Vintage 144: Seeking Advice

[stephanos]

I have some questions that I'm hoping the assembled MB experts can answer. Posing them requires some background information, which I hope will be interesting by itself.

 

Some time ago - about 18 months or so - I walked into a slightly run-down, old-fashioned store in an unnamed German town that sells some books and some stationery, mostly catering for the school market. I asked the owner if he had any fountain pens, and he showed me a small range, most of which was new old stock from the 1990s or earlier.

 

He also had one Montblanc pen - a 144. The cap had a flat top and a wavy clip, and the end of the barrel was rounded. Although the styles don't really match, the cap is a perfect fit. The pen was fitted with a lovely (14K) 3B nib. The owner had no idea of the age, but it looked like it was quite a lot older than the other pens in the shop, and is probably from a personal collection. It was clearly used - the piston mechanism was entirely gummed up and the feed was flithy with dried ink. The owner let me dab some water on the nib and the dried ink allowed me to write a little, which produced a very nice line. Anyway, I asked if he was interested in selling it, at which point he got a crafty look on his face and he said he would send it away to Montblanc for them to repair, as they used to offer a lifelong guarantee. I wished him luck and said that I would pop in at some point to see how he was getting on.

 

Between then and now, I've been back three times, at long intervals. The first two times, he was waiting for MB to get back to him. The last time I went, he had received the pen back from MB: they had apparently wanted nearly 500 Euro to work on the pen, without any guarantee of a successful repair, and he had, unsurprisingly, refused the offer.

 

The owner wants to try to find someone else to work on the pen - the look on his face tells me that he thinks it's worth a great deal of money, perhaps more than anyone is prepared to pay him.

 

I am not a major MB fan, and I'm a user not a collector. But I did really like the nib on that particular pen. So I'm going to return in the second half of 2017, as my travels allow. It may have been repaired by then, but it's just as likely that it will be in the same state as before. As far as I'm concerned, MB's price quote suggests a challenging repair - well beyond my own limited skills - and any repairs would be expensive, perhaps prohibitively so. The nib (and cap) may in the end be the only things salvageable. By now, I'm interested more in the saga than in acquiring the pen.

 

So, here's where my questions come in. Given only the information availabe in this post,

1) Does my understanding of the pen seem sensible?

2) Would you make an offer on the pen in unrepaired state, taking a risk on being able to have it repaired?

3) How much would you be prepared to offer for the pen in unrepaired and repaired state?

4) If I were to buy it and could salvage only the nib, which other models would the nib fit in?

 

I'm really looking to test my understanding, with a view to using any responses as 'ballparks' if I do manage to get back there next year some time.

 

Thanks in advance!

[jar]

Well, it's not a 144. Their caps were not flat. The person I'd suggest you contact is Max Schrage and he will need to see pictures of the pen.

[piscov]

It can be a 234 1/2 cap in a 144 barrel. It will fit perfectly and match your description. To be a 144 the rear round knob should have 144 stamped in it. and to be a 234 1/2 cap Montblanc - Mont( imprint of a mountain)blanc should be imprinted in the cap and the topcap should have the white star.

 

Fixing it it´s relatively easy but the main problem there is that you have mixed parts pen, so market value is heavily reduced and after that MB 500€ quotation for repair the owner thunks he has a treasure there and that is not the case…..

 

You will have to invest in buying a cap and/or a barrel and nib to make all correct and finish 2 pens. a MB 144 and a MB 234 1/2 and have someone servicing the pistons.

 

The most interesting in what your describe if the BBB nib, they do not come up often and are really nice!

As for what pens that nib would fit, it the barrel is indeed a 144 barrel ( I am assuming it´s a 144 nib from the 50´s), it would only be historically correct in a 144, 644 or 744 fountain, but would fit and work in a 134, 234 1/2, 244, 344, or you can have a custom pen be made for it. It all depends on how much you like the nib and how much you are willing to spend….

 

Max at Maxpens.com is a sure bet for MB repairs and he may have the parts your need.

 

Hope to have helped!

Edited December 28, 2016 by piscov

[Chrissy]

I wonder if a Meisterstuck 144 could be purchased and then have the OBBB nib transferred into it? In fact it should also fit into a 145, which is a better pen. I'm confident that either of those could be acquired for less than €500. In fact, both probably could be.

[jar]

I wonder if a Meisterstuck 144 could be purchased and then have the OBBB nib transferred into it? In fact it should also fit into a 145, which is a better pen. I'm confident that either of those could be acquired for less than €500. In fact, both probably could be.

That's very unlikely. The 144s, 234½s and others mentioned were considerably wider than either the modern 144 or 145.

[piscov]

Jar is correct. Here is a picture with a modern 144 nib (145 uses the same nib as does Boheme) a 234 1/2 and a 144. Beside the length, that is much shorter the main problem would be the modern 144 is much less wide than the 50´s #4 size nib like the 144.

 

http://i1330.photobucket.com/albums/w580/Vasco_Correia_Pisco/Forum%20pictures/FPN/8d0dcf15-d516-43ac-82b5-b7b5b3ea2c04_zpsfrceekm8.jpg

 

A 50's 144 would not be a good fit to a modern 144 or 145 pen IMHO...

[Chrissy]

OK. That's a shame

[jmccarty3]

Is the nib a BBB or an OBBB?

 

It would be wonderful to see what an expert restorer like Max or Osman Sümer could do with this pen. Unfortunately, the owner has an unrealistic view of its worth, so it is unlikely that its parts will be reunited with their proper mates and restored to their rightful glory.

[Tom Kellie]

Is the nib a BBB or an OBBB?

 

It would be wonderful to see what an expert restorer like Max or Osman Sümer could do with this pen. Unfortunately, the owner has an unrealistic view of its worth, so it is unlikely that its parts will be reunited with their proper mates and restored to their rightful glory.

 

 

~ That would indeed be a special restoration.

Tom K.

[jsolares]

could be a 134 as well.

 

But the price really depends on what pen it really is, from what i've seen the 13X are more expensive than the 14X.

[CS388]

Is the nib a BBB or an OBBB?

 

Original description has it as BBB. Very nice!

 

But the rest of the description suggests a mis-matched pen/cap situation - which I would only consider if I had the spare cap, or needed the specific barrel etc.

If it was going for a song, sure, I'd get it and fix it up and use it as it is, or keep the bits for parts.

But, it sounds like the owner thinks he has treasure on his hands and may ask the moon. If the repairs are to be farmed out (as suggested), I'd say it was unviable.

 

Nice story, stephanos, thanks.

If I really wanted the nib, I'd probably offer £20 -£30 for it - and walk away when it was refused.

Ymmv.

 

Good luck.

Be interesting to see how the story ends.

[piscov]

could be a 134 as well.

 

But the price really depends on what pen it really is, from what i've seen the 13X are more expensive than the 14X.

 

Yes, you are correct! 134 cap with 144 barrel as barrel is, as per OP, round shape.

 

OBBB my mistake. OP refers clearly a 3B (BBB)

Edited December 28, 2016 by piscov

[Kalessin]

When you next stop by, you can always bring cash in the amount that you feel is the best, highest offer you'd make for the pen (after research like you're doing).

 

Cash (or the equivalent) can be a strong motivational factor. "I'd like to make you an offer for this put-together pen, which will bring only about 225 Euro on Ebay. I'll give you 250 Euro right now, you'll have the money and none of the usual Ebay troubles, and it's unlikely that I'll be able to return anytime in the future."

[stephanos]

Thank you very much to all commenters. I now understand much better what I'm looking at, and where I could look for repairs. I think CS388 has it right, though: I'm probably not going to end up with this pen.

 

JMccarty3, you mentioned Osman Sümer as another possible alternative to Max - is there a website you could point me towards?

 

 

It can be a 234 1/2 cap in a 144 barrel. ...

 

As for what pens that nib would fit, it the barrel is indeed a 144 barrel ( I am assuming it´s a 144 nib from the 50´s), it would only be historically correct in a 144, 644 or 744 fountain, but would fit and work in a 134, 234 1/2, 244, 344, or you can have a custom pen be made for it. It all depends on how much you like the nib and how much you are willing to spend….

 

Max at Maxpens.com is a sure bet for MB repairs and he may have the parts your need.

 

Piscov, I think you nailed it: a 144 barrel with 2341/2 cap seems most likely.

Having said that, it is not impossible that my memory is faulty and it's actually a straight-up 234 1/2 (I remember the barrel having 144 stamped on it, but when I look at the picture of the 2341/2 on the Maxpens site it looks very much like what I remember seeing). In any case, the cap is right, and the nib is single-tone gold (unlike the steel 144 nib pictured on the maxpens site).

I don't think it's a 134: the nib on the maxpens website picture looks different, even through the filth on the nib I saw, and the cap and clip are totally different.

 

Really, the beautiful BBB nib is the reason I'm interested in the pen - it certainly wouldn't bother me to have mismatching parts. So, thank you also for the information on which pens the nib will fit.

 

 

When you next stop by, you can always bring cash in the amount that you feel is the best, highest offer you'd make for the pen (after research like you're doing).

 

I would either have to pay for a repair costing upwards of 125 Euro (as per Max's pricing, in German) or scrap the pen and put the nib onto something I already own. So I'm not sure I'd be willing to offer quite as much as you suggest in your hypothetical scenario, but I get the point, and it's a good idea.

 

Of course, if the owner thinks he has an extra-special piece, he may well be insulted by my offer. But then at least I'll have tried.

 

I would have loved to have taken at least one photo, but that was simply not an option - test-writing with the dried ink was the only thing available to me.

 

I'll update this thread as and when there is any development. But don't hold your breath: I probably won't be back there for nearly half a year.

Edited January 4, 2017 by stephanos

[kawuska]

Wow, the owner was lucky not to have accepted Montblanc repair!He would have an old pen replaced by new parts by now..Could this be a correct model like this on Max's site:

http://www.maxpens.de/bilder/144.htm

[jmccarty3]

JMccarty3, you mentioned Osman Sümer as another possible alternative to Max - is there a website you could point me towards?

 

I am not sure whether Osman has a web site, but you can email him at sumerpens@gmx.de. He is a Montblanc expert and a fine gentleman, who is always willing to help.

 

Does the pen resemble the one on Max's site mentioned in the preceding post? It certainly does look like what you're describing.

[stephanos]

The pen on Max's site that the pen most resembles is the 2341/2. The steel nib on the 144 is not like what I remember seeing.