:

 

...and using a test gauge on a regular basis after restoration, I can confirm that they do hold the same amount of ink.

It is a long story but it is a guage not a gauge...

[corniche]

Post deleted; decided to make it its own thread.

 

- S.

[eciton]

21 hours ago, corniche said:

 

Hello Eciton,

 

Dryness, hard starts, skipping and stalling seem to be a trending problem with this pen. I had these issues, but was able to solve them by giving the pen a good flush and a 4-minute cycle in my ultrasonic cleaner and haven't had any problems since. 

 

There are also more drastic cures mentioned in this thread, such as using a razor blade the spread the tines a little. If the flush doesn't increase the wetness; insert a razor blade between the tines and leave it there a few hours so the metal's memory will be changed. 

 

Have you flushed it yet?

 

What ink are you using?

 

 

- Sean 

 

Evening,

 

I tried the black cartridge it came with, then flushed (pen and cartridge) and syringe-filled the cartridge with Montblanc Maya Blue, which in my experience is decently wet. It's still too dry for my tastes.

 

I have plenty of experience hacking at nibs of all sorts, with brass shims and razors, but I generally try to work on a loose nib or at least one where I have a bit of slit to play with. The tiny exposed portion of the 51 is a worry to me — I don't want to just splay the tip. I may have missed it in this thread, but I haven't so far figured out how to extract the nib and feed from the hooded housing!

 

Ta for the response

 

Ant

 

 

[Heinkle]

This this was amusing from Parker... “complementary metallic jewel”

[Estycollector]

27 minutes ago, Heinkle said:

This this was amusing from Parker... “complementary metallic jewel”

For me, I appreciated the non metallic complimentary jewel on my ‘42 51......lol!

[corniche]

1 hour ago, eciton said:

 

Evening,

 

I tried the black cartridge it came with, then flushed (pen and cartridge) and syringe-filled the cartridge with Montblanc Maya Blue, which in my experience is decently wet. It's still too dry for my tastes.

 

Hi Anthony, 

 

Okay. Unfortunately, the easiest track has been eliminated. 

 

1 hour ago, eciton said:

I have plenty of experience hacking at nibs of all sorts, with brass shims and razors, but I generally try to work on a loose nib or at least one where I have a bit of slit to play with.

 

Yeah, I understand. I didn't have to do it, but I tested the technique; just for reference.  I know I prefer using brass shims, but theres no way to do it without it crumpling. With the extremely limited access, you need the rigid single edge razor blade to do it, but it can be done. 

 

1 hour ago, eciton said:

The tiny exposed portion of the 51 is a worry to me — I don't want to just splay the tip. I may have missed it in this thread, but I haven't so far figured out how to extract the nib and feed from the hooded housing!

 

Yeah, I know. Unfortunately, theres no way to effectively splay a hooded nib and unfortunately, again, the hood on the NG51 is impossible to remove.

 

1 hour ago, eciton said:

 

Ta for the response

 

Ant

 

You're welcome.  Sorry I couldn't be of more help to you.

 

- Sean 

[corniche]

37 minutes ago, Heinkle said:

This this was amusing from Parker... “complementary metallic jewel”

 

Hi Heinkle, 

 

Well, that was the main selling point for me; if it weren't for the complimentary metallic "jewel," theres no f'ing way I would have bought it.

 

- Sean 

[Ferocity]

frankly I like how it's a metal jewel, because up until now (i think) only the first year parker 51s had the metal jewel. If this is the last iteration of the parker 51 then it'll be kind of poetic in a way.