Waterman Stalwart #2 Canadian Nib - Good Buy Or No?

[WirlWind]

Howdy,

 

 

So I'm pretty new to Waterman pens (I'm new to the hobby as well, but I have done -some- research on P51's and mid 40-60's Sheaffer pens, specifically because I wanted an Imperial IV TD, which I got and love!) and was looking around for a decent, yet cheap, vintage flex.

 

I saw a few sites out there selling refurbished flex pens and used that as a guide on what to look for on ebay and I came across this:

 

http://www.ebay.ca/itm/Vintage-Waterman-Stalwart-Fountain-Pen-Ideal-14K-Canada-2-Nib-Vg-Cond-Works-/281257980826?ssPageName=ADME:B:EOIBSA:AU:3160

 

Fully working, #2 canadian nibbed Stalwart.

 

 

In the small amount of research I've done, I've heard a few times that #2 ideal Canadian nibs are good for flex, but then I've had other people say that they're at best semi-flex. Also, the stalwart's don't seem to be that common (the search on this forum came up with only a few threads and very few of those were people who actually owned one).

 

Would you say this pen was worth a $50 or so price tag including postage? Did I pay around average or did I get a deal? I don't mind if I got it for the average-ish price (I like the look of it and it seems that it should flex -enough- for what I need it for).

 

Is there anything I should know about these as a first time owner of a waterman pen from the 40's (for ex - certain inks to avoid etc). From what I understand, they have an older feed type that can struggle to keep up, so I would imagine that a wetter ink would be appropriate, no?

 

 

Cheers in advance

 

- Josh

[Left FPN]

That pen has a No 2A nib and from my limited experience (512V) it has very little flex compared to a No 2 (heart nib) Canada nib on my 12PSF.

[konis]

Nice pen

[Sinistral1]

Those 2A nibs can be flexible, but the heart hole #2 New York nibs are usually much easier to flex. Of course, the sellers know that we want FLEX, so they advertise them as such when often they are really just soft or only slightly flexible. I hope you got a nice flexible 2A nib, like you want.

[WirlWind]

  On 2/5/2014 at 10:26 PM, konis said:

Nice pen

 

I know, I fell in love with it the moment I laid eyes on it, similar to my Sheaffer Imperial IV. It's a very dark blue that looks almost black in some lights. Some pens just hit you right in the feels

 

  On 2/6/2014 at 12:49 AM, Sinistral1 said:

Those 2A nibs can be flexible, but the heart hole #2 New York nibs are usually much easier to flex. Of course, the sellers know that we want FLEX, so they advertise them as such when often they are really just soft or only slightly flexible. I hope you got a nice flexible 2A nib, like you want.

 

Yeah, I think I'll have a yell at him if it isn't that flexible. I'm hoping for at least 3 sizes of flex, but perhaps a slightly less flexy nib would still be nice as I intend to try and do some daily writing with it if I can.

 

I actually had a group of 4 pens I was sniping (Don't yell, I was out all day so that was my only option) and the first two both had the heart #2 nibs but both of them had a reserve and they didn't meet it. I kind of had pen-overload at that point, so when I looked at the stalwart, I thought it had the heart breather hole at a quick glance. That, plus the seller's description that it has "good flex" makes me think that I should be fine though. Not going to be a wet noodle, but I'd bet it will be enough.

 

Worst case I can return it under Aussie consumer law, or just buy a different nib. Either way, I'm happy I got the pen because I think it looks awesome

 

 

  On 2/5/2014 at 7:12 PM, Force said:

That pen has a No 2A nib and from my limited experience (512V) it has very little flex compared to a No 2 (heart nib) Canada nib on my 12PSF.

 

Does it have at least a few sizes of flex though? I wasn't expecting a wet noodle, but I'd like at least F-BB or something like that. Worst case I can hit the guy up for false advertising and maybe get some money back to spend on an actual #2 heart nib.

[WirlWind]

A sad update:

 

The pen arrived today and the first thing I tried to do was flush it. The first thing that was wrong was it hadn't been flushed by the seller. It poured blue/black from the nib. Second, the level seemed to not be working.

 

Now, me being stupid, I believed the guy when he said it was in good condition and fully working. So when I twisted off the section, the last thing I was expecting was to see a sack so corroded that it was actually blocking up the entry to the feed where it was supposed to be attached.

 

I've sent the guy a... mildly passive aggressive email about it.

 

So if you're buying a pen from "Krill7", I'd suggest making sure he opens it before he sends it to you if he's claiming it works fully...

 

On the upside, the nib seems somewhat flexy. Like, M to BB or so with very little effort.

Edited February 19, 2014 by WirlWind

[Sinistral1]

Don't be too sad! Now you get the opportunity to replace a sac (they are inexpensive) and learn more about how fountain pens work. Plus, it's a beautiful pen! And, a flexy nib is what you wanted and sounds like that's what you got, right!

 

I recently got an eBay pen for a good price, but I believe the seller also did not flush the ink out of the section and nib. It came from England and when it arrived here in December (-6 degrees Fahrenheit) and I started soaking it, found the entire section blocked. It is a c/c, so no sac or lever to deal with, but after two weeks of soaking in various solutions, I finally gave up and took it to my local pen doctor, who was able to replace the inner section and feed. The ink had frozen in the section and, in the words of the pen doctor, had turned into concrete.

 

When I contacted the seller about what had happened, he said the pen had been in perfect working order when he shipped it, and he would not refund the cost of the repair. He did offer to take the pen back, but I had already had the repair done and liked and wanted to keep the pen. Nearly a month later he posted feedback and warned "All UK sellers" about a buyer who makes silly claims and refused a full refund!

 

Actually, I rather like being someone who should be shunned by the pen sellers of the United Kingdom. At this point, it's my only claim to infamy!

Edited February 19, 2014 by Sinistral1

[WirlWind]

  On 2/19/2014 at 1:51 AM, Sinistral1 said:

Don't be too sad! Now you get the opportunity to replace a sac (they are inexpensive) and learn more about how fountain pens work. Plus, it's a beautiful pen! And, a flexy nib is what you wanted and sounds like that's what you got, right!

 

I recently got an eBay pen for a good price, but I believe the seller also did not flush the ink out of the section and nib. It came from England and when it arrived here in December (-6 degrees Fahrenheit) and I started soaking it, found the entire section blocked. It is a c/c, so no sac or lever to deal with, but after two weeks of soaking in various solutions, I finally gave up and took it to my local pen doctor, who was able to replace the inner section and feed. The ink had frozen in the section and, in the words of the pen doctor, had turned into concrete.

 

When I contacted the seller about what had happened, he said the pen had been in perfect working order when he shipped it, and he would not refund the cost of the repair. He did offer to take the pen back, but I had already had the repair done and liked and wanted to keep the pen. Nearly a month later he posted feedback and warned "All UK sellers" about a buyer who makes silly claims and refused a full refund!

 

Actually, I rather like being someone who should be shunned by the pen sellers of the United Kingdom. At this point, it's my only claim to infamy!

 

I've been soaking it in dish-soaped luke-warm water at an attempt to soften up the sac / ectoplasm / whateverelseisstuckinthere...

 

In the end, it's going to cost me more than what I paid for the pen in repairs and postage, so I'm going to try and clean the nipple out myself and hope it doesn't need a chisel.

 

Worst case, like the guy from the pen store said, I would probably get $120 for the nib, so it's not a total loss

 

And yeah, the nib's semi-flex. I tried it out a little when it first arrived and I wasn't putting much pressure on it. It could probably open up further, but I'm wary to do so at the moment

 

I have a #2 NY nib on a Waterman 52 coming this week sometime that goes from 0.2 to about 3mm

 

 

::EDIT:: I don't suppose anyone knows if the feed / nib are friction fit or if they don't come out? I gave a quick tug and while the nib seems to have moved out a little, I don't think it's going to move without a lot more pressure. Don't want to ramp it up until I know how the feed and nib work (and google isn't much help)

Edited February 19, 2014 by WirlWind

[Sinistral1]

Try posting on the Repair Q&A forum about working on the nib.

[WirlWind]

  On 2/19/2014 at 3:06 AM, Sinistral1 said:

Try posting on the Repair Q&A forum about working on the nib.

 

Yeah, figured it'd be worth an ask. I'll just add it to the bottom of my question I just posted in Repair.

[pokermon]

Nib and feed is friction fit on that model, but you might need to punch it out from the back end of the section. If you need someone to bring that pen to life give me a pm. I can offer you great price for something simple like sac replacement and tuning the nib/smoothing if needed.

[Left FPN]

The rear end of the feed on the older pens is flat so punching out is a simple task. A sac is about $3 and a smal drop of shellac the same. You should be able to repair it for under $10.

[WirlWind]

Seems like it was a pretty good deal after all. Not bad for like $48

 

(Pardon the 'meh' flex skills, only new to it)

 

 

http://i34.photobucket.com/albums/d110/WirlWind494/20140223_125428.jpg

Edited February 23, 2014 by WirlWind

[BOOGIT]

I am the GUY. who sold the pen that is being discussed. I offered my apology plus a full refund including return postage but the buyer refused. He requested a $20.00 refund which I paid immeadiately

I understand his frustration but to Trash MY REPUTATION ON THIS FORUM WHICH IS HIGHLY RESPECTED BY PEN LOVERS IS UNCONSCIONABLE

SHAME ON YOU SIR !!!!!

Keith

[flashlight]

  On 3/16/2014 at 11:44 PM, BOOGIT said:

BOOGIT, on 16 Mar 2014 - 23:44, said:

I am the GUY. who sold the pen that is being discussed. I offered my apology plus a full refund including return postage but the buyer refused. He requested a $20.00 refund which I paid immeadiately

I understand his frustration but to Trash MY REPUTATION ON THIS FORUM WHICH IS HIGHLY RESPECTED BY PEN LOVERS IS UNCONSCIONABLE

SHAME ON YOU SIR !!!!!

Keith

There are always two sides to a story and I believe the buyer should not have had any work done on the pen until he had spoken to the seller - so I'm on your side