What Am I Missing About Expensive Pens?

[Uncial]

Ghost Plane - that Blue Hour skeleton OBBB you have; apparently if you shut your eyes you could mistake a Chinese cheap pen for the same thing. So here's my plan. You send me one pen and I give you five! I will send a Jinhao 159, 599, two Baoer Eight Horses (that would be about the same weight, right?), and a vintage Wing Sung. So long as you keep your eyes shut you'll think you are still writing with your skeleton Blue Hour and the best of it is, you'll think you own five of them! Deal?

[TSherbs]

I'm glad the authorization process has been streamlined. It used to be more circuitous back when I read about it in "The Trial".

Try "The Castle." You can't even get inside the building..

[Ghost Plane]

Ghost Plane - that Blue Hour skeleton OBBB you have; apparently if you shut your eyes you could mistake a Chinese cheap pen for the same thing. So here's my plan. You send me one pen and I give you five! I will send a Jinhao 159, 599, two Baoer Eight Horses (that would be about the same weight, right?), and a vintage Wing Sung. So long as you keep your eyes shut you'll think you are still writing with your skeleton Blue Hour and the best of it is, you'll think you own five of them! Deal?

Just as soon as you hand over the Hope Diamond in return for these 5 sparkly pieces of glass. They’re all shiny, right?

[Uncial]

[cue Mission Impossible music]

[Lloyd]

Sorry, meant honey pot, not sweet spot.

Still too high in simple carbs.

[inkstainedruth]

@TSherbs (above)

 

From my point of view, fountain pens over, say, $300 had better be works of art... Or they are fleece jobs. As others have noted, we are free to throw our money around how we please. One person's fleece is another's must-have.

 

Of course, there is the 'Golden Fleece' sought by Jason and the Argonauts. That seemed to be a must-have.

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Golden_Fleece

 

I remember too many hours on this in Latin III

 

I made a "Golden Fleece" for an SCA event in the Boston area once. Wilton "Little Lamb Pan" out of pound cake, covered with edible gold leaf, and then a base for it out of one one the Wilton pans that look like you've sliced the end off a sphere (I forget what they're called), also out of pound cake, and garnished with bay leaves.....

Ruth Morrisson aka inkstainedruth

[inkstainedruth]

@ praxim, dcwaites, and Lloyd --

But I think you guys need to move the side discussion over to the conspiracy theory thread.... See Ghost Plane for details....

The password, BTW, is "swordfish" (because the password is ALWAYS "swordfish"...).

Ruth Morrisson aka inkstainedruth

[Bluey]

 

Well, he answers himself when he says Montblanc pens are "junk", an emotional term that I translate to "no, I don't think Montblanc pricing is fair". Of course, I also take that this is not particularly aimed to Montblanc but to what Montblanc represents (which can be considered, on its own, a big success for them as it means the "Montblanc" brand exemplary represents their intent).

 

Well spotted. As you quite rightly point out, one would have thought it was quite clear about where I stand on MB. Except to Uncial who, despite the contrary having been explained to him on more than 1 occasion, continues to trot out predictable lines like this to me on a regular basis, despite the fact that Montblanc wasn't alluded to even once in the post to which he refers:

 

 

Posted by Uncial:

I think that is your perception due to your personal beef with Montblanc in particular. I don't believe you are right on that point though. I've seen, maybe a handful of posts here that might fall into this and not all about Montblanc. You could argue that your own repeated posts about Sailor and your repeated declaration of hatred of all things Montblanc is a mirror image of exactly the same thing. At least, it appears that way when read

 

 

 

 

So same again tomorrow, Uncial? Next week, next month, maybe? When you can state once again that I "hate" Montblanc.

Don't worry, nobody is going to think that you're having a sly underhanded dig at me as you're a fan of MB, and everyone is going to think it's just a perceptive and casual random observation by you about my "hatred" of Montblanc. Just remember to end it on a cutesy little line like this to make it appear casual to other readers, and nobody will be any the wiser:

Posted by Uncial

At least, it appears that way when read

Edited March 18, 2018 by Bluey

[praxim]

Ludicrous.

 

..., please, don't include expensive junk Montblanc ...

 

Ah, but it is only what Montblanc represents, of which, as jmnav said as quoted, "it means the "Montblanc" brand exemplary represents their intent".

 

Just so.

[Bluey]

^

Rather than being selective, it would take on it's full meaning if the full sentence is quoted, thus:

 

And, please, don't include expensive junk Montblanc or other similar nibs.

Nice try

Edited March 18, 2018 by Bluey

[praxim]

No difference in the reality we observe; apart from which, I wasn't talking to you.

[Lloyd]

Bluey, have you ever spent any time using a properly adjusted MB? If not, why do refer so negatively about them?

[Corona688]

Maybe stop trying to sell mb's to the person who hates mb's if you want him to shut up about mb's?

[Bluey]

No difference in the reality we observe; apart from which, I wasn't talking to you.

Ok, my apologies.

 

Bluey, have you ever spent any time using a properly adjusted MB? If not, why do refer so negatively about them?

Yes at plenty of pen shows. They were no difference in feel to the Bock And Pelikan steel nibs that I had. Quite smooth with a bit of bounce, but there was no character there in any of them. I didn't feel anything of note to connect with, and with the price tag this just diminishes the feeling for me to less than nothing.

And as I've used many variations of the full range of Bock nibs in my personal possession, I'm wondering what can I possibly experience after a day if they're exactly the same. Perhaps the Montblanc nibs will turn into Cinderella after a day?

[Lloyd]

Not all Bock nibs are the same; try a Danitrio Soft EEF nib or, if you like 'em wide, soft stub. Bock makes their generic in-house nibs AND custom ones for a variety of manufacturers.

 

MB makes their own and they vary. Had I not been gifted one from my parents for an academic achievement, I wouldn't have bought one (I detest standing out in a crowd and looking pompous)...BUT, I love the way the one I have writes. In 1993, I was gifted a new 146 that had skipping issues. I sent it in to MB USA on 3-4 occasions but they couldn't make it stop skipping for my hand. With each attempted repair, they gave me a complimentary piece of swag (all the way up to a leather 2 pen case). After their 4th attempt, they agreed to swap it with a 149 at no additional charge. That pen has been flawless for over 20 years now. It's nib is spectacular (barely bouncy very smooth but not uncontrollably so) but there's so much more than makes the 149 great. The "grip to tip" ergonomics may look huge but it feels unbelievably comfy to me. The balance (unposted) is perfect, making the weight disappear but that weight sucks up small vibrations due to paper roughness.

 

I have a fair share of great pens at a variety of price points (Kaweco Sport, Pel M200, Pilot Falcon and VP, CONID Minimalistica, TWSBI 540, Danitrio Densho & Takumi, 2 Edisons, a Newton,a Platinum 3776, a customized Pilot 743 FA, P51s, ...) and they're all fantastic for their price range and purpose (small and pocketable versus desk). If I had to chose between them, my favorites are the pocket-sized Newton, Danitrios, MB149, CONID, P51, Platinum 3776 UEF, and customized Pilot 743 FA. Each is fantastic in its own way. All the nibs are great (the CONID is a very good Ti, the Newton is an AWESOME steel needlepoint, the rest are gold) but what makes these my favorites is so much more. I've been to a half dozen shows and never feel in love with any pen enough to buy at the show. However, I think that's a function of my mental state at the show than a measure of the pens. I think I don't assess the pens at a show the same way I do in my day-to-day life.

 

Bottom line, buy what you like, like what you buy...and let others do the same without judging them nor their choices.

[stephenfountain]

 

... I sent it in to MB USA on 3-4 occasions but they couldn't make it stop skipping for my hand. With each attempted repair, they gave me a complimentary piece of swag (all the way up to a leather 2 pen case). After their 4th attempt, they agreed to swap it with a 149 at no additional charge. That pen has been flawless for over 20 years now...

 

.

 

On customer service alone that is a worthy recommendation!

[Bluey]

Lloyd,

I have had more than enough Bock nibs, both generic and manufacturer 'customised', and more than enough to know their nuances by now. What can Montblanc offer me than a trip to the nibmeister can't? Apart from money wasted.

You mention that you had to send one of your pens for repair, which shouldn't happen at such a price point. And this quote from you is horrifying: "With each attempted repair.....".

 

When I buy a pen, I don't want to EVER have to deal with customer support. That's the whole point of a good product. Montblanc customer support is (in)famous and well talked about, and with good reason. That's another good reason not to touch their products.

 

Apart from trying nibs themselves, the best and only real way is to understand the business model of a brand. Montblanc's business model has already been published several places on the forum, and this along with my experience of their nibs tells me everything and more that I need to know about why I'm never likely to invest in their products.

 

In summary, Montblanc represents: generic writing experience + probably have to send it off to be repaired + not possible to repair myself + expensive and poor value. I can't see any positives whatsoever.

 

Currently I'm in the process of narrowing down my 'collection' as far as it can possibly go, and that means having to decide what's most important, what's likely to continue to be the most important in the long term.

I don't see Montblanc figuring anywhere in my pen collection's future. If I ever have a lobotomy, things may change, but until then.

Edited March 19, 2018 by Bluey

[Lloyd]

I worked with a celebrated nibmeister on one pen three times: at a show, and subsequently, shipping it back twice. After all of that, I wish it wrote half as nicely as the MB (I'm super fussy). But, as I said, what I love about the MB is so much more than just its great nib. The feel/ergonomics (grip-to-tip) are super comfy.

 

I could certainly be content if none of my pens exceeded $100. Heck, I could be content with just mechanical pencils. However, I consider myself blessed that I can use pens that act as a more natural extension of my arm. I should add that I factor the look of my pens at <5% of the pen...I'm a very utilitarian guy.

[Lloyd]

By the way, I sincerely doubt a standard Bock nib can be customized to write like a Danitrio soft EEF nib.

[Bluey]

Perhaps the great feel of an MB nib that you speak of is in your mind? Price and amount of effort used to get the damn thing to work can have such an effect.

 

The thing about MB is that they're not making pens for people who write with them, as alluded to above. From a business perspective, no business person with an IQ greater than a fly will ever waste time, resources, and especially money on making a product with a great nib when their target market are not people who write with them day in day out. Vintage MB will be a different story, but I'm not going there either.

 

 

By the way, I sincerely doubt a standard Bock nib can be customized to write like a Danitrio soft EEF nib.

I don't think i'd enjoy writing with any EEF nib.

Edited March 19, 2018 by Bluey