Introduction And Help Identifying A Pen

August 19, 2019

Hi,

I've been reading this forum for some time, but haven't posted until now. I've been using fountain pens for many years now and although I don't consider myself a collector, I do have a modest collection of pens, a mix of new and vintage. On the vintage side I have four L. E. Waterman pens--a 42 safety pen, an 0942 1/2V (which is a long name for a very small pen), a rather rough lever filler with gold filigree, and a newly acquired eyedropper filler. It's this last pen I'd like some help identifying.

Here are some pictures:

Apart from the nib, I can see no markings. The nib, feed, and section seem like they belong together, although the feed is more pointed than the other vintage Watermans I have, which are more rounded at the top. I can't find a picture of another pen with quite the same style bands, but overall the barrel seems about right for a Waterman eyedropper filler and in basic form seems similar to other Waterman pens with mother of pearl overlay.

The cap is a different story. I'm suspicious that the cap is from another pen, perhaps not a Waterman. It does fit well, but I can't find a similar filigree pattern on a Waterman. The ring-top seems out of place too, perhaps added by an owner. Having said that, I'm no expert--which is why I'm asking here :-)

This was an eBay purchase, and I knew at the start that it might be some kind of Frankenpen, so I bid accordingly. I think it's pretty, and it's a nice writer (although the barrel is a little thin for my taste), so I'm happy with it whatever it is. But I'm curious if anyone has an idea.

Thanks,

Alex

Edited August 19, 2019 by arswaim

August 19, 2019

Sorry i don't have an answer for you but i do have a question. Is it possible to post a picture of the feed ? that may be useful to tell what the pen is. I have two frankenpens which i thought was from the UK. one of the pens have almost the same band design as your pen. both my pens have warranted nibs and feeds doesn't look like any waterman feeds.

August 19, 2019

Whatever it is, it's a treasure. Get yourself a bit of silk ribbon and wear it proudly.

August 20, 2019

Do you have a photo of the feed and the link to the auction. It looks to a franken pen, only part that is Waterman is the nib.

August 20, 2019

Sure, here are some photos of the feed:

Sorry i don't have an answer for you but i do have a question. Is it possible to post a picture of the feed ? that may be useful to tell what the pen is. I have two frankenpens which i thought was from the UK. one of the pens have almost the same band design as your pen. both my pens have warranted nibs and feeds doesn't look like any waterman feeds.

August 20, 2019

Do you have a photo of the feed and the link to the auction. It looks to a franken pen, only part that is Waterman is the nib.

Just added some photos of the feed above. Here's a link to the auction: https://www.ebay.com/itm/WATERMAN-EYEDROPPER-PEN-GOLD-OVERLAY-CAP-PEARL-OVERLAY-BARREL-2-GOLD-NIB-/123869450772?nma=true&si=FUIsRZ1R1PQrpknUyHEB3nZ4je8%253D&orig_cvip=true&nordt=true&rt=nc&_trksid=p2047675.l2557

Thanks,

Alex

August 20, 2019

Your pen is of Parker Manufacture, most likely from 1900 to 1905, the closest model I can find is a picture of is the "Lucky Curve" model 15, which appears to be a later model. It is most likely a frankenpen, with a Waterman feed, as their feeds were the first ones which reduced periodic drips from the nib (ring of recent manufacture, nib and feed Waterman). Pictures of your Pen's cousins can be found in a book written by Jonathan Steinburg "Fountain Pens", gracing the right side of the cover, and page 17, on his section on eyedropper pens. I am not trying to send you away, but the Parker forum folks can probably give you much better detail, as I am most certainly NOT a Parker expert. BTW, you can probably search for the book on Amazon, and see a picture of the cover of the book, your pen's kissing cousin is on the right side of the cover.

http://vintagepen.blogspot.com/2011/10/

As a note: other pen manufacturers copied Parker's popular and blingish design from that era as well. They typically had a "warrantied" brand nib.

https://www.google.com/url?sa=i&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=imgres&cd=&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=2ahUKEwjOz5WrwJHkAhVAHjQIHcQuBJEQjRx6BAgBEAQ&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.vintagepen.net%2F-other-makers---pg-3.html&psig=AOvVaw2bYOrqyiaTW3pvRXjcpFjQ&ust=1566392343057772

https://www.worthpoint.com/worthopedia/lot-pens-parker-51-blue-diamond-434986923

As a post-note, you got that pen for a steal. Refurbished (original ring, feed, nib, cracks fixed) , its value probably rests in the 400 to 800 dollar range.

Edited August 20, 2019 by Addertooth

August 20, 2019

If any of you have Glen Bowen's book Collectible Fountain pens, in my copy on page 32 is a reprint of a 1906 Parker advert for Lucky Curve Fountain Pens . Though it's only a B & W reproduction, I think the OP's pen is a No. 15, priced at $7.00 (!) and described as a ''Pearl Barrel with gold bands. Just out. One of the prettiest in our line of fancy pens. Gold Filigree on Cap. Name plate so the name of owner can be engraved on same''.

No sign on a ring top in the advert though and no sign of the name plate in the OP's photos. But I think we're getting closer.

P.S. I've just looked at Penography's pages of Lucky Curve pens, and it's there in colour - take a peek.

Edited August 20, 2019 by pen lady

August 20, 2019

If some one with a no 15 can post the measurements of the inner section and the pen then it should be fairly easy to check .probably both the nib and the feed are replacement parts and if you could source a lucky curve feed and a nib then it would be a very nice pen . Congrats

Also you may want to examine the cap lip carefully to see if there are any signs of a faded writing. that would make it easy to identify. David Nishimura's site have 2x No 16 pens with several images. Although its not the same pen, check them to see if they are around the same( level of details / engraving style ) when it comes to the overlay on the cap.

https://www.vintagepens.com/morepics.php?id=10478&pics=7

https://www.vintagepens.com/morepics.php?id=13448&pics=10

August 21, 2019

I strongly suggest you ask those questions on the "Parker" forum, you were just fortunate that a couple people here were capable of recognizing it. Pen Lady came into this forum to look, after a posted a request there on your behalf. We aren't trying to run you off, we just want you to be in the best possible position to get a fully qualified answer, as versus my best guess.

August 21, 2019

Your pen is of Parker Manufacture, most likely from 1900 to 1905, the closest model I can find is a picture of is the "Lucky Curve" model 15, which appears to be a later model. It is most likely a frankenpen, with a Waterman feed, as their feeds were the first ones which reduced periodic drips from the nib (ring of recent manufacture, nib and feed Waterman). Pictures of your Pen's cousins can be found in a book written by Jonathan Steinburg "Fountain Pens", gracing the right side of the cover, and page 17, on his section on eyedropper pens. I am not trying to send you away, but the Parker forum folks can probably give you much better detail, as I am most certainly NOT a Parker expert. BTW, you can probably search for the book on Amazon, and see a picture of the cover of the book, your pen's kissing cousin is on the right side of the cover.

http://vintagepen.blogspot.com/2011/10/

As a note: other pen manufacturers copied Parker's popular and blingish design from that era as well. They typically had a "warrantied" brand nib.

https://www.google.com/url?sa=i&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=imgres&cd=&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=2ahUKEwjOz5WrwJHkAhVAHjQIHcQuBJEQjRx6BAgBEAQ&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.vintagepen.net%2F-other-makers---pg-3.html&psig=AOvVaw2bYOrqyiaTW3pvRXjcpFjQ&ust=1566392343057772

https://www.worthpoint.com/worthopedia/lot-pens-parker-51-blue-diamond-434986923

As a post-note, you got that pen for a steal. Refurbished (original ring, feed, nib, cracks fixed) , its value probably rests in the 400 to 800 dollar range.

Please don't make suggestions if you're not familiar with the pen in question, you are getting this persons hopes up. This pen is most definitely neither Waterman or Parker.

August 21, 2019

PenBuyer1796,

You should note (because you copied it) I left a caveat:

"

As a note: other pen manufacturers copied Parker's popular and blingish design from that era as well. They typically had a "warrantied" brand nib.

https://www.google.c...566392343057772

https://www.worthpoi...amond-434986923

"

I will also say the similarity is striking with other well established Parker 15 pens.

Some of these images are courtesy of Pendimonium.

Note it came with both flat and dome top, with Mother of Pearl and Abilone. The engraving on the rings seems to be a similar style with some of the images.....

but as noted, some of the other pens have very similar appearance. However, he has already purchased the pen, it is too late to encourage him to avoid the purchase.

And yes, it is a lovely pen, regardless of who the daddy is.

There was a lot of variation in the designs.

Edited August 21, 2019 by Addertooth

August 21, 2019

Thank you all very much for your replies! I'll take your advise, Addertooth, and ask on the Parker forum as well.

Pen lady, thanks for pointing me towards the Penography site. My pen definitely bears a more than passing resemblance to the Parker #15, although it could be a knock-off of course. Indeed, the patterning on the the bands is rather indistinct and a little crude seeming--or possibly just worn--so it's hard to tell.

For what it's worth, here's photo of the feed, nib, and section disassembled:

Whatever it is, I'm happy with it and appreciate visually and as a nice writing pen.

Thanks again!