Identification Help On A Beautiful Vintage No Name Pen With Georg Peter Rupp Nib

[BJORNBERG]

I found this brown/gold striped pen with a uniqe ink window (to me) just a week ago on a online auction. My bid was based on that I thought it might be a Osmia pen. It's a beauty in my eyes but I haven't found any trace of imprint on barrel, clip, cap or blind cap. The pen is equipted with a 14 k nib and a lion head. From what I have found on this fantastic forum is that it could been made by Georg Peter Rupp, Heidelberg-Germany.

 

Nib

14K - 585

Lionhead (logo)

Triangle pointing left 58 (in a circle) Triangle pointing right

 

Im adding a few photos and hope for some help to identify this NoName pen, by ink window, clip, cap, blind cap or nib.

 

Best Regards Joakim

Edited March 12, 2016 by BJORNBERG

[BJORNBERG]

Update

Got good clues and good information about the pen in a Swedish forum.

 

Maker: Perfecto II Lyx
Year: 1954-1959
Material: Celluloid
Filling system: Piston-filler
Nib: 14K – 585

 

Perfecto II Lyx (lyx is the Swedish word for luxury) and was made in Germany for export to the market in Sweden only, in the later part of 1950´s. This Perfecto II Lyx is a superb example of the high quality pens made in Germany by Perfecto with its beautiful spiral ink window.
Equipped with a 14-carat nib by Rupp. Georg Peter Rupp was a nib maker in Heidelberg from 1920's to 1970.

 

I hope this information can be helpful to others in the future who succeed in finding one of these beautiful pens.

 

\\ Joakim

[Bo Bo Olson]

I have a Rupp nib from a cheap pen...the closer one looked at it the cheaper it is. It is the most flexible of my maxi-semi-flex nibs .... of which I have some 14.

Mine was a screw out nib, and it screwed into a prettier pen.

 

I don't budget well, buying swords, ink, inkwells does cut into the pen buying. I saw a couple of real nice looking 'no name' pens with Rupp nibs that someone else won over the years.

Rupp nibs are not as available as I'd like.

 

Yours is a pretty pen.

Edited March 15, 2016 by Bo Bo Olson

[Dickkooty2]

I have this pen as well. Thank you for the posting and for the information that it has generated!

 

I bought it because of the wonderful full tortoise. The pen has three rings, two thin plain gold

above and below a third wide etched ring with a continuous pattern. Quite handsome. The nib is 585/14k.

The logo on the nib is a diamond with a circle inside. The circle is evenly divided by a line vertically. On the left side of the line coming out of the circle are rays. The right side is simply the semi-circle with no rays.The nib seems to be an F with a pretty good

flex.

 

http://i271.photobucket.com/albums/jj157/dick168/Scan_zpshglnvcuq.jpeg

 

I know this photo is of little help. I will also clean out the barrel to see what the ink level viewer looks like.

 

Later - done. It has the diagonal repeat stripes as shown in your photos.

 

All-in-all, I am very satisfied with my now-named pen. It is not going to be on any collectors bucket list, but the aesthetics are there that are what I look for.

 

Any thoughts on the nib?

[Azuniga]

Mine is very similar, besides the clip and details ... It has an imprint on the cap Perfecto II Lyx, with a Perfecto 14 K – 585 nib... it could complete the information.

 

[Dickkooty2]

I have this pen as well. Thank you for the posting and for the information that it has generated!

 

I bought it because of the wonderful full tortoise. The pen has three rings, two thin plain gold

above and below a third wide etched ring with a continuous pattern. Quite handsome. The nib is 585/14k.

The logo on the nib is a diamond with a circle inside. The circle is evenly divided by a line vertically. On the left side of the line coming out of the circle are rays. The right side is simply the semi-circle with no rays.The nib seems to be an F with a pretty good

flex.

 

http://i271.photobucket.com/albums/jj157/dick168/Scan_zpshglnvcuq.jpeg

 

I know this photo is of little help. I will also clean out the barrel to see what the ink level viewer looks like.

 

Later - done. It has the diagonal repeat stripes as shown in your photos.

 

All-in-all, I am very satisfied with my now-named pen. It is not going to be on any collectors bucket list, but the aesthetics are there that are what I look for.

 

Any thoughts on the nib?

Here we go ... this just in!

 

I looked a lot harder at my pen and found the following:

 

• On the cap ... 'Made in Germany' and 'General de Lusse'

• On the barrel ... a five-pointed star in a circle.

 

What does this mean? Some wild-ass conjecture:

 

'Lusse' means 'saffron' in Swedish. Perhaps the color of the ink indicator applies? It is pretty close but a little darker.

http://i271.photobucket.com/albums/jj157/dick168/Screen%20Shot%202016-03-15%20at%204.29.11%20PM_zps1hviybww.png

 

... almost the color of the delicious Swedish pastry that is a feature of St Lucie's Day - December 13.

http://i271.photobucket.com/albums/jj157/dick168/st_luc-ffron_buns_horizontal_zpsamvvkpm1.jpg

 

They are called 'Lussebuhler'

 

And now the really wild-ass part -

 

December 13 is Lusse's Night. Lusse is a female counterpart of Swart Piet. If you are bad,down she comes through the chimney and takes you off to someplace that is not so nice (Swart Piet puts you in a sack and takes you away to Spain).

 

December 13 under the old calendar was the longest night of the year and the shortest day of the year, the day light started to return ... saffron yellow light.

 

Now I haven't a clue as to what this means in terms of a name on a pen.

 

Do any readers know or can make an informed guess?

 

Play Helan Gar with a shot of akvavit to get you into the mood:

[grainweevil]

The logo on the nib is a diamond with a circle inside. The circle is evenly divided by a line vertically. On the left side of the line coming out of the circle are rays. The right side is simply the semi-circle with no rays.

 

Any thoughts on the nib?

 

Sounds like the Degussa logo to me.

[BJORNBERG]

Bo Bo Olson, on 15 Mar 2016 - 16:14, said:

I have a Rupp nib from a cheap pen...the closer one looked at it the cheaper it is. It is the most flexible of my maxi-semi-flex nibs .... of which I have some 14.

Mine was a screw out nib, and it screwed into a prettier pen.

 

I don't budget well, buying swords, ink, inkwells does cut into the pen buying. I saw a couple of real nice looking 'no name' pens with Rupp nibs that someone else won over the years.

Rupp nibs are not as available as I'd like.

 

Yours is a pretty pen.

This is my first Rupp nib and I pleased with it. Regarding 'flex' it's a bit confusing with the terms. My daily 'workhorses' a Osmia 883 F and Osmia Progress 963 M are both equiped with a Osmia Supra 14k nibs and those I categorized as flexible. It seem that I have to study a little more about the definition concering flex .

[BJORNBERG]

Mine is very similar, besides the clip and details ... It has an imprint on the cap Perfecto II Lyx, with a Perfecto 14 K – 585 nib... it could complete the information.

 

Wow, beautiful pen and I see there are some difference between yours and mine.

[BJORNBERG]

 

Sounds like the Degussa logo to me.

My first thought was that it was Osmia, but the logo of osmia opposite a circle with the diamond inside

[Dickkooty2]

Sounds like the Degussa logo to me.

Thanks! I've followed up and read some background on this interesting company. I am happy to have their nib in this pen. I also see I have it in a few other vintage German pens.

[Azuniga]

I used the image I had at hand, here are the details... (spots in the nib are because it is being used)

 

Now, in relation to 'General de Lusse' inscription I wonder if the last letter is an 'e'. It could be an 'o' in which case it will go towards Italy, General de Luxe, (Lusso in italian) as Lyx in Swedish... let's do not forget that many German manufacturers used to put their imprints in the language of the country they were going to export them...

 

Last but not least, your description of the nib imprint corresponds to Degussa...

 

 

 

Hope this helps....

 

It already helped me with the information concerning Sweden... 'Lussebuhler' look delicious !

Edited March 16, 2016 by Azuniga

[Dickkooty2]

Just for some sake of completion, this is the pen I have. I hope it is what the rest of the gang have!

 

http://i271.photobucket.com/albums/jj157/dick168/P1030802_zpsyefwyufu.jpg

[Bo Bo Olson]

Azuma, yes it is a Degussa nib. More on that later in this post.

 

I do not rate the Osmia Supra nib as flexible.

I rate the Osmia Supra as maxi-semi-flex, the Osmia with a diamond as semi-flex.

 

If you have a 'true' regular flex; semi-vintage 80's-90's, or a vintage one, you can mash the nib to a 3 X to a light down stroke. Semi-flex takes half of that pressure to get to 3 X, maxi-semi-flex 1/2 of that or 1/4th the pressure needed to mash a 'true' regular flex. These three are all in the same flex set of 3X tine spread only.

Do Not try to spread the tines of a Supra more than 3 X or you risk springing the nib.

 

Superflex less pressure than that....Easy Full Flex 1/8th and a Wet Noodle 1/16th, with 4-5-6 or in rare cases 7 X tine spread.

 

A vast majority of my 32-35 semi-flex nibs are clumped together in the middle of semi-flex variation.

 

I have now some 15 maxi-semi-flex. In maxi-semi-flex, there is variation of flex with in the set, like superflex has also. That Rupp nib of mine is noticeably the most flexible of my maxi-semi-flex nibs. (That don't mean yours is going to be...sadly; but I can hope.)

 

Back when I had 5 maxi-semi-flex nibs, I got a bit OCD/AR and tried to develop a system of flex. It didn't work, in it was too much work, one needed a lot of pens, in maxi-semi-flex, Superflex: Easy Full Flex and Wet Noodles.

At the time I only had two Easy Full Flex superflex nibs, and one Wet Noodle out side of Dip Pens.

 

F-1 would have been the maxi-semi-flex, F-2 the Easy Full Flex, and F-3 the Wet Noodles, F-4 the Weak Kneeded Wet Noodles, a term invented by John Swobada/Oxnard the nib grinder. It was also much too subjunctive.

(I am not going to get now into tine spread on my electronic kitchen scale...others have said that too will end up subjective...too much trouble for me.) I went from a bit AR to close enough for hand grenades.

 

Of my five maxi-semi-flex, 2 were F-1, 2 were F- 1 1/4th and the Rupp nib was F-1 1/2. The Rupp nib was not superflex, it only spreads it's tines 3 X and the difference between a F-1 1/2 and a F-2 Easy Full flex was noticeable.

 

It did teach me there were flex variations with in different sets of nibs, in maxi-semi-flex and in the Superflex nib sets.

 

That Rupp nib is real good one, with a bit more flex than the others of the maxi-semi-flex set. I gave up the F-1, 1/4th, 1/2 BS with 5 pens. I now have 15 and never tired to rate exactly the other 10 in a system. The Rupp is still the most flexible of my maxi-semi-flex nib set, but I have no idea which would be second. It is not worth the trouble to rate them, out side they are maxi-semi-flex.

 

My systems of half's works as a guide; but is 'best' for those new to the more flexible nibs starting into nibs with some flex like a semi-flex or more flexible nibs. I do see my 'rough' guide as easy to use, or I'd not bring it up all the time.

 

I remember reading about semi-flex, then at a flea market, I put a Pelikan 140 to my thumb nail; knowing it was one of those fabled semi-flex nibs. I suddenly knew what all the fuss was all about.

 

I was still rather new and ignorant, when I ran into that Rupp nib, I wandered around for three days, wow, that certainly is a maxi-semi-flex nib. :eureka:

Then I realized it was one of those flexible nibs folks talked about that was not a superflex. For a long time after I use to refer to them as 'flexi'/maxi-semi-flex, before I cleaned up the definition. I can easily see someone describing it as a flexible nib, in it is, with in the three X tine spread set.

 

I had at that time an Osmia pen with a Supra nib, but had not caught on how much flex it had; thinking it just one of those 'wet' writers lots of folks admired. (Of course it was a wet writer, there was all that flex I hadn't caught because I was 'noobie") It actually was too much a 'wet writer' so I didn't use it...not even knowing then what semi-flex was, much less maxi-semi-flex. I didn't use it much, in it was too wet a writer. So actually my Pelikan 140 was not the first 'semi-flex I had...it was though the first one I knew of. Sitting in the box because it was too wet a writer delayed my 'discovery' I had such a good nib.

Real shortly after I got the Rupp nib, I found out I had had a maxi-semi-flex nib from the get go. The Osmia pen had been one of the inherited pens that started me into fountain pens, in I had only my bought new 1970/71 P-75. It was being held prisoner in my wife's jewelry box.

 

 

(Osmia due to lack of money, sold their nib factory to Degussa in 1932...was important to know Osmia bought an Osmium tipping patent from the Heidelberg professor in 1922, there for the name, Osmia. It was in it's time the best tipping to be had......(Kaweco had the best nibs up to 1930. Soennecken, MB, Osmia second class nibs in comparison; outside Osmia's tipping.)

 

Osmia unlike Soennecken, MB, Pelikan, the later Geha and perhaps Kaweco, did not have a office supply business supporting the pen business so were always broke.

1928/9 Osmia sold it's factory to Parker 1929/30 Parker sold it back, in Parker's Duofold was way too expensive in Germany and the Germans were making cheaper clones and the Depression started.

.Faber-Castell started buying into Osmia in 1936. 1938 the two Bohler brothers split up the firm. It is said the War saved Osmia for a few years. Depending on who you read, Faber Castell had majority ownership in 1946; others say Faber Castell finished buying up Osmia in 1950.

Faber Castell with a pencil empire behind them made only second class pens and needed a first class pen. Shortly afterwards the fools started erasing Osmia from the first class pens. By the late '50's they had only a diamond on the nib. Then even that went.

O-F-C pens, the less Osmia on it the newer it is.

Osmia it's self had three or four different clips, two generic, one with Osmia on it, one similar with out. It had three cap jewels that I know of, one with the Osmia diamond and the others with out. O-F-C went rapidly away from the Osmia Diamond on the cap jewel, the clip and so on.

 

The Osmia Supra is easy to rate, it is maxi-semi-flex, just like the Osmia nib with the diamond is semi-flex. I know of no other pen that is so easy to rate.

Edited March 17, 2016 by Bo Bo Olson

[Kaweco]

"Supra" is a Parker/Osmia term of the filling machinery, not the nib quality.

Kind Regards

Thomas

[Bo Bo Olson]

It may well be Thomas, that "Supra" is a Parker/Osmia term of the filling machinery, not the nib quality.

Supra was the name of the deluxe Osmia's in the '30's also. As you also stated somewhere else and or told me at a flea market, I believe.

 

I only have 8-9 Osmia's half and half, and all my Supra nibs are maxi-semi-flex, my nibs with the diamond, are semi-flex. That is something I count on.

And I find the steel Osmia nibs to be = to the gold ones. Both are grand nibs. I was a bit ignorant of that, and missed a number of good Osmia steel nibbed pens, in I was 'noobie' and thought only gold was good.

The always broke Osmia sold their nib factory to Degussa in @1932, and Degussa continued to make the Osmia nibs for Osmia. Like Bock (started @ 1938), Deggussa made nibs for anyone, to their specs if they wished. So Rupp, & Degussa, were very good nib makers. Both Rupp and Degussa stopped making nibs @ 1970.

[Bo Bo Olson]

Thomas is a true scholar of German fountain pens. I have spoken with him five-six times at a local flea market, for about an hour at a time. I have learned so much from him. How good the old '50s and before Reform pens were, the pre '30 Kawaco and much much more.

 

One of my grail pens is a '30 an Osmia Supra Deluxe; a pen designed to elbow the big boys , Soennecken, MB and Kaweco out of the way.