Advice On A New Pen In The 0-$100 Range

[woleizihan]

Buying flex nibs are tricky unless you get the chance to try out the nib yourself. I normally buy at pen shows when I have that chance or buy cheap on Ebay and hope for a surprise. One thing I would suggest now is the Pilot FA nib becuase you can expect the performance and it's much softer than most modern nibs out there.

 

It's probably going to be more than your budget.

Edited January 23, 2018 by woleizihan

[SoulSamurai]

Well, how about a fountain pen that takes dip pen nibs? Desiderata pens are designed to work with dip nibs, while I've heard that Ranga can modify their pens to work with them.

[Simulacrum]

The dip pen nib is something I'm going to try. I have some G nibs I'm going to put into a jinhao x750. But I don't generally like drawing with dip pens as much, very scratchy compared to a nib with 'tipping' (I think that's what you call it?) that a 'normal' fountain pen would have. I don't mind some feedback and I don't mind using them but I am hoping to find something smoother than those, while realizing I am of course, going to be giving up most of the flex, but I'd still like more give than the normal steel nibs that I have if I'm going to spend around $100. If it can't be had for that price then I will probably just get an eco or some of the other cheaper options and some inks.

 

On the Falcon Suggestion - unfortunately, I can't find any less than $180 CAD. Is it possible to purchase just a Falcon nib and put it in something ? Would that work ?

Edited January 23, 2018 by Simulacrum

[woleizihan]

I don't think Pilot sells replacement nibs so finding a spare nib is tough. However, if you are interested in spare nibs, you can just buy vintage Waterman nibs or whatever flex nibs comfortably within your budget while a complete pen does not.

[SoulSamurai]

Some people modify cheap Noodlers and FPR nibs to be easier to flex by taking some material from the sides with a dremel. Google "ease my flex mod".

[Simulacrum]

I don't think Pilot sells replacement nibs so finding a spare nib is tough. However, if you are interested in spare nibs, you can just buy vintage Waterman nibs or whatever flex nibs comfortably within your budget while a complete pen does not.

I did a little searching after the suggestion to get a used Esterbrook. The nibs seem pretty affordable, but maybe hard to tell how good they are until you get one. I also saw some waterman nibs etc.. But what pens can they go in ? Do they have to go into expensive pens ? Like could you put one in a jinhao or something ?

 

I like the idea of a vintage-ish pen but I'm not sure about the rubber sac issues. I like using pigmented inks - Platinum Carbon Black, Sei Boku ... Will they work ok with these pens ?

[woleizihan]

#2 waterman nibs will go in smaller sized Noodlers, like nib creaper or charlie pen as well as the #5 sized Schmidt feed according to my experience. I think gold nibs should work fine with pigmented inks however, rubber sacs may not.

[MG66]

 

No, it's literally a double nib:

 

http://bestchoice.click/WebRoot/Store3/Shops/c4bf5c24-c095-456c-b81f-08bd18e44a47/MediaGallery/1_Inicio_bestchoice/10_Catalogo/Archivos_en_descripcion/0551305209_Kaweco,_boquilla_Twin_C.png

 

You can pick up the nib unit at Jetpens: https://www.jetpens.com/Kaweco-Calligraphy-Fountain-Pen-Replacement-Nib-Double-Nib-Black-Body/pd/19519

 

I'm not sure where else you can find it or if you can find it already in the pen, but at least this way you can pick the Kaweco Sport in the colour and material of your choice (or maybe a different Kaweco if you want, I think they have other pen models that use the same nib units, but don't quote me on that).

 

 

That is so cool... Where's the impulse buy thread?

 

- c

[MG66]

... and ordered.

[vojtahlad]

I would recommend buying some Lamy pen with a circular section (Aion or Studio models) and several various Lamy nibs. The nibs are very easy to change which can be handy for drawing. Or you may try the Wing Sung 3008 - a Chinese piston filler compatible with Lamy nibs. It is much cheaper but the quality control is not so consistent.

[SoulSamurai]

... and ordered.

I'm not sure whether to feel guilty or not now... depends on whether you end up liking it or not I guess...

[Simulacrum]

I'm not sure whether to feel guilty or not now... depends on whether you end up liking it or not I guess...

Lol. At least this post will end up with at least one purchase ! I'll try to add to that.

 

After some more careful research, I'm closer to a decision but still a bit uncertain. I'm finding that what most of you said here has been reiterated by some but not all of my research. But I've found some good videos that seem more to the truth of the matter than others and comply with everyone here: None of the pilot 74,91 and the other gold nibs we've been talking about will give any real flex. Even the Falcon, which I had considered for a few moments seems to be not really worth it (interesting video comparison of a stock falcon vs a modified flexier one -

). And you are risking ruining the pen by using it as a flex pen. Not worth it to me; they are way more flexy than the custom /heritage lines it seems, but for that price - if you're looking for flex.. .why not get a real flex pen ? So that's where I'm at - I've looked into getting something vintage but It seems that unless I get pretty lucky they are all about $150 ++ for cheaper ones. And they seem hard to find, and the quality / condition is going to be questionable buying from random people. I'm pretty trusting generally but that's a good chunk of money and I'm not much of a gambler. So that's still on the table, but I'm leaning towards getting a Pilot 74/91 anyways because - Very few people/ reviews have said anything bad about these pens (the only negative thing I've seen for my uses has been that they don't write well inverted /upside or whatever you call that - which is the only issue for me - as I do like to do that). And for the price I can get one at - $90 CAD it's so close to a TWSBI 580, Lamy logo, Parsons, and most of the others - For an extra $15-30 I'm getting something pretty similar to my 580 but only better from the sounds of it. Smooth flow, lots of ink, works all the time, no issues etc... Sounds like the perfect pen ! lol - I'll try not to set my expectations too high or I'll surely be disappointed. I guess I'm still considering the platinum 3776 as well but I do like the size of the pilot con-70 converter better. I can't get a Sailor 1911 for a reasonable price so that's out - the profit is in the price range but still more than the Pilot and the Platinum so...

 

So I think it's either that or an ECO lol - So Nib wise on one of those Pilots - I'm leaning towards a SM (soft medium?) - which it seems is about the same (size wise) as a Lamy Medium or so ? A Broad - I'm guessing about the same as my TWSBI 580 B (but nicer performing I hope ? ) . I even saw a BB which is pretty tempting because I don't know another pen I've seen where that's even an option and I do like thick juicy lines when drawing sometimes.

 

Any thoughts on nib size comparisons ? Does the bit of flexiness you get in the SM make it about the same as what the B would be ? And do the B and BB nibs have the same kind of 'soft' bouncy feeling as the Soft M because they are so much thicker even though they aren't labelled 'soft' ?

 

Thanks everyone.

Edited January 24, 2018 by Simulacrum

[woleizihan]

I was talking about the Pilot FA nib like this one:

 

https://www.nibs.com/pens/pilot/pilot-custom-912-black-rhodium

 

, not the soft nibs on the Falcon. There's a noticeable difference according to my experience.

Edited January 24, 2018 by woleizihan

[Runnin_Ute]

I often see people talking about using vintage pens / semi-vintage pens. What's the difference between semi and vintage ?

 

Where would one go about buying one ? I feel like I don't know enough about pens to go this route but maybe that's not true. Do they require more work or tinkering, or are they less durable or reliable ? What is the advantage of getting one of these ?

Some people define vintage as pre 1960 when cartridge/converter pens were introduced with the Parker 45. Some use a different cutoff. The 45 is widely available as it was made from 1960 to 2007 or 2008. Nibs screw in and are relatively inexpensive. Both 14k gold and steel available. Ebay and other pen vendors have 45's.

 

I just upgraded one that had a broken barrel in 5 minutes. Bought new barrel and section, took off cap, unscrewed the nib and pulled off the trim. Put it on the new barrel and section and filled it.

 

Esterbrook J pens are lever filled and you may have to replace the sac which is pretty easy. Lots of nib options. Or you can buy restored at $30-40.

[Simulacrum]

The estie. Idea Im still looking into but Ive not seen any as cheap as $30-40 w a flex bib

 

But. I just saw a video of a sailor zoom nib! This looked pretty cool to me. Any experiences with these? It seems the difference is that with a real flex bib you can more easily change thickness gradually more easily. The zoom is a bit trickier But good for hatching and cross hatching it seems to me.

Edited January 24, 2018 by Simulacrum

[senzen]

I would suggest spending at least a little of that budget on some specialty paper, like Tomoe River. I eventually realized it was more about the inks than the pens for me. From cheaper to more expensive at your budget my experience has been:

 

Pilot Metropolitan medium ($11 USD): zero problems, the nib is still a little fine for my taste, and not as wet as I'd like; I fiddled with it and it now brings out the best of Fuyu Gaki.

 

Muji aluminium (4, $15): nice looking, reliable; one size nib , the grip section can get grimy, if you drop it it will show, not that comfortable in cold weather.

 

Lamy Vista (7, $22): this should be the perfect pen for me, but the nibs haven't always been smooth, and the windows on the barrel make them dry faster. Because they are easy to disassemble they are good with troublesome inks.

 

Platinum Cool (2, $33): one writes like a dream with a wet japanese medium, one always had problems starting.

 

Parker Sonnets (2, can't remember how much I paid for them): some of my oldest pens, and most troublesome; i ended getting new steel nibs and feeds and even a section... Only to find they dry even quicker than Lamy Vistas! Eventually got some silicone grease and that seems to have done the trick, they are now very nice pens to write with, just watchout for knock offs.

 

Second hand Lamy Studio in Imperial Blue. Beautiful pen, the shiny section might not be to everyone's taste, the nib is the same and in the vistas but is incredibly smooth.

 

Kaweco Sport: I was given this as a gift and always hated it, went through three different converters and none worked, in the end some silicone grease revived one and it's now usable.

 

Faber Castell Ambition if Pearwood ($95 through Massdrop): gorgeous pen, the wood is very comfortable to hold, the nib is smooth; you need to get used to the idea of having no section. In plain black these pens start in the $60s, without a converter.

[Runnin_Ute]

I mentioned $30-40 as a number for a restored Estie that you might pay without taking a specialty nib into account.

 

I have a 9450 (EF), two 9550's (EF), a 1551 (med), two 1555 Gregg (F), a 2464 ( and a Venus Fine if memory serves correctly. I would have to grab the box I have them in.

 

For specialty nibs like Flex, italic, or stubs you can pay $30-40 just for the nib or more. (esterbrook.net)

[woleizihan]

I mentioned $30-40 as a number for a restored Estie that you might pay without taking a specialty nib into account.

 

I have a 9450 (EF), two 9550's (EF), a 1551 (med), two 1555 Gregg (F), a 2464 ( and a Venus Fine if memory serves correctly. I would have to grab the box I have them in.

 

For specialty nibs like Flex, italic, or stubs you can pay $30-40 just for the nib or more. (esterbrook.net)

I think the stubs are just a hair more expensive than regular nibs like 9556 but flex nibs will certainly cost $30-40.

[Simulacrum]

Just an update to everyone - I feel like I owe you guys an end to all of this - I'll definitely let you know what I ended up doing for those of you who are interested.

 

I'm heavily leaning towards getting a Sailor profit with a zoom nib. I have contacted a number of pen places (in the US and in Canada - not many here- one that I've found) and have been learning about different 'Estie' nibs etc.. I think to get what I want will require 30-40 USD for the pen and another $40-60 USD for a 9000 series flex nib from what I can tell. plus shipping (seems to be about $15 USD and possibly some duty -$10-20 USD) That pen becomes $100 USD = $125 CAD -minimum. Almost the same price as the sailor profit standard with a zoom nib.

 

So I'm going to keep my eye open for some deals and 'stuff' in the vintage market - you have definitely piqued my interest in these pens and the price isn't outrageous really (pretty much at the top of my budget for a pen) but I'm also a little uncertain how much I'll like them. (though I think I will- they seem pretty awesome really-and I kind of like how old some of them are (1920's ! ) and imagining who could have used this pen - could be anyone !

 

I like to imagine it was someone who did something pretty cool with it and the pen is going to carry on it's

mission - and not just some jerk who was a horrible person - but even then, the pen probably wanted to leave them lol

I'm leaning towards the Sailor zoom though - I've been checking on some other zoom posts and threads trying to figure out if it's really what I want. Trying to figure out if the more expensive 21k zoom nib writes that much different than the 14k zoom (if at all). You can get both on the smaller 'standard' profit pen and there's about $25 separating them.

 

And to pseudo88 - I do already have some Tomoe River paper and I will also be getting some new ink - side note- uncertain if I want to get some De Atramentis Document Inks and try some mixing - or just get the colours that I want to try to mix. I may get some Noodler's Black Swan English Rose, A green like a Noodler's Sequoia/ Zhivago (diluted they seem pretty similar). I've only ever used platinum Carbon black , pigment blue, and Sailor Sei Boku up until now. But I'm thinking of broadening my ink horizons so thank you for reminding me to keep those in my budget!

Edited January 25, 2018 by Simulacrum

[welch]

- Parker 45. The first modern pen, 1960, meaning that an owner did not, ordinarily, need to send a 45 to Parker Service. Pieces unscrew and can be swapped. Nib unit, as well. So popular that Parker continued making them until about 2007 or 2008. Typical EBay price: $24 - $50.

 

- Esterbrook J series (Small J, Slender J, Full J): nearly indestructible. Beautiful colors. Swap-able nibs, about 30 different types. Easy to re-sac an Esty. EBay prices range from $15 - $45.

 

- Parker 51: the world's most wanted fountain pen, the most popular fountain pen of the golden age of fountain pens. Prices for a restored P-51 are abut $100, give or take about $25 (higher prices for rare colors or caps).

 

 

NOTE: the "flexible" Esty 9xxx nib is softer than the 9668, but is not like a 1950's German flex nib. As best I can tell, it was made to write comfortably, but not to write Spencerian or any of the decorative character-sets.

Edited January 25, 2018 by welch