Visionnaire Fountain Pen

[theolu]

I did not back the Visionnaire - I'd rather spend that money on something like a TWSBI that has an esablished reputation. However, I have backed a number of Kickstarter projects and this just seems to stink. There are some legitimate grounds to believe this guy has violated Kickstarter's project guidelines:

 

 

Kickstarter is a funding platform forcreative projects. These are our guidelines: What is not allowed?

• Projects cannot resell items or offer rewards not produced by the project or its creator.

 

 

 

 

Morgan has got some 'splainin' to do.

[casualmerlinconstant]

Doesn't look so exciting, or do anything different. Unless the point of differentiation is its price?

Edit- just read the rest of the thread. Well I guess that explains the plainness of the pen

Edited November 9, 2013 by superglueshoe

[heymatthew]

I basically talked on Kickstarter until I was blue in the face and these people just didn't seem to get it. I basically resigned my position on the issue, apologized to the creator for any negativity or ill-will I may have projected and have decided to cut my losses. I lost slightly more than $35 at the slots in Vegas during my honeymoon a couple of years ago and that wasn't nearly as fun as battling ignoramuses in the comments section of Kickstarter.

[GazKubat]

I basically talked on Kickstarter until I was blue in the face and these people just didn't seem to get it. I basically resigned my position on the issue, apologized to the creator for any negativity or ill-will I may have projected and have decided to cut my losses. I lost slightly more than $35 at the slots in Vegas during my honeymoon a couple of years ago and that wasn't nearly as fun as battling ignoramuses in the comments section of Kickstarter.

 

I was very tempted to back the pen on face value and then I started reading the updates and vague replies. Everything seemed wrong about it. It would seem that the majority of the backers are either refusing to believe they've been scammed or just don't know enough. To many of them I am sure a pen is a pen and this one is fancier than what they currently use.

 

The project seems to be a scam, and a very profitable one if he gets away with it.

 

I think the biggest issue is that he claims to have designed the pen himself. He claims originality where there is none. If from the beginning he had said "I contacted a manufacturer and wanted a pen to meet these specifications and I need your help to make it happen" it wouldn't be a problem (unless this still violates some Kickstarter agreement).

 

Would like to hope that everything is a coincidence and as someone who knows very little about pens his design was generic/classic. Maybe it will spark an interest in fountain pens for some backers and research will show there are many amazing fountain pens available for a reasonable price.

 

Quite a few comments I saw mentioned the happiness at finding an affordable fountain pen. One even said he had used a fountain pen decades ago and wanted another but he couldn't justify the cost of a Montblanc. Clearly many of the backers just do not know there are other options.

[Haulien]

I have successfully wasted $80 on this ($70 full set early pledge, +$10 shipping). Oh well, I've wasted more on less. Still a nice pen, though.

[mikehodgman]

Wow, reading those comments in Kickstarter, you'd think you were attacking the Pope or something! Morgan's defense fell pretty flat in my estimation, but you never know. Odds are he found this pen being made in China and is selling it here on Kickstarter as being an original design. Oh well.

Edited November 11, 2013 by mikehodgman

[WirsPlm]

 

I was very tempted to back the pen on face value and then I started reading the updates and vague replies. Everything seemed wrong about it. It would seem that the majority of the backers are either refusing to believe they've been scammed or just don't know enough. To many of them I am sure a pen is a pen and this one is fancier than what they currently use.

 

The project seems to be a scam, and a very profitable one if he gets away with it.

 

I think the biggest issue is that he claims to have designed the pen himself. He claims originality where there is none. If from the beginning he had said "I contacted a manufacturer and wanted a pen to meet these specifications and I need your help to make it happen" it wouldn't be a problem (unless this still violates some Kickstarter agreement).

 

Would like to hope that everything is a coincidence and as someone who knows very little about pens his design was generic/classic. Maybe it will spark an interest in fountain pens for some backers and research will show there are many amazing fountain pens available for a reasonable price.

 

Quite a few comments I saw mentioned the happiness at finding an affordable fountain pen. One even said he had used a fountain pen decades ago and wanted another but he couldn't justify the cost of a Montblanc. Clearly many of the backers just do not know there are other options.

The problem is that (as a bespoke no-name Chinese pen) the quality is could be all over the place, and that would turn people off of FPs. Since no maker's name is on it, there's no reason for the manufacturer to pay attention to the QC, and this guy probably doesn't have enough leverage to get them to do decent QC without large wads of cash. Unless he's just buying cheap Hero pens en masse and then messing with the barrels or something?

[JemC]

I basically talked on Kickstarter until I was blue in the face and these people just didn't seem to get it. I basically resigned my position on the issue, apologized to the creator for any negativity or ill-will I may have projected and have decided to cut my losses. I lost slightly more than $35 at the slots in Vegas during my honeymoon a couple of years ago and that wasn't nearly as fun as battling ignoramuses in the comments section of Kickstarter.

 

I've been following the Kickstarter comments, watching you beat your head against a wall. You're right, most of the other backers seem determined to remain ignorant. It's so painful to read!

 

I feel like a lot of the Visionnaire's backers are treating Kickstarter as a store, rather than a crowdfunding idea platform (or whatever).

 

It's a good thing non-backers can't comment projects...

[hashish81]

Wow, I also backed Matthew in his beliefs and he is taking all the flak. Thanks.

 

As per Morgan's offer, I am requesting a refund. Are you guys asking for one too?

 

I have to agree its crazy that these funders are backing Morgan. All he has to do to dispel any questions is tell us where the pens are manufactured. I doubt he'll answer the question, because if it is the same factory then this is clearly in violation of KS's guidelines.

 

If this is a scam, its really sad that he use his or a child to legitimize this "project".

[GazKubat]

The problem is that (as a bespoke no-name Chinese pen) the quality is could be all over the place, and that would turn people off of FPs. Since no maker's name is on it, there's no reason for the manufacturer to pay attention to the QC, and this guy probably doesn't have enough leverage to get them to do decent QC without large wads of cash. Unless he's just buying cheap Hero pens en masse and then messing with the barrels or something?

 

I agree. I just hope that is not the case and we are all wrong and these are amazing pens. It would be a shame for this to be a first fountain pen for many people and ruin their experience.

 

I'm interested to see what happens as details come up. If he is lying the truth will come out eventually. But then again the creator is very careful to be vague enough with his comments that he might be preparing for trouble.

[GazKubat]

Wow, I also backed Matthew in his beliefs and he is taking all the flak. Thanks.

 

As per Morgan's offer, I am requesting a refund. Are you guys asking for one too?

 

I have to agree its crazy that these funders are backing Morgan. All he has to do to dispel any questions is tell us where the pens are manufactured. I doubt he'll answer the question, because if it is the same factory then this is clearly in violation of KS's guidelines.

 

If this is a scam, its really sad that he use his or a child to legitimize this "project".

 

I wouldn't put it past someone to use their child as a way to sell a story. I'm working at the customer service counter of a grocery store and people come in to return stolen baby formula ($20+ a container) saying they bought it in anticipation of their newborn baby and complications arose and the baby did not survive. I was convinced the first time but when you hear that story multiple times (even once when the same people came back several months later) you start to realize some people will do anything for a buck.

[stopher]

 

I wouldn't put it past someone to use their child as a way to sell a story. I'm working at the customer service counter of a grocery store and people come in to return stolen baby formula ($20+ a container) saying they bought it in anticipation of their newborn baby and complications arose and the baby did not survive. I was convinced the first time but when you hear that story multiple times (even once when the same people came back several months later) you start to realize some people will do anything for a buck.

That is crazy!

Edited November 11, 2013 by stopher

[theolu]

The most telling thing to me is how evasive Morgan has been. The most glaring example is his "response" to heymatthew's questions regarding the alibaba site was to talk generally about it knockoffs. Notably, he did NOT deny that it was his manufacturer's aliababa listing. Nor did he specifically say that the alibaba listing was a knockoff of his pen - he talked around it. If that was really a knockoff he would have said it, point blank.

 

I will also note that the alibaba site has since been taken down . . . wonder if Morgan had anything to do with that.

[heymatthew]

If you look back through this thread, you'll see that I actually fought for this project pretty hard. I really did try and give Morgan the benefit of the doubt and help debunk some of the issues surrounding this project. It wasn't until later that I started seeing some trends in his responses and information that really made me think something was up with this. Then, the Alibaba link really kind of sealed the deal for me.

 

I am the first to admit when I'm wrong, and I think I was definitely wrong about this project. Morgan offered me a refund, which I declined, although I should have accepted. At this point, my curiosity has gotten the best of me and I'm interested to see just what my $40 will get me.

 

The comments that he has put money back into the project to "Upgrade" the converter and to add more cartridges and packaging are ridiculous. He likes to pretend that he "redesigned" the converter when I clearly found the same exact converter, albeit clear, in a blog post from almost two years ago. His "revolutionary spring agitator" has been used in Jinhao pens for years. He's a schmuck and a liar and all of these blind sheep idiots are just following along. I think at this point they just want to believe so badly that they haven't been swindled that they'll defend him tooth and nail. Unfortunately, you can't fix stupid.

 

I apologize to my fellow FPNers for doubting you and thank you for helping me to see the errors in this project and also thank you for backing me up in my arguments on the KS board.

[Wheatflower]

I am the first to admit when I'm wrong, and I think I was definitely wrong about this project. Morgan offered me a refund, which I declined, although I should have accepted. At this point, my curiosity has gotten the best of me and I'm interested to see just what my $40 will get me.

 

I'm sorry that it went down like this. I didn't think this was a good KS from the minute I read the Visionnaire page, but I never dreamed it could be this bad. I hope the pen gives you $40 of story to tell when you are hanging out with other fountain-pen lovers!

[heymatthew]

 

I'm sorry that it went down like this. I didn't think this was a good KS from the minute I read the Visionnaire page, but I never dreamed it could be this bad. I hope the pen gives you $40 of story to tell when you are hanging out with other fountain-pen lovers!

 

Well, like I said, I've wasted more on less.

[stopher]

 

I hope the pen gives you $40 of story to tell when you are hanging out with other fountain-pen lovers!

Regardless of how this plays out over the next month or two, it has been very entertaining and makes for a good conversation over a pint

[mikehodgman]

Anybody get this pen yet? I am really curious how it performs.

[heymatthew]

Anybody get this pen yet? I am really curious how it performs.

 

There are a lot of early reports in the Comments section of the project on Kickstarter. I don't mean any offense by this, but it seems that the majority of people commenting on it are relatively new to fountain pens. As in, the Visionnaire is their first foray into fountain pen ownership. This is what I was most afraid of because I don't believe the Visionnaire is the best pen for a first pen.

 

I'm concerned about the build quality of the pen as well as how good the pen actually is based on initial reports because people are asking questions like:

• Should the converter be this tight?
• I'm hearing some rattling. Is this normal?
• Can someone tell me how to put this together?
• How do I put ink in the pen?
• I got the converter out, finally, now how do I put the cartridge in?
• Are there instructions for this?

Granted, we all started somewhere. Heck, my first pen was a Lamy Vista. I now have a rather decent collection that I enjoy very much. I got some Jin Hao pens a while back (by the way, they're available at GouletPens.com now) and when I got them, I thought, "Hmm. These aren't bad pens for the $8 I paid for them." I feel like all the people leaving comments like, "Wow! Best pen ever!" and "This is my new daily driver!" and "What a beautiful writing instrument! It's perfect!" are probably extremely new to fountain pens and wouldn't know a crappy Chinese pen if it leaked on their favorite Pink Plaid Jos. A. Bank Traveler Dress Shirt. Again, I'm not picking on anyone that is new to fountain pens, but it's hard to say whether or not the pen is any good yet without some experienced users weighing in on it and comparing/contrasting it with higher priced fountain pens, and fountain pens manufactured from similar materials in similar factories (ie, Jin Hao, Hero, etc.).

 

I should have mine in a few days hopefully and I'll post a first impressions review and then compare/contrast it with some others.

Stay tuned.

[heymatthew]

Also, being that Morgan has compared his pen to the likes of Waterman and Mont Blanc pens in the $160-1000 range, most people wouldn't have the means to be able to figure out if it's actually an accurate comparison anyway as most people aren't going to be able to go out and drop $160 on a Waterman or $600 on a Mont Blanc so they may never know the difference.

 

Ignorance is bliss, I guess. It's those that know better that will ultimately shed light on whether or not this pen is worth the paltry sum the early birds paid for it, or if it's an over-priced Jin Hao.