I Just Wanna Rant!

[mhosea]

Nathan will probably just tell you to dilute the ink with distilled water if you like it less saturated. I do.

 

I've not seen or heard of any evidence that non-Baystate Noodler's Inks pose any risk to celluloid. Most celluloid pens, are, however, sac-based, and there is some controversy over whether some Noodler's Inks might cause premature sac failure. This probably poses more risk to your clothing than to the pen, though cleaning out a melted sac is no fun. Having said that, all testing with controls in place, save one, has only served to suggest that the tested inks don't do anything to latex, at least not on their own (and if in combination with some other thing, nobody knows it might be). The one test that showed any effect was a sequence test of exposure to BSB and then to BBH. Subsequent tests with BBH alone showed no effect. I've had latex sac fragments in BSB for quite some time now, though, so pretty soon I should go back and check whether anything has happened to them.

[mhosea]

I've not seen or heard of any evidence that non-Baystate Noodler's Inks pose any risk to celluloid.

 

I should probably add that I haven't seen any evidence that the Baystate inks pose such risk to celluloid, either. I just prefer to exclude the Baystate inks because they are advertised to be quite different from all other Noodler's inks and also reputed to have melted a few feeds here and there.

[ravantra]

 

Yah it has a lovely colour!!! Does it clog? Goulet says that it may clog.

I add a small amount of water to it. In several years use never had a clog.

[Alexandra]

You might like Private Reserve Invincible Blue.

[dgturner]

For an IG ink, try the one of IG inks made by Pharmacist (here on FPN). If you want a sample of his older formula (which admittedly goes on the paper very light, though he has corrected that issue IIRC) you can send me a PM with your mailing details and I can send you a sample.

[Albus]

 

+1 Pigmented Sei-Boku absolutely rocks. Before Sei-Boku, I've used Noodler's 54'th Massachusets (too dark blackish blue) mixed with Luxury blue for a lighter tone also Bad green Gator for giving it a more colder & lighter tone. All eternal Inks. Mixing inks for your taste is great fun. Noodler's make several great eternal/waterpoof blues, I would love to try Bad Blue Heron but I have tons of Blues at home now. Actually I am looking for someone giving away some blues like Baystate blue- not for staining properties, too indigo for me and does not mix with other colors/greens.

Well, I do have a small sample vial of BBH, BBK, PR Placid Blue, 1 each some used more than others, I would be happy to send you them. I brought them originally to test. I'll be PMing you shortly.

 

Huh. Well, you're the first person I've heard talking about celluloid and Noodler's.

 

Honestly, I think there's a lot of FUD spread about Noodler's because Nathan's a new player who's not afraid to do inks with different properties and is not shy about speaking his mind. He ought to just put up some endurance test videos with various pen materials, but given his 'instructions' with KTC it seems he thinks all the rampant mud-slinging is funny. I wonder if there were historical kerfluffles of ink problems (Parker's 51 Superchrome was reportedly pretty toxic)? It takes all kinds, I guess. Nothing in the world will get me to buy Waterman's inks, the pH tests I've seen were pretty acidic (not putting battery acid in my pens, thanks), and I've yet to see a Diamine ink that can stand up to water.

 

I use all my Noodler's inks on all kinds of paper, including cheap office paper. The ones that give me trouble are Polar Brown (smelly, feathery, shades too much) and Bad Green Gator (lovely in F nibs but feather-prone when enough ink gets on the page). BSiAR, the blacks I've tried (X-Feather, Black, Eel Black) haven't feathered enough for me to notice it.

 

Well, there's a chinese proverb, where there's smoke there is fire, where there's wind, there be waves. One may say that Nathan's new kid on the block but then we did see the melted feeds. Although interestingly, I put BSB in a yellow safari wrote half a page and left it in there for a month or so because i think it is too bright and forgot about it.

 

Well, the Lamy was stained pretty badly and it was permanent. The feed didn't melt though. Sadly, the Lamy was destroyed in a cleaning incident where I tried really hard to force the feed back in and bent the feed. Now it is forever stuck halfway in.

 

Interestingly, because of this thread, I decided to fill a Hero 616 with BSB and it is pretty nice to write notes on the margin. BUT still too bright for a few pages of essay ( i think you will get headache after reading a page of BSB on geopolitics of vietnam and China or tons of chemical reaction in BSB).

 

The issue with Noodler's ink, i think, is because it is new. And the dye-stuff he uses is untested. We don't really know for sure if it is safe or does it react very slowly with the pen plastic.Whereas, the other dyes are tested and used for ages, particularly Ig inks.

 

"Corrosion", "corrosiveness" is commonly thought of a issue of pH, which is correct. However, I want to point out that because the ink is in contact with plastic, the new "ingredient" in the ink may interact and weaken the plastic. Maybe that is what happened in the pilot and lamy feeds. It is not about corrosiveness of the ink but rather the issue of solvent or chemical attack.

 

Think of acetone and celluloid. Acetone is neutral. But why does it dissolves celluloid? Solvent.

Think of Bleach (slightly alkaline only to keep it stable) and cotton. Why does repeated washing or soaking with bleach weakens the fibre? This is more complex and likely due to a redox reaction.

The issue is NOT pH. But rather other chemical reactions.

 

So the issue is that will the dye-stuff Nathan uses interact and weaken plastics?

 

Of cause you make suggest that acidic or caustic (alkaline) causes corrosion but then yet again it depends on the material we use. For example, the other day i was trying to dissolve some oil (hydrogencarbon, ) with concentrated hydrochloric acid (yup, the fuming type) using a stainless steel stirrer. And oil did not dissolve. So i proceeded to add concentrated nitric acid to oxidise the oil. However, the stainless steel stirrer begins to dissolve as I have created aqua regia (absentmindedly). So the issue here is not pH but rather the solvent used. Conc Hydrochloric or Conc nitric acid on its own would never react with stainless steel. However, put them together it will start to dissolve steel, gold, silver, etc.

 

So it does not really mean that acidic or caustic stuff will corrode metals, it depends on the condition. I think cleanliness is important. However, if the issue is the ink, cleanliness will only limit the severity of the problem. I will not solve it. And particularly for stainless steel, there is a protective layer by formed in air and long term soaking in ink will remove the layer because there is not air to reform the layer.

 

However, I will still support Nathan and Noodler's ink because of his philosophy. That is he aims to provide the most value for money ink in the market. And also, he believes in the freedom of choice ie the freedom of people you and me to choose which ink/product to use irregardless of what the "holier than thou" pen experts says. Which is also the choice made based solely on personal preference of what you want and need.

 

ESSRI does do well with an occasional flush. I am notoriously bad at pen maintenance but a flush every 6 months or so is always a good idea with that ink,. LOL

 

For Ig inks, i normally flush once every four months. I recommend bleach on non-celluloid pens. Pharmacist recommend vinegar then ammonia, have not tried it yet, but it sounds better.

Nathan will probably just tell you to dilute the ink with distilled water if you like it less saturated. I do.

 

I've not seen or heard of any evidence that non-Baystate Noodler's Inks pose any risk to celluloid. Most celluloid pens, are, however, sac-based, and there is some controversy over whether some Noodler's Inks might cause premature sac failure. This probably poses more risk to your clothing than to the pen, though cleaning out a melted sac is no fun. Having said that, all testing with controls in place, save one, has only served to suggest that the tested inks don't do anything to latex, at least not on their own (and if in combination with some other thing, nobody knows it might be). The one test that showed any effect was a sequence test of exposure to BSB and then to BBH. Subsequent tests with BBH alone showed no effect. I've had latex sac fragments in BSB for quite some time now, though, so pretty soon I should go back and check whether anything has happened to them.

 

Interesting. Hope you share the results.

 

 

I should probably add that I haven't seen any evidence that the Baystate inks pose such risk to celluloid, either. I just prefer to exclude the Baystate inks because they are advertised to be quite different from all other Noodler's inks and also reputed to have melted a few feeds here and there.

 

 

I add a small amount of water to it. In several years use never had a clog.

 

Alright. Point noted. If I find the ink to be too viscose, i will add some water.

 

You might like Private Reserve Invincible Blue.

 

Ah. Another ink to try. Thanks for the suggestion!

 

For an IG ink, try the one of IG inks made by Pharmacist (here on FPN). If you want a sample of his older formula (which admittedly goes on the paper very light, though he has corrected that issue IIRC) you can send me a PM with your mailing details and I can send you a sample.

 

Thank you for the offer but I think I will get the lastest ones . I have problems trying to contact Pharmacist here in FPN and his hotmail. No reply from him. Perhaps you can help me pass the message that I would like to order some ink? Thank you very much in advance!

Edited October 18, 2013 by Albus

[cbaytan]

Well, I do have a small sample vial of BBH, BBK, PR Placid Blue, 1 each some used more than others, I would be happy to send you them. I brought them originally to test. I'll be PMing you shortly.

 

 

Sorry for ambigious sentence, actually I live in Turkey and I meant I want to give away some BSB to whom needs it near me or inside the country to avoid big shipping charges.

[SeeksAdvice]

 

The formulation may have changed, in which case you are revealing new information here. Another possibility is that the run-off is not BBH at all, rather ink previously used in the pen and not completely cleaned out before loading it with BBH. To rule out the latter, just use a swab, a dip pen, or anything roughly approximating a dip pen to transfer some ink to the paper and try the test again.

I can check with something else, but pretty sure. I recall having the same results with two different pens.

[mhosea]

I can check with something else, but pretty sure. I recall having the same results with two different pens.

 

I guess Dizzy's test does show a bit.

 

http://www.flickr.com/photos/39405638@N00/4112897318/

 

I just hadn't seen it, and I know several other folks around here have spoken of BBH as fully waterproof. I have start-up issues with BBH after the ink is in the pen a couple of days, and it's a nuisance to clean thoroughly--sticks to the nib like it's in love.

Edited October 19, 2013 by mhosea

[kazoolaw]

First Lamy, then Montblanc, stopping their production of IG ink.

 

Why, oh god, why?

 

Look at this as an opportunity: these are not rare and fragile things. They are mass produced inks. If you look you can still find Waterman Blue Black ink from the 40's. Just look around and I sure that you will be able to find MB iron gall ink bottles for years to come. Plus you'll have the satisfaction of the hunt.

 

gary

[SeeksAdvice]

 

I guess Dizzy's test does show a bit.

 

http://www.flickr.com/photos/39405638@N00/4112897318/

 

I just hadn't seen it, and I know several other folks around here have spoken of BBH as fully waterproof. I have start-up issues with BBH after the ink is in the pen a couple of days, and it's a nuisance to clean thoroughly--sticks to the nib like it's in love.

 

And, I reconfirmed my own report using a virgin preppy. Let it dry overnight and hit it with water this morning. End result was a turquoise like run off from the ink. Not in great amounts, but some still there. By the way, the Preppy I tested it in seems to really not like BBH.

 

Yes, I finally broke down and ordered several bottles of Noodler's more durable inks.

[Albus]

 

Look at this as an opportunity: these are not rare and fragile things. They are mass produced inks. If you look you can still find Waterman Blue Black ink from the 40's. Just look around and I sure that you will be able to find MB iron gall ink bottles for years to come. Plus you'll have the satisfaction of the hunt.

 

gary

They just cost soooo much to ship here to singapore!!!!!!!!!!

 

However, i think you are right - time to change and enjoy the hunt.

 

 

And, I reconfirmed my own report using a virgin preppy. Let it dry overnight and hit it with water this morning. End result was a turquoise like run off from the ink. Not in great amounts, but some still there. By the way, the Preppy I tested it in seems to really not like BBH.

 

Yes, I finally broke down and ordered several bottles of Noodler's more durable inks.

 

Really? I don't really like BBH, looks teal to me. It works alright in my Hero 616 as does BSB. You can consider using them in Twsbi or the piston fillers; easier to clean.

[Offret]

http://imageshack.us/a/img534/9700/sa6h.jpg

 

(Mabie Todd Swan 4660 Leverless ..... ESS Registrars Blue/Black)

(Pelikan 140 - OF ..... Montblanc Midnight Blue (iron gall))

(Noodler´s Ahab EMF ..... Rohrer & Klingner Salix)

(Pelikan 100N - EF ..... Rohrer & Klingner Scabiosa)

(Pelikan M600 - M ..... Pelikan 4001 Blue-Black)

Nice post.

 

I have a bottle of the old Lamy iron-gall blue black and it is still a lighter blue.

[Mafia Geek]

I just started using Platinum Blue-Black which is also an Iron Gall ink (that I can get in cartridges) and it's really quite nice as well, definitely up there for my favourite ink.

[akustyk]

I just started using Platinum Blue-Black which is also an Iron Gall ink (that I can get in cartridges) and it's really quite nice as well, definitely up there for my favourite ink.

 

Yes!!! This is an awesome ink that few people know about. It's inexpensive, well-behaved, and a beautiful color (including shading).

 

Now, about the rant, I fully agree. Midnight Blue is my favorite ink of all time. I have one and a half bottles left. I hope they last for a while. After that, well, it's an opportunity for a small ink company. Let's hope they take it!

[Newjelan]

I just started using Platinum Blue-Black which is also an Iron Gall ink (that I can get in cartridges) and it's really quite nice as well, definitely up there for my favourite ink.

I'm interested in your experience because while I like the colour, I find it way too dry.

[Mafia Geek]

I'm interested in your experience because while I like the colour, I find it way too dry.

 

It may be because I have it in a quite wet Platinum 3776 Sai with a Medium Nib. It came much to wet for daily use, so I had to get it a little drier (really hard to do on a new 3776 nib btw). Now it's great, really great shading to the ink, one of the best for shading that I've used for the amount that is plainly visible in normal writing. A lot of other inks shade, but not nearly as much in just normal writing as Platinum Blue-Black does in that pen.

[Newjelan]

It may be because I have it in a quite wet Platinum 3776 Sai with a Medium Nib. It came much to wet for daily use, so I had to get it a little drier (really hard to do on a new 3776 nib btw). Now it's great, really great shading to the ink, one of the best for shading that I've used for the amount that is plainly visible in normal writing. A lot of other inks shade, but not nearly as much in just normal writing as Platinum Blue-Black does in that pen.

Interesting, because I have only had success using it in a very wet Platinum 3776 with a Music Nib and it's still dry although it does shade a little.

[mongrelnomad]

For well-behaved pens, just stock up on Sailor Sei-Boku and marvel that the bods in Japan managed to create a permanent ink that needs no more patience than a regular ink.

 

If you have a gusher, use Diamine Registrars' Ink. Very, very dry, but flows quite well in the right pen. I have two pens (one Sailor, one Omas) that I use exclusively with this ink, not because of the permanence, but because it slows the flow right down and makes them lovely writers.

 

Not a huge fan of the Salix. Always found them a bit gloopy and unpredictable...