Smythson Vs. Crane & Co. For Personalized Stationery

[john74]

After reading this thread, I ordered some Crane Co. paper (Ref# CH3216). It is beautiful sturdy paper, and I was able to fake-emboss my crest on it with surprisingly nice results. But I am not crazy about the paper's texture when I write on it (feels like sandpaper and when observed with a loupe it looks like sandpaper too)... And unless I use a very wet pen/ink combo, the edges of my lines look pretty ragged.

[Blade Runner]

After reading this thread, I ordered some Crane Co. paper (Ref# CH3216). It is beautiful sturdy paper, and I was able to fake-emboss my crest on it with surprisingly nice results. But I am not crazy about the paper's texture when I write on it (feels like sandpaper and when observed with a loupe it looks like sandpaper too)... And unless I use a very wet pen/ink combo, the edges of my lines look pretty ragged.

That doesn't sound like the right pen/paper combination for you. I'd change one or the other. My pens write beautifully on Crane's. I wouldn't buy a pen that doesn't. But as previously mentioned, if a nib has any issues or if flow is weak, you will have trouble on Crane's and other 100% cotton papers. So I'd say high cotton content papers can be demanding, but after attaining pens that write beautifully on them, I find them so much more pleasurable to use and receive than most wood pulp papers.

Edited April 17, 2015 by Blade Runner

[Barkingpig]

Thanks for mentioning europeanpapers.com. Looks like a fine source.

Let us know how you like your new paper.

I found the same paper @ Amazon & maybe someplace else BUT the European Papers sold me with their "in stock," notification today that it had indeed already shipped & the very reasonable ($4.95) shipping fee. If I indeed like it they offer it in larger quantities & other varieties. All in all they seemed like a good source for paper. I am excited to find a new paper with source for same being almost more important than the "existence" of the paper. The Secolo XIII paper sounds great but if I can't find it's source it remains only a "Grail."

[Maurizio]

After reading this thread, I ordered some Crane Co. paper (Ref# CH3216). It is beautiful sturdy paper, and I was able to fake-emboss my crest on it with surprisingly nice results. But I am not crazy about the paper's texture when I write on it (feels like sandpaper and when observed with a loupe it looks like sandpaper too)... And unless I use a very wet pen/ink combo, the edges of my lines look pretty ragged.

 

Like I said, I don't think the paper is fountain pen friendly.

[Blade Runner]

A sample written on Crane's 32lb Monarch, 100% cotton, kid finish. The pens are a variety of Meisterstucks with mostly fine and medium nibs and a broad nib. The inks are mostly MB.

 

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v233/jelb/Writing%20Samples/nibwidth2-1.jpg

Edited April 18, 2015 by Blade Runner

[Maurizio]

I will gladly concede that with very wet inks & nibs, Crane's paper will work. Clearly it does for Blade Runner. I believe however, for "average" nibs, the paper is not fountain pen friendly. We can argue about what an "average" wetness nib is, There's nothing I'd like better than to say Crane's paper is great for fountain pens. It has a very pleasant heavy "hand", it's American made, and has historical roots. But it simply does not have a smooth, fountain pen friendly surface as many other papers discussed in this forum do. If we can take Rhodia as a standard, it is far below that standard in surface smoothness.

 

I have attached an image of some Crane's ivory 32 lb. paper I have. I had it printed as personal stationary, but got so disgusted with its resistance to fountain pens, I relined it for calligraphy practice.

 

On the paper is writing from 3 pens:

 

1 - my absolute wettest nib, a Namiki Falcon broad, with regular Pilot blue ink.

2 - a Pilot Custom 74 medium (customized to stub) with Pilot blue

3 - a Pilot Vanishing Point broad (customized to stub) with Noodler's Blue

 

I think it's fairly clear that the wettest nib, the Falcon, writes well on the Crane's. The Custom 74 is not too bad either, though when writing I tried to be conscious to always stay on the sweet spot of that nib which is obviously not as wet as a broad. With the VP you can see the problems that I and, I believe many others experience with Crane's paper. The paper, because of its rough surface, looks like, and feels like when you're writing on it, that it's rejecting the nib and the ink.

 

I think we should start a thread titled something like "Which nibs & inks work with Crane's 32 lb." So far we know some Mount Blancs do; my Falcon broad certainly does.

Edited April 18, 2015 by Maurizio

[Blade Runner]

Thanks for sharing. My nibs range from extra fines to broads, and I'm using MB, Aurora and Parker 51s, western brands all having nice flow, greater flow than those you show, so that would explain the difference in experiences. Flow will definitely affect performance on Crane's and other high cotton papers.

 

Finer nib size will also create more feedback, but many prefer feedback, so that's a personal preference. I have no issues on Cranes with my Mottishaw XF (comparable to a true Japanese XF) and Aurora XF which run narrower than most western XFs.

 

Misaligned nibs and those with burrs or other imperfections will be "outed" by high cotton/textured papers whereas glassy smooth papers like Clairefontaine are more likely to hide those imperfections.

 

As you know, cotton papers have a number of characteristics that are superior to wood pulp papers. Fortunately my choice in pens allows me to use high cotton content papers, but clearly it's not a fit for every pen/nib combination.

Edited April 18, 2015 by Blade Runner

[Blade Runner]

I wouldn't give up on 100% cotton papers though. Try different brands, weights and finishes. There are significant differences in performance with fountain pens. But I recommend getting a sample before spending $$ on personalized stationery.

[Maurizio]

I wouldn't give up on 100% cotton papers though. Try different brands, weights and finishes. There are significant differences in performance with fountain pens. But I recommend getting a sample before spending $$ on personalized stationery.

 

This is certainly good advice.

[Keyless Works]

I was using a TWSBI Vac 1.1 mm stub and I had some difficulty with the lines on Crane paper. I found that if I slow down the lines appear as they normally do. I am not sure it's the texture that's the problem as Medieovalis is textured but my pens lines as crisp as on completely smooth paper.

[Blade Runner]

Some favorable opinions of Cranes in this thread, ymmv.

https://www.fountainpennetwork.com/forum/index.php/topic/78192-crane-stationery/

 

Re Smythson

Disappointingly, Christi from Smythson informed me by email that years ago Smythson used cotton, but now only uses wood pulp.

[Barkingpig]

Thanks for mentioning europeanpapers.com. Looks like a fine source.

Let us know how you like your new paper.

I received my order from Euoropean Papers today! I was very impressed since I had ordered in the "middle of the night" only on April 17. Their $4.95 shipping rate was Priority & certainly produced prompt delivery. The paper is quite nice (not as heavy or as textured as the paper from "Mrs. Strong") but will be a very suitable replacement. Because it's surface is less textured it accepts ink nicely & certainly looks much nicer than most papers available. The edging is beautifully done & I think anyone would be pleased with it. I enjoyed seeing the difference between the folded note & single card of the same size. There is no diminished weight difference & I would happy therefore to use the folded note. I certainly am pleased by both purveyor & paper for anyone considering a cotton writing paper.