Inky T O D - Color Swatches - Violet - Purple - Please Post Your Pictures And Tell Us Your Thoughts

[A Smug Dill]

12 hours ago, pgcauk said:

ps - I have always wondered where the name 'Salix' came from for this pretty Pale Grey-Blue.

 

I'm pretty certain R&K Scabiosa ink is also named after a/the plant.

 

Also: https://www.fountainpennetwork.com/forum/topic/25547-scabiosa/#comment-234569

 

[pgcauk]

Yes, yes, but with Scabiosa, which in England we used to call 'Pincushion Flower', the color of the ink is wonderfully close to the color range of the wildflower, which can be anywhere from chalky blue to mauve. The riddle for me was what was the connection between a willow tree and a pale blue ink? Organics Studio did a rather nice 'Willow Green' (although mine slimed over, but the color was a nice yellow-green), but the catkins are yellow and, although salicylic acid and 'willow bark tea' are real and important things, I can't off the top of my head think of any connection between willow trees and the color blue other than the once ubiquitous 'Willow Pattern' China (which might also be the source for Diamine's China Blue - although I think that might be a common name with a butterfly too?).

No research at this point, just a wandering mind, but Pernambuco Wood is pink (and the source of a purple dye!), Helianthus and Verdigris are well named, so Rohrer & Klingner do seem to have historical and botanical references down (rather than just be naming by association).

Open question: How do willow trees connect with the color blue?

[A Smug Dill]

54 minutes ago, pgcauk said:

The riddle for me was what was the connection between a willow tree and a pale blue ink?

 

https://www.google.com/search?tbm=isch&q=salix+blue ?

[pgcauk]

https://vgm.liverpool.ac.uk/blog/2021/willow-pattern/

The blue in ceramics is cobalt, so the only connection with willow trees is the design.

Was not so convinced by the blue-leaved willows, although the blue-bark was quite striking and not something I have experienced, I think. There was a bright blue flower called "Blue Willow", but that was a salvia, so it's just a name and another example of willows and blue being associated?

[pgcauk]

Here's inks and dyes from willow bark - lovely, but not blue! 

https://www.turkeyredjournal.com/archives/V19_I2/dagiliene.html

I have always found it a bit curious how blue has moved from one of the rarest manufactured colors (ultramarine more valuable than gold in Medieval Manuscripts) to one of the most ubiquitous.

[PithyProlix]

On 12/23/2021 at 3:11 AM, pgcauk said:

No measurement yet as I didn't know how much Salix was left in the barrel, I just added 1ml of Scabiosa and can adjust from there. I already am fond of both parent inks, but I have always wished I could 'fix' the color of fresh Scabiosa. For a random mix this is already looking pretty tasty? Scan is as useless as always with violets; above is Salix, below is Scabiosa with the text and the stripe on the side in the hybrid, which in person is a rather pleasing "Iris".

ps - I have always wondered where the name 'Salix' came from for this pretty Pale Grey-Blue. My personal theory is that rather than denoting a dye-color, it is named for its resemblance to the color of "Willow Pattern" China?

 

On 12/23/2021 at 3:03 PM, PithyProlix said:

 

Thanks - nice!

 

Yours looks darker overall (?) but I recall vaguely recall you writing something about your Scabiosa having aged darker, if I remember correctly. Shading amplitude looks pretty high, if consistent? I might try mixing different proportions - I think it is worth pursuing with these two great ink siblings.

 

You may be on to something with the blue-and-white china connection.

 

On 12/23/2021 at 3:31 PM, A Smug Dill said:

 

I'm pretty certain R&K Scabiosa ink is also named after a/the plant.

 

Also: https://www.fountainpennetwork.com/forum/topic/25547-scabiosa/#comment-234569

 

 

On 12/23/2021 at 6:14 PM, pgcauk said:

Yes, yes, but with Scabiosa, which in England we used to call 'Pincushion Flower', the color of the ink is wonderfully close to the color range of the wildflower, which can be anywhere from chalky blue to mauve. The riddle for me was what was the connection between a willow tree and a pale blue ink? Organics Studio did a rather nice 'Willow Green' (although mine slimed over, but the color was a nice yellow-green), but the catkins are yellow and, although salicylic acid and 'willow bark tea' are real and important things, I can't off the top of my head think of any connection between willow trees and the color blue other than the once ubiquitous 'Willow Pattern' China (which might also be the source for Diamine's China Blue - although I think that might be a common name with a butterfly too?).

No research at this point, just a wandering mind, but Pernambuco Wood is pink (and the source of a purple dye!), Helianthus and Verdigris are well named, so Rohrer & Klingner do seem to have historical and botanical references down (rather than just be naming by association).

Open question: How do willow trees connect with the color blue?

 

On 12/23/2021 at 8:56 PM, pgcauk said:

https://vgm.liverpool.ac.uk/blog/2021/willow-pattern/

The blue in ceramics is cobalt, so the only connection with willow trees is the design.

Was not so convinced by the blue-leaved willows, although the blue-bark was quite striking and not something I have experienced, I think. There was a bright blue flower called "Blue Willow", but that was a salvia, so it's just a name and another example of willows and blue being associated?

 

On 12/23/2021 at 9:02 PM, pgcauk said:

Here's inks and dyes from willow bark - lovely, but not blue! 

https://www.turkeyredjournal.com/archives/V19_I2/dagiliene.html

I have always found it a bit curious how blue has moved from one of the rarest manufactured colors (ultramarine more valuable than gold in Medieval Manuscripts) to one of the most ubiquitous.

 

So, I wrote to Rohrer & Klingner and received a reply today. Salix does, indeed, refer to a willow tree - the name is derived from an old pigment made from Salix. 🕵️‍♂️

[pgcauk]

3 hours ago, PithyProlix said:

So, I wrote to Rohrer & Klingner and received a reply today. Salix does, indeed, refer to a willow tree - the name is derived from an old pigment made from Salix. 🕵️‍♂️

Well done sir!

Asprins and blue ink - that's quite a tree!

Plenty of willows along the creek, so time for some research and experimentation!

 

As a side note, I was looking for another packet of Brazil Wood (R&K Fernambuk = Pernambuco) in the Mexican corner shop to deepen the shade of my Pink Pyjama dyeing project 😀. The first shop I tried didn't have Palo Brazil but did have Palo Azul, so of course I had to pick up a couple of packets! Not just blue but flourescent, and also the perfect cuppa to flush the kidneys if a drugs test is on the horizon, saith the internet!

[PithyProlix]

7 minutes ago, pgcauk said:

Plenty of willows along the creek, so time for some research and experimentation!

 

I'll be curious if you figure out how to get blue pigment from the willows. As far as I can tell, Google is clueless about this.

[PithyProlix]

20 minutes ago, pgcauk said:

Plenty of willows along the creek, so time for some research and experimentation!

 

11 minutes ago, PithyProlix said:

 

I'll be curious if you figure out how to get blue pigment from the willows. As far as I can tell, Google is clueless about this.

 

Actually ... if you know Dutch or someone who knows Dutch (but the list says it also has Flemish?) perhaps you can find a recipe in this 17th century treatise on creating watercolor paints. (And, even if you can't translate, I think you will go gaga for the colors samples contained within ...).
https://bibliotheque-numerique.citedulivre-aix.com/viewer/35315/?offset=#page=1&viewer=picture&o=bookmarks&n=0&q=

(if you just want to look at the colors, page 825 is a good place to start)

[pgcauk]

8 hours ago, PithyProlix said:

page 825

Oh my!

Fwd. to my Belgian friend who works with natural dyes.

Did you have this: https://www.c82.net/werner/?

Available in print for a reasonable price!

[InesF]

17 hours ago, pgcauk said:

Oh my!

Fwd. to my Belgian friend who works with natural dyes.

Did you have this: https://www.c82.net/werner/?

What a great resource! ... instantly bookmarked!

Thank you, @pgcauk!

[ENewton]

18 hours ago, pgcauk said:

Oh my!

Fwd. to my Belgian friend who works with natural dyes.

Did you have this: https://www.c82.net/werner/?

Available in print for a reasonable price!

 

Wonderful!

[PithyProlix]

On 1/11/2022 at 5:12 AM, pgcauk said:

Oh my!

Fwd. to my Belgian friend who works with natural dyes.

Did you have this: https://www.c82.net/werner/?

Available in print for a reasonable price!

 

No I haven't seen that before - wow - thanks for sharing!

 

I have another great book along the same lines though contemporary called Natural Palettes: Inspirational Plant-Based Color Systems by Sasha Duerr. There is a page on salix/willow where she talks about getting dyes from the branches and bark but, unfortunately, she does not show a blue. ($3 USD for the ebook version)

 

But I just found this absolutely incredible book called Nature’s Palette: A Color Reference System from the Natural World which is an expansion of the Werner's Nomenclature of Colours book you linked to with illustrations of the flora, fauna, & minerals Werner referred to as well as other interesting content. I think this must be seen - I am able to check out an ebook version from my library, so you might check if you can too. You can look at some Youtube video reviews to get a sense of the print version. It really is amazing.

[pgcauk]

A pen came up for refill - yay! I have such a plethora of samples and new purchases that haven't had more than an initial dip-pen test. Violet has been this season's thing, but which should I choose? I dipped into 3:
Ink Studio #343 was lovely, but quite close to my already inked Soft Snow of Ohara (Phew! I only have a sample of the #343 so I was rather hoping that I wouldn't fall in love and have to but a full bottle. It is a lovely powdery blue-violet though . . . .)
Diamine Vivaldi was so handsome that I almost didn't try my 3rd option, but that's not really fair so . . .

Oh, side by side on Tome River Ink Studio #223 (which I was hitherto regretting plumping for a full bottle of) and Diamine Vivaldi were close to a match! These are inks with very different component dyes so the resemblance (in this instance) was quite striking.

So having plumped for the #223 (rather than clean out the pen again - I can try the other one next fill) I decided to compare them today on Midori paper. This is what I found:
 

OK, so on Midori they don't look close at all, but still interesting? . . . and look at those lovely pinks bleeding out of Sakuranezumi and Violet Starling!

[pgcauk]

An update for PithyProlix on the Saliosa (Salix + Scabiosa) Hybrid.
Adding more Scabiosa got me very close to my beloved, cosseted and hoarded Keshimurasaki, but at a more useful level of saturation. This game is fun!

 

[amberleadavis]

Very nice!

[PithyProlix]

37 minutes ago, pgcauk said:

An update for PithyProlix on the Saliosa (Salix + Scabiosa) Hybrid.
Adding more Scabiosa got me very close to my beloved, cosseted and hoarded Keshimurasaki, but at a more useful level of saturation. This game is fun!

 

 

Ooooh, great to see & know! Especially since I missed out on Keshimurasaki.

 

I am still very happy with the 1:1 mix and now see that more Salix+Scabiosa experimentation is on my close horizon... 

 

Thank you! 

[amberleadavis]

 

I'm sure I have shown these before, but since we lost some of the images, I'm adding them here.  And yes..... a few blurples.

 

De Atramentis Christmas Marzipan thanks to @HalloweenHJB

Diamine Sargasso Sea

Diamine Bilberry (DSS and DB are two of my favorite mixing inks, they brighten any color).

Diamine Imperial Blue

Noodler's Socrates

KWZI Violet #4 one of my all time favorite purples.

J Herbin 1670 Ocean

Noodler's La Couleur Royale

[amberleadavis]

And today

 

Colververs Haybusa, I'm not seeing the glisten.

Sailor Sankods Kinshi Black Purple Nishikisan See the review here.  One of my favorite black Purples.

Diamine Winter Miracle - I now use this ink every day and consider it a good replacement for Lamy Dark Lilac

Lamy Dark Lilac

Diamine Purple Bow (but it is a bit dark because I didn't clean the pen from BungBox 4B)

[Chi]