Sinistrer Opinion Sought

[Chmara]

For 76 years as a lefty I have been looking not only for shortcuts in the right handed world, but for methods that let me imitate the rest of the world.

 

On my 76th Birthday I decided I would learn (note I do not say TRY to learn) Calligraphy. IN the past three months I have spent more time on the net looking for tools, books and methods on the net than in teal practice, although my day to day handwriting has progressed from 5th Grade delinquent to Sixth Grade needing practice.

 

In a search for literature on the printed page I have only found two offerings that look at least basically beyond "then mirror the right handed movements. Both are by Margaret Shepherd whom I have e mailed with no success in gaining an answer during these holidays.

 

I have found her two titles are both beyond my means in the used market, unless I skip a bunch of meals over a couple of months and use my community food bank to get basics, like pasta.

 

The first book is "The Basics of Left-Handed Calligraphy" Which I have not found for under $80 andsecopnd is "The Left Handed Calligrapher," which seems to be a collections of alphabets adapted for we lefties. It runs over $40 in used condition.

 

HAS ANYONE READ OR USED THESE BOOKS (left handed, but truly sinister or or not in modern parlance) and care to share an opinion on one or both as they might relate to an elderly inexperienced person with a desire to learn and practice, but not go into pain (either physical or emotional) or emotional because "It just don't work that way."

 

I would like to know before I have to go on a severe diet of pasta and beans to get them -- or whether I should continue to muddle through my current no result producing frustrations.

 

Thank you

 

Gregg In Tucson, AZ where ink dries FAST!

 

 

[Marioferu]

I am very impresed with somebody of your age that is daring to learn something new. It is a shame that so many aged people face finance strugle to reach their dream. I think is Fair that they could download ebooks from places like the p i r a t e b a y. I hope somebody here can share with you what you need.

Edited December 28, 2017 by Marioferu

[sidthecat]

Leonardo may have had the best idea: realizing that lettering was designed for right-handed people, he learned to write backwards.

If you’re starting from zip you could give that a try. I use a hand position that allows me to pull most of my strokes instead of pushing them. It just looks weird.

[Ron Z]

I am very impresed with somebody of your age that is daring to learn something new. It is a shame that so many aged people face finance strugle to reach their dream. I think is Fair that they could download ebooks from places like the piratebay. I hope somebody here can share with you what you need.

 

So, you're suggesting/advocating stealing someone's intellectual property? Would you consider it to be fair if they did that to you after you developed something or wrote a book?

[Bo Bo Olson]

One could try Gutenberg. That's legal.

 

Then there is the Pass it Forward section, where someone might just give you one of the books.

[Chmara]

Searches in Gutenberg have been fruitless by subject or I'm ignorant of how to search by subject. Found a couple of manuscript reproductions PDF's though.

[Arkanabar]

You ought to go to IAMPETH.com (eta: International Association of Master Penmen, Engrossers, and Teachers of Handwriting). They have plenty of classic resources in PDF, with expired copyrights, free to legally download.

 

In fact, I really need to bookmark that site myself.

Edited December 29, 2017 by Arkanabar

[stevekolt]

IAMPETH added to my bookmarks.

[Arkanabar]

Oh, I ought to add -- my sister does left-handed calligraphy, often in an uncial style. She rotates the paper 90 degrees clockwise and writes down the paper like the Chinese do, writing towards herself and making each line to the left of the one before, making her letters on their side.

[Ergative]

Salman Khattak has been playing around with making instructional videos on copperplate for lefties. He writes with his right hand, but backwards, and then flips the video. I've only seen one video on his instagram, but it looks quite persuasive. He might have some ideas about other instructional techniques.

[Chmara]

Dear rare -

 

Flipping the image does not really work for me as the anatomy of a left hander's wrist does not permit a left to right writer's wrist to flex properly for pen blade angle control, and does not take into acoount the real problem of smearing with wet inks for a side writer or underwriter working in close angles. This does become less critical in Copperplate -- but Blackletter???? Ouch.

 

It is thought that lefties are only 10 per cent of the market -- and I have no data to change that idea. That makes the investment of time to help us solve our particular problems costly, and often dependent upon charitablCe action by righties. But a righty wrist ain't a lefty wrist. And the lefties who have currently being teaching on you-tube (which I can afford) tend to use mono-line type rollerball and gel pens, or throw-away markers whose felts wear out real quick.

 

ExGC

[Venemo]

There are many online resources, for example: https://piecescalligraphy.com/2015/10/04/can-lefties-do-calligraphy/

 

I'm left-handed as well, and I'm an "overwriter", which means that I'm holding the pen upside down compared to how right-handed people do. This means that my downstrokes are equivalent to their upstrokes and vice versa. I can still hold italic and stub nibs in the correct angle, though. But because of the difference in up and down strokes, flexible nibs just do not work for me. However, I would guess that a brush pen might. (But have not tried yet.)

[TwizzlerNibs]

I'm a lefty as well and have been trying a few different tactics. I had a few architect nibs ground for pens I was going to buy already at FPnibs. It was chump change compared to all the other services I found and the pens are lovely to write with - If I side write with these pens I get the same look a right handed person using an italic (sort of, it's still in progress)

 

For stub and italic nibs I overwrite and I love the way it looks, but it is opposite as far as line variatiion from a righty, I think. Can you elaborate or maybe show me a picture of how you overwrite?? I find this the easiest way to get the forward slant to my writing that I am trying to develop.

 

I also am learning to underwrite so I can use flex nibs, which I love, but it is very slow going. For this I am trying to steal letter formation from instriuction I found in an old cursive manual I downloaded.

 

I'd love to hear about your process or tell you about mine to see what I could learn.

 

Thanks!

 

josh

 

 

 

 

There are many online resources, for example: https://piecescalligraphy.com/2015/10/04/can-lefties-do-calligraphy/

 

I'm left-handed as well, and I'm an "overwriter", which means that I'm holding the pen upside down compared to how right-handed people do. This means that my downstrokes are equivalent to their upstrokes and vice versa. I can still hold italic and stub nibs in the correct angle, though. But because of the difference in up and down strokes, flexible nibs just do not work for me. However, I would guess that a brush pen might. (But have not tried yet.)

[TwizzlerNibs]

I have been trying to do all this as well. I bought a re-print of one of those lefty books and I will try to find it for you. What I remember from it, and why I don't know exactly where it is, is that it did not provide much help or suggestions that aren't already all over the internet.

 

Learning to underwrite seems to be the best solution for me. I'm not good at visualizing (granted I didn't give it much of a chance) the letters and forms, which is required for the slanting of the paper and writing from a different direction. All the left handed masters I've seen have little variations of a major turning the axis of the paper or writing from different directions.

 

I also ventured into the suggestions of using oblique nibs. I got some custom cut pilot parallel from John Neal Bookseller that I got frustrated with, but am gearing up to give another try. I would suggest going to his website to get a good view of what is available for lefties as far as hardware is concerned. That actually may be where I got my book as well.

 

I love to help, we are only at slightly different parts in our journeys!

 

 

josh

 

 

 

 

For 76 years as a lefty I have been looking not only for shortcuts in the right handed world, but for methods that let me imitate the rest of the world.

 

On my 76th Birthday I decided I would learn (note I do not say TRY to learn) Calligraphy. IN the past three months I have spent more time on the net looking for tools, books and methods on the net than in teal practice, although my day to day handwriting has progressed from 5th Grade delinquent to Sixth Grade needing practice.

 

In a search for literature on the printed page I have only found two offerings that look at least basically beyond "then mirror the right handed movements. Both are by Margaret Shepherd whom I have e mailed with no success in gaining an answer during these holidays.

 

I have found her two titles are both beyond my means in the used market, unless I skip a bunch of meals over a couple of months and use my community food bank to get basics, like pasta.

 

The first book is "The Basics of Left-Handed Calligraphy" Which I have not found for under $80 andsecopnd is "The Left Handed Calligrapher," which seems to be a collections of alphabets adapted for we lefties. It runs over $40 in used condition.

 

HAS ANYONE READ OR USED THESE BOOKS (left handed, but truly sinister or or not in modern parlance) and care to share an opinion on one or both as they might relate to an elderly inexperienced person with a desire to learn and practice, but not go into pain (either physical or emotional) or emotional because "It just don't work that way."

 

I would like to know before I have to go on a severe diet of pasta and beans to get them -- or whether I should continue to muddle through my current no result producing frustrations.

 

Thank you

 

Gregg In Tucson, AZ where ink dries FAST!

 

 

[Chmara]

Dear TwizzlerN -

 

Sound like you and I are coming to similar conclusions in that lefties with similar problems realize that no one set of ideas will work within our parameters and we have to be inventive to make our products look like "the real right handed thing."

 

Flex, for instance, for me takes a lot of thought, letter to letter as my hand wants to make the thick line on the wrong side of the letter and there is a risk of the sharp G nib catching and spraying if the paper is not grade A+ smooth and my hand is light on the pen.

 

I have searched all over for the Shepherd book for left handers and every one I have found under $50 used has been either out of stock -- or paid for by someone else before I can complete writing my credit card number. Maybe if a skip eating every other day I could afford the book after a couple of months -- and lose some of the excess weight I carry.

 

I do think we lefties need a spot to meet on line, cuss and cure our blues whilst sharing tips on how to overcome our anatomical roadblocks. BUT, all lefties, not to discount well meaning righties, face similar problems in the three basic hand positions (underwriter, over or hook writer and side-writer) and specific alphabet styles and specific letter formations. We may never solve them all, but maybe come up with partial solutions in making our product look correct in the eyes of beholders and maybe even buyers.

 

GC

[TwizzlerNibs]

Well said.

 

For me personally I think the underwriting is going to be the road to go down when addressing actual calligraphy. For now I think developing control of my hand in all positions is quite beneficial. I've relegated the calligraphy to just "playing around". Trying to experiment and have fun.

 

My dip pens are shelved for the moment and I'm looking to find discipline in my general cursive penmanship from different angles and seeing what works.Every once in a while I find myself forgetting that I find this fun. Using regular fountain pens facilitates low pressure practice and I can still work on flex and scripts requiring italic nibs.

 

I don't think there is a book out there that has some special trick or solution that isn't already suggested or noted on the internet. This is all just my experience obviously.

 

I'm a long way from anything looking "correct" in anyone's eyes, but due to some success in other areas recently I won't put anything on the impossible list anymore.

 

Here's to lefty longevity.

 

josh

 

 

 

 

 

 

Dear TwizzlerN -

 

Sound like you and I are coming to similar conclusions in that lefties with similar problems realize that no one set of ideas will work within our parameters and we have to be inventive to make our products look like "the real right handed thing."

 

Flex, for instance, for me takes a lot of thought, letter to letter as my hand wants to make the thick line on the wrong side of the letter and there is a risk of the sharp G nib catching and spraying if the paper is not grade A+ smooth and my hand is light on the pen.

 

I have searched all over for the Shepherd book for left handers and every one I have found under $50 used has been either out of stock -- or paid for by someone else before I can complete writing my credit card number. Maybe if a skip eating every other day I could afford the book after a couple of months -- and lose some of the excess weight I carry.

 

I do think we lefties need a spot to meet on line, cuss and cure our blues whilst sharing tips on how to overcome our anatomical roadblocks. BUT, all lefties, not to discount well meaning righties, face similar problems in the three basic hand positions (underwriter, over or hook writer and side-writer) and specific alphabet styles and specific letter formations. We may never solve them all, but maybe come up with partial solutions in making our product look correct in the eyes of beholders and maybe even buyers.

 

GC