139 Vs. 149

[Centurion]

I know that the "1" means it's Montblanc best line of FPs, the "9" is their largest nib, and "4" means piston-filled. I believe the Hemingway and the Dumas are 139s but they are piston-filled. So, what's the difference between a 139 vs 149? I desire a big nib FP. Hopefully, Montblanc will create another LE that has a 9 size nib. Any other Montblanc FPs are 139s, besides the Hemingway and the Dumas?

 

Thanks in advance.

[jar]

While the Dumas and Hemingway are similar shape to the 139 they certainly are not 139s. At the time the 149 was introduced both the middle 3 & 4 stood for piston filled although within a decade or so the tradition of the middle position meaning the type of filling system was dropped. When the slim 3 digit Montblancs were introduced they all used the 4 as a middle digit but added a "p" extension to indicate cartridge/converter filled; a 244 would be piston but a 244P would be cartridge/converter.

 

The Hemingway and Dumas echo the basic shape of the 139 but it was made from celluloid and used a two stage piston filling system totally unlike the modern filling system.

[zaddick]

The top of the line meisterstuck series pens started with the 12X series that were button fillers. the pens were mostly hard rubbers, but many had celluloid. They ran through maybe the late 1920s or early 30s. Next came the 13X series and they are piston fillers with 2-stage pistons. They started with celluloid barrels and caps with hard rubber piston cones and cap derbies.They ran through the early 1950s. Their replacement was the 14X series which run through today. The early 1950s 14X series pes were celluloid and had the 2-stage piston fillers with cork or polymer seals. Starting in about the late 1950s or early 1960s the pens switched to resin and essentially the current format. I am simplyfying a lot, but that is the general idea in a nutshell for the top of the line pens.

 

Besides materials, the big differneces in the 13X and 14X pens are the shape and size. The 13X (and 12X) pens are flat tops and smaller than the modern 14X series and their cigar shapes.

 

An excellent condition 139 is in the $3500 plus range, an excellent celluloid 149 (sometimes referred to a silver rings as it had silver thin top and botton cap band rings), is in the $2200 range and a modern, used 149 is around $450 in a box and never used. (prices are approximate and you can pay more or less).

 

As Jar noted the Hemingway and Dumas are just 139 shaped, not really a suitable substitite for a 139. Vintage pens have theor own charm but they are also higher maintenance, can be more fragile, and of course are harder to replace or repair.

 

MB makes plenty of LE pens with the #9 nib. Unfortunatley they start at around $8,000 for offerings like the Blue Hour skeleton or the 90th anniversary skeleton. Their really high end pens can be wll over $100K, but you do get the lare nib and lots of fancy work.

 

While not a #9, of similar size you can get the Heritage 1914. The pen is maybe $3500 or so on the street and it is a marvel of engineering and an impressive size. It is like writing with a small flashlight though which is what has kept me from getting one (so far). If i can find a used one i will probably give in.

 

If you want the MB #9 nib, just start with a used 149 and give it a test run. If you buy smart, you can probably sell it for what you paid. IF you buy lucky, you might be able to make a small profit on a resale.

[jpierson]

The big reason to go 139 or early 149 is in my opinion for the filling system and the nibs. The telescoping piston allows for a large ink capacity. The bounce and flex of the nibs is fantastic! The nib on my pre-war 136 is hands down the best fine nib I have ever used!

Edited July 3, 2016 by jpierson

[Centurion]

Thanks! Great info. What does it mean by a two-stage piston filling system? There's a backup reservoir?

 

I'd love to get one of those vintage 139 or 149, but over a thousand is too much for me. I thought about getting a new platinum 149, but it's over a thousand so I didn't do it. I guess emotionally, a thousand for a FP is my cut-off.

 

I'm going to look again at used 149s, a never used 149 (sort of like new old stock) for $450 sounds good!

Edited July 4, 2016 by Centurion

[jar]

Thanks! Great info. What does it mean by a two-stage piston filling system? There's a backup reservoir?

 

I'd love to get one of those vintage 139 or 149, but over a thousand is too much for me. I thought about getting a new platinum 149, but it's over a thousand so I didn't do it. I guess emotionally, a thousand for a FP is my cut-off.

 

I'm going to look again at used 149s, a never used 149 (sort of like new old stock) for $450 sounds good!

The two stage piston uses a shaft within a second shaft which allows greater piston head travel for a given overall shaft length.

[meiers]

It sounds like the current piston mechanism does not present an improvement over the two-stage piston, perhaps even a downgrade. Am I right?

[Harunie]

It sounds like the current piston mechanism does not present an improvement over the two-stage piston, perhaps even a downgrade. Am I right?

 

I suppose what you classify as improvements and downgrades, from my experience the modern system is supposedly more "durable" and easier to replace as a unit. To service and repair the telescoping unit would take more effort than the current onepiece rendition. However the ink capacity has taken a bit of a dive, where the telescope is guaranteed more ink, but in all reality if you fill and maintain your pen weekly/biweekly it does not make much of a difference unless you are the heaviest of power users around.

[zaddick]

It sounds like the current piston mechanism does not present an improvement over the two-stage piston, perhaps even a downgrade. Am I right?

It is an improvement from the perspective of the accounts at MB.

 

It is cheaper to produce, less complicated, and more prone to failure. However, the older poatons did weigh a bit more and could corrode if ink got behind the cork or piston. It was not a perfect system, but far more elegant in my opinion.

[meiers]

Thanks. I learned something today.

[Opooh]

When used properly and one stays far away from exotic inks, modern 149ers only need a good flush with water. Some of my modern 149ers are + 30 years old and are still in mint condition without any need for servicing in their histtory. As for my silver rings, when they start leaking, you know the cork has to be replaced. Probably that is the explanation of the " precious resin", not all plastics keep in good shape over a period of several decades.