Parker 51 Comeback 2020?

[Estycollector]

Our forum is a wealth of information. 

Early History of Life/Wing Sung - Pen History - The Fountain Pen Network

 

Further reading:

Remaking the 45: A Cooperation between HERO & Parker – FrankUnderwater

[WJM]

As I clearly said: I assume they [HERO] were nationalised when the communists took over.

 

But they could hardly nationalize Parker factory if there wasn't one in China. 

 

 

 

[corniche]

17 minutes ago, WJM said:

But they could hardly nationalize Parker factory if there wasn't one in China. 

 

There was a Parker factory in China; IIRC, it was built in the  Shanghai Province. 

 

- Sean 

[WJM]

Was there?

 

I know there is now, but in 1940s?

 

Wasn't by any chance Shanghai occupied by the Japanese at the time? 

[corniche]

36 minutes ago, WJM said:

Was there?

 

I know there is now, but in 1940s?

 

Yes, it was built in the 1930s. Parker had factories all over the world at one time. We're most familiar with Janesville and Newhaven because they were the last two GENUINE, ORIGINAL, factories to shut down, but at their zenith, George had several factories the world over - each continent had at least one.

 

Parker didn't become an institution by chance.

 

 

 

 

- Sean 

[FarmBoy]

 

 

Please provide a source document from Parker listing a factory in China in the 1930s or 1940s. 

Also ask yourself why Geo didn’t talk about his wonderful facilities in China in his book if they were so prominent in the Parker Pen Company. 
 

FPN seems to go through this over and over again. 

[corniche]

3 minutes ago, FarmBoy said:

 

 

Please provide a source document from Parker listing a factory in China in the 1930s or 1940s. 

Also ask yourself why Geo didn’t talk about his wonderful facilities in China in his book if they were so prominent in the Parker Pen Company. 
 

FPN seems to go through this over and over again. 

 

Actually, I misspoke earlier; it wasn't George who expanded manufacturing facilities to include China, it was Kenneth - and it wasn't in the '30s, but the '40s; soon after WWII.

 

- Sean 

[FarmBoy]

And I thought I’d watch your video. Marketing put a Frankenstein pen on display. Likely to show off the arrow nib but it doesn’t belong in the hard rubber Lucky Curve pretending to be a Duofold. 

[FarmBoy]

5 minutes ago, corniche said:

 

Actually, I misspoke earlier; it wasn't George who expanded manufacturing facilities to include China, it was Kenneth - and it wasn't in the '30s, but the '40s; soon after WWII.

 

- Sean 

So nothing to do with development of the 51 then. That’s progress. 

 

Let’s see that late 1940s documentation that Ken was setting up shop in China. 
 

[corniche]

4 hours ago, FarmBoy said:

And I thought I’d watch your video. Marketing put a Frankenstein pen on display. Likely to show off the arrow nib but it doesn’t belong in the hard rubber Lucky Curve pretending to be a Duofold. 

 

 

FarmBoy,

 

You'll find this video far more informative, but you have to invest an hour.

 

Yes, as I said, I misspoke before, it was Kenneth who expanded operations and handled all the marketing. George withdrew from life - and the company - after his eldest son, Russell died.

 

- Sean 

[inkstainedruth]

On 2/4/2021 at 9:37 AM, Karmachanic said:

The official Parker 51 Comeback soundtrack

Ruth Morrisson aka inkstainedruth

[corniche]

Hi all,

 

The release should be in short order now; Pen Chalet released this video today:

 

https://www.penchalet.com/fine_pens/fountain_pens/parker_51__fountain_pens.html

 

 

- Sean  

[peroride]

On 2/4/2021 at 5:14 AM, WJM said:

If a company "X" closes its previous factory and opens a new one in another country (let's say, China), are the new "X" products real "X"?

 

I think that depends on the specification.

 

It's the old designed by Apple in California assembled in China deal with my 7 year old iPhone. I consider it an Apple product and it has proven its utility thanks to Chinese assembly.

 

Frank Underwater said as much with Remaking the 45: A Cooperation between HERO & Parker and backed up by Parker's own company newsletter, Shoptalker magazine issue 926 circa 1979 (thank you Internet Archive💖) 

 

As much as I am an old romantic, it is a testament that Parker Pen Company name has had staying power to last this long from practical global awareness and cooperation.

 

That said, I want to encourage them 👍 and threw some skin into the pre-order game in hopes the new Parker 51 lives up to its brand name quality regardless of manufacture origin. It will be used and cherished as much as my old P51 or Wing Sung 601 unless of course it is cheap scratchy fragile (bleep)😤 😩 💩made in ....  🤣

[shostakovich]

Not very impressed - it looks and sounds cheap, and the c/c is an extra cost.

[Aysedasi]

As far as I can see, there are only fine and medium nibs available across the range, steel and gold. 

[Estycollector]

This AM I compared the two 1942 51's with a Flighter WS 601. I terms of scratchiness, all about the same. The 42's seem a little more medium or laid down more ink. My point is that there is not a lot of difference on the same two  paper type I have on the desk this morning. 

 

I've carried the WS for a couple of months beside a P45 ballpoint. I see nothing that tells me this pens metal is going to not age well. 

 

I think if Parker had reintroduced a repackaged WS Flighter 601 it would have been a hit with new and old FP users. 

[corniche]

1 hour ago, Aysedasi said:

As far as I can see, there are only fine and medium nibs available across the range, steel and gold. 

 

Hi Aysedasi,

 

I know; that pains me, too. I would have loved a fine/medium stub offering; something akin to Esterbrook's Journaling nib by Gena.

 

But being a large conglomerate; they're going with the textbook conglomerate nib choices.

 

- Sean

[corniche]

17 minutes ago, Estycollector said:

This AM I compared the two 1942 51's with a Flighter WS 601. I terms of scratchiness, all about the same. The 42's seem a little more medium or laid down more ink. My point is that there is not a lot of difference on the same two  paper type I have on the desk this morning. 

 

I've carried the WS for a couple of months beside a P45 ballpoint. I see nothing that tells me this pens metal is going to not age well. 

 

I think if Parker had reintroduced a repackaged WS Flighter 601 it would have been a hit with new and old FP users. 

 

Hi Esty,

 

I have little doubt the metal body will outlive us all; it's the section plastic and/or the inner cap seal that tend to self-destruct... although, I did have a lot of my Jinhao 992's crack/break apart on me, too.

 

That said, you are really tempting me to compromise my principles and buy a WS 601 - simply for the sake of experimentation and to satisfy a morbid curiosity you've fostered in me. I just wish they offered a juicy medium nib like Jinhao does.

 

- Sean

[corniche]

7 hours ago, shostakovich said:

Not very impressed - it looks and sounds cheap, and the c/c is an extra cost.

 

Yeah, that surprised me, too. I was expecting a converter.  

 

The squeaking plastic doesn't phase me; I've had the same issue with NOS Parkers and Sheaffers from the lauded "Golden Era."  That will go away with use, but I would have preferred a converter to the "luxe" packaging. This seems to indicate their skewing these pens more towards the "gift pen" market; rather than the dedicated "user."

 

That said; they'll still be well worth it, if the nib and build/material quality check out.

 

Well, we'll see soon. But this is why I held off on the Deluxe model and went with the teal/steel for starters.

 

 

- Sean   

[Estycollector]

2 minutes ago, corniche said:

 

Hi Esty,

 

I have little doubt the metal body will outlive us all; it's the section plastic and/or the inner cap seal that tend to self-destruct... although, I did have a lot of my Jinhao 992's crack/break apart on me, too.

 

That said, you are really tempting me to compromise my principles and buy a WS 601 - simply for the sake of experimentation and to satisfy a morbid curiosity you've fostered in me. I just wish they offered a juicy medium nib like Jinhao does.

 

- Sean

Dear Sean,

 

There is available, BTW, a metal section. I am not interested since the original Parker Flighter was black plastic. 

 

I do think it would be worth your while to consider given the cost. I bought mine off Etsy. I mean, buying something made by a Chinese person is not the same as supporting an authoritarian governmemt. They are folks just like me and you. Besides, American companies do business with China. 

 

There is no denying the WS 601 pay homage to the real 51. While it may not last, durability of most things is determined by the user. I tend to baby cars, tractors, chain saws, and pens for example. As a result I tend to have things forever. My Tahoe has 280K miles. 

 

I was just reminded that the plunger on the 601 is metal and gold color. That's a part that you never see until you fill the pen. That's a nice touch.