How Fine Is The Waterman Carène Ef?

May 24, 2016

I've recently decided to upgrade my fountain pen collection to more investment pens, now that I've experimented enough to know exactly what I like: a crisp Japanese (~0.2-0.3mm) fine, relatively stiff.

How is the Carène's EF by comparison? A little bit wider? A lot wider? Would grinding it to the desired width be a good idea?

May 24, 2016

I don't know how you are measuring the nib, but I measured the tips of several Pilot XF nibs at about 0.4mm (0.014-0.017 inch with a dial caliper) which is larger than your F measurements. The Pilot F nibs come in about 0.5-0.6mm.

My Waterman F nibs (0.8mm) measure similar to my Pilot M nibs (0.75mm). So I would guess that you want a Waterman EF for your Carene.

Edited May 24, 2016 by ac12

May 24, 2016

I am going by nibs.com's tipping measurements---I don't have the means to measure them myself---but I do know I like Pilot and Sailor's F nibs, and that's roughly the mark at which I'm shooting.

I was planning on acquiring the Carene in an XF in any case, but do you think I would have to have it reground to match that criteria? I don't have the option of trying it out first, mainly because international shipping back and forth would get costly. Also, I've noticed that the horizontal strokes on a Waterman XF (though this was on a Hemisphere) are slightly wider than the vertical ones: is that normal?

Edited May 24, 2016 by ella343

May 24, 2016

I am going by nibs.com's tipping measurements---I don't have the means to measure them myself---but I do know I like Pilot and Sailor's F nibs, and that's roughly the mark at which I'm shooting.

I was planning on acquiring the Carene in an XF in any case, but do you think I would have to have it reground to match that criteria? I don't have the option of trying it out first, mainly because international shipping back and forth would get costly. Also, I've noticed that the horizontal strokes on a Waterman XF (though this was on a Hemisphere) are slightly wider than the vertical ones: is that normal?

I don't know specifically how they are measuring the tip. Because what I do is quite similar. Except that I use a dial caliper rather than a micrometer.

What is not able to be measured is the effect of the tip profile/shape. With a round/ball tipping and a dry pen, the ink line would be the same size or narrower than the tipping, because of the small contact area. This is vs. a flattened tip which has a larger contact area.

I do not have a Waterman XF, but as I mentioned I think it will be close to a Pilot F.

The line variation you see is likely from manufacturing variation of the tipping.

If you buy the pen from nibs.com, you can specify that it be ground to match a Japanese F. Then specify which company, as the chart shows Pilot and Sailor are similar, but Platinum is different.

May 24, 2016

I bought a Carene extra fine nib from nibs.com. The line is thin enough for me, and it is about like a Pilot fine. I thought all the Carene nibs I have are a bit broader than American nibs, from broad (L), medium, fine and extra fine. At $129.00 when I bought my EF from nibs.com, it's a little steep if you add nib grinding costs. Frankly, the extra fine is the only Carene I use, the other three sitting in a pen box.