Going For A Lamy Factory Tour, What Do You Want To Ask?

[Ernst Bitterman]

The question I would have to perpetually prevent myself from asking; "May I have one of those?"

[Bo Bo Olson]

Bump

Tomorrow I take all the questions and put them in some sort of order.

 

Last chance.

 

Because at 08:30 I'll be at the factory Friday morning.

 

I'll take my Art Deco styled black titanium oxide Persona....Lamy violet sounds like a good ink to have in it. That clip mechanism is a winner. It's an early one with out the minuscule bump on the clip to keep it from rolling off the desk.

 

I happened to stop off at an optometrist in my village who sells and sells on consignment small antiques. The only pen he had was that black Persona. Unfortunately it was at €100 over my budget I went looking for it on Ebay or FPN and was looking at a good picture of one....called my wife in to look at a pretty pen....she has the patience of a saint.

 

My wife went behind my back, and bought it for me.....behind my back mind you.

 

It was an OB 18 K nail with no line variation. Pendleton Brown made it a M-B CI for me.

The nibs get a bit smaller when getting a pen made CI.

[StrawberryJam]

Ooh. I would like to know if they plan to offer the dialog 3 in any other colors other than black or silver (either as a limited edition or a permanent line). Also, any other retractable nib pens in the works?

 

HAVE FUN!

[hungh]

+1 to the purple Safari

I would also like to know if they are planning on bringing the Safari turquoise back like they did with the pink, because I really loved that color but sadly, missed it.

[chris.hale]

"Why don't they sell spare nibs for the 2000?" It's not rocket science to replace one and I'd rather not have to send my pen off to Germany, paying postage both ways, because they run too broad.

[twdpens]

"Why don't they sell spare nibs for the 2000?" It's not rocket science to replace one and I'd rather not have to send my pen off to Germany, paying postage both ways, because they run too broad.

 

I would also like this question answered. Even a limited distribution through suitably qualified retailers would be an improvement. Also, FTR, Lamy changed the 2000's nib specification about 4/5 years ago such that they are no longer overly broad or too wet. The change came a little before the all-metal front section was introduced.

 

I have another question. I have asked this of Lamy many times but it may carry more weight coming from a retail customer. "Why does Lamy try to segment the global market by introducing certain new models in overseas markets before they are available in Europe?"

 

As for the other questions, all I can say is good luck!

 

Martin

[OnePenGuy]

Got some questions - what other materials do they have planned for the Lamy 2000 bp (if they can spill the beans)? For 2016 (or a 50th anniversary edition), would they consider (or are they considering) a heavy, yet essentially permanently-polished finish for a tungsten-barreled Lamy 2000?

 

...[snipped]

 

So, I was checking my emails (had the account since '97), and I saw that, every other time I asked lamy about making a tungsten-barreled pen with a permanently-polished tungsten carbide finish (borrowing the term from the TrewTungsten rings), a 50th anniversary edition of the Lamy 2000, and maybe a combo of the two (a tungsten Lamy 2000), I usually got the response that the ideas would be forwarded on.

 

My first email was in '04 (after I got my http://j.mp/BOMAPenD6 #3, I thought tungsten was a great material out of which pen companies should make barrels), and, along with other features I thought would be nice to see get incorporated in a pen, I also asked if they could make a pen with a clip that fully retracts (like the Swift) but with a twist action (like the Pelikan Level 5 rollerball, although that one doesn't retract fully flush).

 

Then, in '06, when the Dialog 2 debuted, I also emailed them to give them praise and telling them I thought it was cool that they put out a pen with some of the features I thought a pen should incorporate, and included the old email with all of the pen feature suggestions. Since it was just a praise/comment email, there wasn't a reply.

 

In '11, I asked again if they thought a Lamy 2000 with a tungsten barrel would be something special for a 50th Anniversary edition, and again they said they'd forward the suggestion on. I figured that at least 5 years of R&D and planning would be sufficient to check the feasibility of creating a tungsten Lamy 2000 and optimizing the manufacturing process. I just thought that tungsten's density would help emphasize the "weight" or importance of such a timeless, ever-popular design, and the permanence of the mirrored, scratch-free finish would help one enjoy using the pen because it would look "like new" for a long time (with maybe only a few micro-scratches, if any - I've got a tungsten ring which, when I don't wear it, I put it on my quick release key ring, and in a pocket with the keys and coins, the ring's never gotten a scratch).

 

Anyway, with this tour opportunity, I decided to ask once again (in case it wasn't asked on the tour, since the focus here is more on the fountain pens), and this time got a different answer:

 

Thank you for your material proposal for the LAMY 2000 ballpoint pen.

We are permanently evaluating different materials for the LAMY 2000 series. Tungsten is one of them.

We are also thinking about something special for the 50 years jubilee.

 

Just thought it was cool that they're considering tungsten for the Lamy 2000!

 

[LameJane]

I won a Lamy factory tour sponsored by a local newspaper, for this coming Friday morning.

 

 

So? How was it? Any pictures?

[Bo Bo Olson]

The hanging gardens of Lamy. Off the workers canteen on the roof, is a 50 foot wide, 200 foot long, divided into three parts garden, two parts where you can 'be alone' the third section has it's own little pond. With various 15-20 foot tall trees. One section is divided from the other by a 15 foot tall hedge wall. In that section is a couple of those modern bent and polished steel 'sculptures' then the last section, with little withe triangular sub sections.
The first section is under a wine lattes shading two thirds of some 15 four man tables (red brick flooring), some 6 niches of one or two three man benches set around an oblong of bushes, trees and grass with red brick as path. The smoking area.

The first thing I did was give your questions and comments to the sales manager.
Our tour of 25 people took an hour. Led by the design manager.

They farm out deign, for population segments to well known designers, like Gert Muller....then that is taken and made machine capable, by engineering and draftsmen.

The building 1 3/4ths block long, set back,for parking and a bit of space. Lots of trees. Half the building with the machines is set back...the offices is closer to the sidewalk; but still have some green space..
I have been promised pictures. I asked for lots...of course there won't be any close ups or many of the machines.

Made €67,000,000 last year....600,000 fountain and ball point pens. Some 300 workers....very, very machine made. Was a snide comment, Lamy is the market leader in Germany, it is in the black...the other pen manufacturers in Germany are in the red.
50% market in Germany, 25% in Europe, 25% rest of world.
20,000 fountain pens and 20,000 ball points a day.
Can do 22,000 if they need too.
Very few people working at night...those machines that don't require some one to test nibs....if there is a problem...it just shuts down...there are other machines doing the same work.

The only way they can stay in business in Germany is by having very good and expensive fast machinery doing everything. There was some robot coating some pens...don't know what type..... criss crossing and hand shaking....one robot can if it decides to, give the next robot arm the part. The tour leader looked down his nose at the robots used in making cars.

The plastic granulate is dried separately so it is perfect. (750 Kg of plastic is used every day) Moisture would throw off the machines. Granulate drops into a machine where it is heated and extruded into a set of tooling, five pen bodies at a time per machine . every 2.7 seconds another machine takes the in this case the Safari bodies out and drops them into a box..
(some 5 of those..on that side of the factory, the middle row did something else...didn't take a hard look at the far side of the factory....I was suffering from machine overload.)
Counting back there were 7 machines on one wall, some five but different in the middle and 5- 7 on the other wall, until the wall for the corridor; blocked my view of the far side of the factory...it could well have gone another 4-7 machines.
Saw 5-6 workers. In that part of the factory.


The tooling spare parts warehouse was not over filled, each part seemed to have enough place around it, so parts couldn't get jumbled nor bang into each other. Efficient, due to having enough space, knowing the ware factor of the parts.


Other machines make other parts.
The fountain pen cartridge machine makes 20,000 a day. The distributer is supposed to sell the old cartridges first, because of the evaporation rate....

The bottom section of the ball point 'cartridge'--guess roller ball too, is drilled out on an oil bath machine.

Have a series of machines that forces the ink into them, goes to a centrifuge to make sure there is no air in it before the glob of grease is added with the plastic color cap. If some one leans forward to look closer, the machine stops for safety reasons. After they are filled the metal ball point cartridge is labeled Lamy, and color etc.

Have 27 Lamy shops in China that sells mostly/only .Lamy..(wasn't quite as close as I wished.)
so they know about the clone.

23 stages to making a steel nib, before the 'iridium' ball is placed,
The tines are cut by a spinning abrasive very thin rubber cutting wheel.
with the cut the tines because of metal stress spread apart, the nib is lasered for heat to have the tines come back together.
is mechanically ground.

Each ink loaded steel nib section is tested for scratchiness, 5 at a time, by sound.
Those who sound scratchy are diverted to a little old lady, who writes with it, and if necessary adjusts the tines.Looks at it through a loupe. after testing it again...and again adjusts it. The couple minutes when we were at her section, only every third needed adjustment of the 'scratchy sounding' nibs. Every one was tested.
That was the ones that sounded scratchy.
What a boring job.... Doing figure 8's all day long....adjusting tines.
(I bet she writes with a ball point .)

They were 'shocked' that there was such a thing as scratchy Lamy nib.
The gold nib section was closed...because of visitors...can't have the hand made & ground gold nib's laying around.

Saw two women with grinding bands grind/polishing the 2000 ball point pens.


Doubt if there is any old pens laying around...their warehouse is efficient...first in first out. Not very high can't remember how many hundreds of pallets go out every day. Was a very short two rack pallet wall around the warehouse.... (€100 a cubic meter per day is normal warehouse cost of a rack.). The warehouse floor was filled with various sized pallets going world wide. One I noticed was going to Moscow.
If your order comes in before 14:00 it goes out the same day.
That takes some real time management of just in time.
I didn't see loading dock, but I know how much can come in a day off a four loading ramp set up....I can't see them cheaping out with a 3 loading dock, when they had space for four to five...especially with a up to 14:00 out.
Didn't see all the folks loading boxes or making pallets...folks were there to see how a pen was made not how it was shipped.


We were given a snack in the canteen.

We were given a Lamy silver&black Noto as going away gift.

The Lamy Persona or something very similar is making a comeback next year... :angry: I don't like buying new pens....much less nails....which of my nails got to go?????? The design engineer who led the tour told me, after I showed him my black Persona.

The sales manager was very happy some folks got 25 Safaris of different colors.
I did stress to her the importance of making a EEF....she had thought a EF was narrow enough. I mentioned how so many wanted Japanese widths in their pens, and thought the EF 'fat'.
That an EF was 'fat' was news to her.
The nib width tolerance will be given to me.
As soon as they get around to it.
First of course they got to sit some one down, with good English. My German is not all that good with writing...

It was a 7 pages (and CD) of questions and some of my comments to the questions, I gave them....
CD so they could just add their answers with out going paper happy, or splitting the questions out to whom ever.


I think there might be hope for a EEF nib.
All one has to do is explain to a sales manager that folks buy cheap or regular Japanese pens because they have a western EEF nib and Lamy has a 'fat' EF..

There appears to be no hope for bottled Violet.

Bo Bo's report from the Front.

Edited August 30, 2013 by Bo Bo Olson

[theadityajain]

Thanks for sharing.

It was a joy reading it.

[shuuemura]

Great report! I read it twice through and felt as if I was at the Lamy factory as well.

[GemMayhem]

Bo Bo, thanks very much for the detailed report and for sharing our questions and feedback. I hope you enjoyed the tour.

[auto winder]

Thanks for sharing your experience! I'm quite excited to hear that the persona may make a comeback too

[aenjin]

 

There appears to be no hope for bottled Violet.

 

Noooooooo

 

But thanks for the fun writeup!

[neillmot]

Thank you BoBo! Sounds like it was a very interesting tour.

[wallylynn]

Wow! I'm really surprised they actually weld an "iridium" to the steel nibs. I loved how you described the nib making process, and the little old lady adjusting them.

[cbaytan]

When they will produce a wet noodle flexible nib?

[Bo Bo Olson]

Sigh, I didn't ask that because as Lamy....don't know about the '30's Orthro, but my '50's Artus pens had regular flex, my early '50's...99 or is it a 27...I'd have to look which I have was a nail...sigh...as was my Persona, CP1, Joy and Safari...so I think under Lamy name they just made nails...and kept a winning hand...after all there are those who like a nail.

 

I'll ask when I get some info back.

 

I used the term weld...they like everyone have some sort of spark thing (every one uses the same type thing, even in India)....that they didn't show us....There was one very long machine with some one walking up and down the last half of it...the back of it, that they didn't have 25 idiots wandering around getting in the way....that was where they were slicing nibs with a rubber disk...real thin. I had it in my hand.

 

I couldn't be in the front of the crowd at all times.There was factory noise...hearing protection was not mandatory...but a worker could wear them...none I saw did....the noise level was just under legal limits.

 

In I've seen many videos on how they spark weld tipping on...didn't mind not seeing it.

I would expect some machine that could 'weld' the iridium on steel nibs 50 at a time. Lamy has to be efficient to stay in Germany and not move to China.

 

It was all so automatic, a single man changing rubber cutting disks on 40-50 nib cutting stations.

Also did not see where they measured or how...wasn't my show to run. Boring job cutting 20,000 nibs minus the gold ones a day.

 

I'm sure they had a machine counting how many nibs cut per rubber disk...but that was all on the other side.

 

((In the gold nib section was a round older machine I took for being a spark welder...in the 'glass cover' was dark. It looked big enough to do a good number of nibs at the same time. Just because a machine is old and has a more limited capacity does not mean it's not got a place where less nibs are made in a day.)))

 

 

They had a big hand sized 'tourist' nib of solid steel, where they showed what was done to a nib, and a strip of nib steel stamped with those 27 different steps.

 

They use regular industrial pen nib steel, no special steel made just for their nibs....There are thousands of steels, and a few of them are ideal for making steel nibs. They want a nail, so would use a different steel than what would be necessary to make a steel semi-flex, 'flex' or Easy full flex....they had perfect steels for that back in the '30's-40's-50's. with the steel Osmia-Deggusa and War nibs.

The steel Osmia nibs are just as good as the gold ones. I have some 8 of those pens in steel and gold nibs.

 

It's not necessarily so that a 'modern' steel would be better than what was used then...or cheaper.

 

I'm more into knife steels some of which from way back then still make fine knives like D-2 or a few others I have in mind ....so E-12xxx what ever he mumbled to some one...was lost. In it was not one of the knife steels I knew.

No need to re-invent the wheel, when it comes to steels.

The old days metallurgical engineers were not stupid.**** Many of the uses of steel has not changed since then...sure there are new steels...but is a special made for Lamy only steel...to make a nail, needed, when there is a standard steel already there that works.

Small lot steel....rolls of 1/4th ton or so is expensive per roll. 20,000 nibs a day...$50-150-350 more a roll adds up in a hurry.

No way would they go semi-flex.

 

Bock could if some one ordered a big enough order....order 2-3,000 and I'm sure they will go out and get the perfect steel or gold alloy like 14 C...that you pay for extra.

 

**** In the '20-30-40's before electricity was strung all over the US, farmers worked off DC wind mills.A lot of farm machinery works just fine on DC....((lost the word in my mind...have not thought about electronics in 40 years...after spending 4 years going 'gitty up there electron'.)).a little bushing with a carbon disk with a slit in it....that changes DC into AC.

An engineer had tried 2&4 blade wind mills before setting with an adjustable 3 blade. It was the Rolls Royce of wind mills...he stopped making them in the late '50's....they are bought 3-4th hand for real good money because they were very well made and still work like a champ.

 

The whole know better because they are modern and had 486 computers wasted billions of dollars with humongous 2 blade electrical windmills.

Because radio only generation had to be real stupid.

They were not.

They all have 3 blades now.

[firebug]

Veni, Vidi, Vici!

 

You went, you saw, you conquered!

 

What is next?

 

 

[Pterodactylus]

Thanks for your very interesting report