Newbie Dip Pen Nib Question

[metroplexchl]

Hey there,

 

I'm new to writing with fountain and dip pens, as well as this forum. Fountain pens, I've found, are pretty simple. I assume dip pens are too once I learn a few things. :-)

 

My sister gave me an E+M nib holder, but I have no idea what nibs to buy. I'm not an artist or calligrapher. I just love writing letters to my friends and family.

 

What nibs should I get for this purpose? I'm unsure if all nibs are interchangable and which nibs are for simple writing (vs. calligraphy). For some reason, the E+M nib holder didn't come with any instructions.

 

Any help would be appreciated!

 

Thanks,

 

Chris Mccollum

 

[ac12]

CRUM, FPN lost my post...again.

Let's try it again.

 

I recommend that you start off with a bowl/spoon and/or stub nib. That will more closely match your fountain pen experience.

• bowls
  • Esterbrook/Penseco 501
  • Eagle E830
  • Tachikawa Comic-Pen-Nib-Spoon
    • http://www.jetpens.com/Tachikawa-Comic-Pen-Nib-Spoon-Model-Chrome-Plated-Pack-of-3/pd/9445
• stub
  • Esterbrook 48, Falcon
  • Esterbrook 442, Jackson Stub

 

Note that of the above nibs, only the Tachikawa nibs are current production, the others are vintage nibs that you have to search for.

 

Then you can progress to the pointed nibs, or jump right in to the pointed nibs.

The easiest pointed nib to start with is the G nibs, from Nikko, Zebra or Tachikawa

http://www.jetpens.com/Nikko-Comic-Pen-Nib-G-Model-Pack-of-3/pd/12006

I use the G nibs to write my pen pal letters.

 

WARNING. Some of the pointed nibs are so sharp that you MUST write with a very light hand or the nib will snag and scratch the paper, making for a rather unpleasant writing experience. So you have to be careful what pointed nib you buy.

 

Here are a few nib sites.

http://www.paperinkarts.com/calligraphy-pens-nibs.html

http://www.johnnealbooks.com/prod_detail_list/6

http://www.jetpens.com/Comic-Manga-Pens/ct/845?f=c65203f1c649f01078481fe989db96c2de7f7af14a7e2b9d193a30f93cd48f7a

 

As for ink, I suggest Higgins Eternal.

 

And you MUST prepare the nib, to clean off manufacturing oils, or the ink will not stick to the nib.

I use rubbing alcohol, others scrub with toothpaste or heat with a match for 4 seconds.

[aalmcc4]

ac12 gives excellent advice all the way around. Good general writing nibs (vintage) are usually identified as 'school' nibs such as the Esterbrook 556. They are also generally the cheapest as there are better examples for Spencerian and other calligraphy type writing that command higher prices. Writing with a dip pen requires a very light touch. Barely grazing the paper. Get a good vintage self closing inkwell for yourself too. Like a Sengbusch which can be snagged for $20-$30 on eBay. They're my favorites.

[Cryptos]

Hmmm, just to add a correction to ac12's otherwise excellent advice, the Esterbrook Falcon 48 is not a stub.

[metroplexchl]

CRUM, FPN lost my post...again.

Let's try it again.

 

I recommend that you start off with a bowl/spoon and/or stub nib. That will more closely match your fountain pen experience.

• bowls
  • Esterbrook/Penseco 501
  • Eagle E830
  • Tachikawa Comic-Pen-Nib-Spoon
    • http://www.jetpens.com/Tachikawa-Comic-Pen-Nib-Spoon-Model-Chrome-Plated-Pack-of-3/pd/9445
• stub
  • Esterbrook 48, Falcon
  • Esterbrook 442, Jackson Stub

 

Note that of the above nibs, only the Tachikawa nibs are current production, the others are vintage nibs that you have to search for.

 

Then you can progress to the pointed nibs, or jump right in to the pointed nibs.

The easiest pointed nib to start with is the G nibs, from Nikko, Zebra or Tachikawa

http://www.jetpens.com/Nikko-Comic-Pen-Nib-G-Model-Pack-of-3/pd/12006

I use the G nibs to write my pen pal letters.

 

WARNING. Some of the pointed nibs are so sharp that you MUST write with a very light hand or the nib will snag and scratch the paper, making for a rather unpleasant writing experience. So you have to be careful what pointed nib you buy.

 

Here are a few nib sites.

http://www.paperinkarts.com/calligraphy-pens-nibs.html

http://www.johnnealbooks.com/prod_detail_list/6

http://www.jetpens.com/Comic-Manga-Pens/ct/845?f=c65203f1c649f01078481fe989db96c2de7f7af14a7e2b9d193a30f93cd48f7a

 

As for ink, I suggest Higgins Eternal.

 

And you MUST prepare the nib, to clean off manufacturing oils, or the ink will not stick to the nib.

I use rubbing alcohol, others scrub with toothpaste or heat with a match for 4 seconds.

Wow. That's a lot of great information. I will be mulling over it for the next few days and then dive in!

 

chris

[metroplexchl]

ac12 gives excellent advice all the way around. Good general writing nibs (vintage) are usually identified as 'school' nibs such as the Esterbrook 556. They are also generally the cheapest as there are better examples for Spencerian and other calligraphy type writing that command higher prices. Writing with a dip pen requires a very light touch. Barely grazing the paper. Get a good vintage self closing inkwell for yourself too. Like a Sengbusch which can be snagged for $20-$30 on eBay. They're my favorites.

 

I've never even heard of a self closing ink well. I'll look into that for sure. I've never written with what I would consider a heavy hand because when I do, it tires my hand out quickly. But are you saying it's painting with a very light paint brush or something? will it break the nib or something?

 

edited: just watched a youtube video of an amazing self closing ink well -

Edited September 16, 2015 by metroplexchl

[metroplexchl]

It's a blast seeing all the amazing nibs. But it's also a bit mind numbing. Are the sizes standardized so that they'll fit any holder?

Edited September 16, 2015 by metroplexchl

[ac12]

 

It's a blast seeing all the amazing nibs. But it's also a bit mind numbing. Are the sizes standardized so that they'll fit any holder?

 

NO

There are several different sizes of nibs.

 

From John Neil, for an oblique holder shows 4 different nib sizes.
H115 sizes and the nibs they accommodate:
66EF: N70-Brause 66EF, N73-Gillott 290, N76-Gillott 1068A, N97-Hunt 512.
NIKKO: N113-Nikko G, N118-Zebra, N81-Hiro #40, N90-Brause Steno, N69-Brause Rose, N74-Gillott 404, N98-Hunt 513EF, N137-Tachikawa G
PRIN: N120-Principal EF, N77-Hunt 101, N82-Hiro Crown, N86-Hunt 56, N88-Hunt 99, N93-Hunt 22, N102-Gillott 1950
303: N72-Gillott 303, N108-Brause 511, N126-Brause 515, N83-Hiro 700, N99-Brause 513

 

And there are more sizes of nibs than those 4.

Though I doubt you will use a tiny mapping nib or crow's quill nib.

 

However, some of the clutches on straight holders are able to accommodate different size nibs. I cannot say if yours will or not, as I cannot find a pix of the clutch of your pen.

 

You will find out just how light your hand is when you use a pointed nib. If the nib starts snagging and scratching on the paper, you need to lighten up.

But you also need to use smooth paper. If you use textured paper, you WILL snag and scratch, as the tip goes into the depressions on the paper surface.

[metroplexchl]

This is the nib holder I was given. Would it hold any kind of nib?

 

http://www.amazon.com/dp/B00N9BJMYW/ref=wl_it_dp_o_pC_S_ttl?_encoding=UTF8&colid=2FDEOTCUPW3IW&coliid=I3LC7DW7GC5X3K

[metroplexchl]

 

 

NO

There are several different sizes of nibs.

 

From John Neil, for an oblique holder shows 4 different nib sizes.

H115 sizes and the nibs they accommodate:

66EF: N70-Brause 66EF, N73-Gillott 290, N76-Gillott 1068A, N97-Hunt 512.

NIKKO: N113-Nikko G, N118-Zebra, N81-Hiro #40, N90-Brause Steno, N69-Brause Rose, N74-Gillott 404, N98-Hunt 513EF, N137-Tachikawa G

PRIN: N120-Principal EF, N77-Hunt 101, N82-Hiro Crown, N86-Hunt 56, N88-Hunt 99, N93-Hunt 22, N102-Gillott 1950

303: N72-Gillott 303, N108-Brause 511, N126-Brause 515, N83-Hiro 700, N99-Brause 513

 

And there are more sizes of nibs than those 4.

Though I doubt you will use a tiny mapping nib or crow's quill nib.

 

However, some of the clutches on straight holders are able to accommodate different size nibs. I cannot say if yours will or not, as I cannot find a pix of the clutch of your pen.

 

You will find out just how light your hand is when you use a pointed nib. If the nib starts snagging and scratching on the paper, you need to lighten up.

But you also need to use smooth paper. If you use textured paper, you WILL snag and scratch, as the tip goes into the depressions on the paper surface.

Wow. This is a whole new and wonderful world. :-) Very interesting

[Sandy1]

 

Hi,

 

In addition to the excellent suggestions above, kindly consider the Brause Ornament nibs, which have removable over/under reservoirs and a smooth 'ball' tip. When paired with an FP ink one can write quite a bit with one 'dip' and have the ink appear of uniform Value (light - dark), and the width of the written line will remain uniform.

 

I use one such nib for sampling inky blends. They also come in handy when I have just a page or two to write, and choose not to use an FP (especially when using inks that are tedious to clean-up.)

 

Bye,

S1

 

__ __

Brause Ornament written sample:

http://i783.photobucket.com/albums/yy116/Sandy1-1/FPN_2012/Mix%20Noodlers%20Lexington%20Gray%20Galileo%20Manuscript/INK776_zpsa5c68e2a.jpg

[metroplexchl]

Thank you all for all your help! I think I've got plenty to get started. Feel free to keep offering advice. I'll be checking back here frequently as part of my research. I'll let you know how it goes!

 

Chris

[ac12]

 

This is the nib holder I was given. Would it hold any kind of nib?

 

http://www.amazon.com/dp/B00N9BJMYW/ref=wl_it_dp_o_pC_S_ttl?_encoding=UTF8&colid=2FDEOTCUPW3IW&coliid=I3LC7DW7GC5X3K

 

The problem is I need a head on shot of the end of the pen where the clutch is, so I can see the details of the clutch.

The clutch is where you slide the nib into.

[ac12]

Go to the Pen and Ink Art and John Neil sites and look for "oblique holder"

That I what I use to do 99% of my writing. And my writing is just letter writing, not calligraphy.

 

What the oblique holder does is to align the nib in line with the downstroke of the letter.

A straight holder, the way many people hold it, will result in a diagonal downstroke. This sometimes spatters ink. This is because the nib is at about 45 degrees from being in-line with the downstroke.

Once I saw the difference, I basically retired my straight holders, and only use them for nibs that won't fit my oblique holders.

 

Welcome to another new world of writing.

[Cryptos]

The right handed oblique holder is better for right-slanted script only, as far as my own experience has shown. For italic writing I find a straight holder to be preferable.

[metroplexchl]

 

 

The problem is I need a head on shot of the end of the pen where the clutch is, so I can see the details of the clutch.

The clutch is where you slide the nib into.

I found this really great article on the Jetpens.com site that had a nib + holder compatability chart. It was awesome. They said, "E+M nibs will only fit in E+M nib holders, but E+M holders can accommodate most nibs from other brands."....not sure how that works but that's what they said.....

http://www.jetpens.com/blog/guide-to-nibs-and-nib-holders/pt/763

[ac12]

 

I found this really great article on the Jetpens.com site that had a nib + holder compatability chart. It was awesome. They said, "E+M nibs will only fit in E+M nib holders, but E+M holders can accommodate most nibs from other brands."....not sure how that works but that's what they said.....

http://www.jetpens.com/blog/guide-to-nibs-and-nib-holders/pt/763

 

It has to do with the design of the clutch.

One clutch that I like, has 4 spring "fingers" which hold the nib against the outside of the clutch. This type of clutch is pretty adaptable and will handle different size nibs, as long as they fit into the clutch.

 

The speedball holder however has a grove cut into hard plastic. In this case, the curve of the nib MUST match the curve of the grove, or it won't fit.

[httpmom]

The right handed oblique holder is better for right-slanted script only, as far as my own experience has shown. For italic writing I find a straight holder to be preferable.

+1

Yes, I agree with this hold heartedly! The oblique holders are GREAT for pointed pen alphabets, Spencerian, Coppetplate, etc, while the straight holders are perfect for Italic and non-slanted fonts.

[httpmom]

I found this really great article on the Jetpens.com site that had a nib + holder compatability chart. It was awesome. They said, "E+M nibs will only fit in E+M nib holders, but E+M holders can accommodate most nibs from other brands."....not sure how that works but that's what they said.....

http://www.jetpens.com/blog/guide-to-nibs-and-nib-holders/pt/763

 

Thanks for sharing this. It's a terrific article!

[AAAndrew]

I have several of the E+M holders and they hold pretty much every nib I have except for the tiny ones.

 

ac12 gives some good recommendations, and Empty is right, the 048 is not a stub. (don't you love it when geeks get pedantic? )

 

I do more "normal" writing than calligraphy with my pens and I really like what are sometimes referred to as the "semi-flex", but others like the stiff nibs that are more of a monoline nib (think flex vs stiff fountain pens).

 

The world of vintage nibs is wide and confusing. But fortunately for you, the less flexible ones are definitely cheaper and they made millions and millions of them every year for over a hundred years.

 

For stubs, the Esterbrook Relief and Chancellor nibs are nice and smooth, and the Spencerian Congressional also has a little flex to it's small stub. The Esterbrook 442 Jackson Stub was one of their biggest selling pens and considered one of their "flagship" nibs.

 

The Esterbrook 444 and other School pens are good writers. They were designed for students and so are pretty durable and easy to write with. As you move up in school you get more flexible, so the Esterbrook 105 College is a wonderful flexible nib, and the 453 Business and College is one of my favorite flex writers for everyday writing. There are so many.

 

A fantastic resource for the Esterbrook pens is The Esterbrook Project. http://theesterbrookproject.com/

You can also check out Pendemonium's list of vintage dip pen nibs for sale. Great people to work with. They will often put together samplers of nibs as well. http://www.pendemonium.com/dippennibs.htm

And for some of the more obscure (at least this side of the Atlantic) nibs, the Calligraphy Shop out of Germany has a huge assortment of vintage nibs. http://www.kallipos.de/gb-calligraphy-shop.html

 

And if you can look past my poor writing, here are what some of the nibs I have at hand look like in a quick comparison. The differences are sometimes subtle and can vary more in the experience of writing, and, of course, with different ink and paper. (I'm using walnut ink on Southworth 25% cotton laser and ink jet paper)