Painting With Watercolors Over A Fountain Pen Drawing...ink Ideas?

[scrivelry]

I have "Higgins Fountain Pen India" ink that I bought at Dick Blick, but it says right on the bottle, "Non-waterproof Black Ink" so if that's what JeffreyS was talking about, I'm afraid it won't work for you.

[Sandy1]

  On 1/14/2014 at 7:46 PM, biffybeans said:

FWIW, I find that even with "permanent" inks, smearing is still sometimes possible. It has something to do with the way the ink dries- the top ink molecules drying faster than the bottom ones. Might be related to humidity, or the lack thereof as well.

 

Hi,

 

Kindly also consider the influence of the paper's coating/sizing on the inks' bonding & drying.

 

In the sample of NBBBl posted above, the Arches 100% cotton cold press watercolour paper was soaked to remove the sizing, to which the cellulose-reactive ink might not bond or be unable to completely penetrate - leaving some unbonded dye that could come adrift when over-worked with wet media.

 

For coated or highly calendered papers, the use of pounce to condition the working surface could be an alternative to soaking.

 

Bye,

S1

 

__ __

Wiki 'pounce' : http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pounce_%28calligraphy%29

Edited January 16, 2014 by Sandy1

[amberleadavis]

Lunar, I do things like this with my kids. Here is an example, I did the flowers and the flowers within the flowers.

 

http://sheismylawyer.com/She_Thinks_In_Ink/Inklings/slides/2013-Ink_523.jpg

 

Then I encourage the kids to add more flowers. Note that we are only using circles or loops.

 

http://sheismylawyer.com/She_Thinks_In_Ink/Inklings/slides/2013-Ink_523b.jpg

 

Then, I let my youngest practice with a wet brush.

 

http://sheismylawyer.com/She_Thinks_In_Ink/Inklings/slides/2013-Ink_523c.jpg

[pictogramax]

I have great experiences with Platinum Carbon Black ink so I'm recommending it always to fellow sketchers and watercolorists. If washed over immediately after putting down the line, it will smear a little under water, but it takes me at least a couple of minutes to finish any line drawing and by that time it is completely safe to put watercolors over it.

 

Here are some samples of watercolors (or other fountain pen inks) washed over Platinum Carbon Black, usually five to ten minutes after starting the drawing. You can see that there are occasions where I applied a very far amount of water and paint over it and it stood admirably. I consider it a really great sketching ink and use it all the time. The only downside is that it can feather on lower quality paper and requires a thicker, preferably watercolor paper for the best performance, but that's the paper you would be using anyway for washes.

 

http://www.pictogramax.com/blog/2014/5/24/esquisse-de-jour-031

 

http://www.pictogramax.com/blog/2014/5/24/esquisse-de-jour-027

 

http://www.pictogramax.com/blog/2014/5/24/esquisse-de-jour-029

 

http://www.pictogramax.com/blog/2014/5/24/reveillon-2013

 

http://www.pictogramax.com/blog/2014/6/4/nivelles-2014

 

http://www.pictogramax.com/blog/2014/4/9/drazensson-sylvainsson

 

I also like very much R&K SCABIOSA; it is not as permanent, but just that gives it a great possibilities and it has a lovely shade that intermixes with washes to a certain degree. Here's a blog post on testing it:

 

http://www.pictogramax.com/blog/2014/5/24/esquisse-de-jour-029

 

And I also did a three-part review of Diamine's REGISTRARS ink:

 

http://www.pictogramax.com/blog/2014/5/25/diamine-registrars

 

http://www.pictogramax.com/blog/2014/5/25/diamine-registrars-round-two

 

http://www.pictogramax.com/blog/2014/5/25/diamine-registrars-round-three

 

You can draw your own conclusions there.

 

Hope it helps!

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[napalm]

The carbon / pigmented inks from Platinum (choice of black, blue, brown and rose):

 

http://www.platinum-pen.co.jp/products/spare/ink/eink.html

[brettha]

I am VERY EXCITED to report that after unsuccessfully trying Noodler's Black AND Platinum (both bled even after thorough drying),

 

I have discovered a TRULY WATERPROOF ink called De Atramentis DOCUMENT ink available from http://www.gouletpens.com.

 

The document ink comes in a variety of colors: http://www.gouletpens.com/bottled-ink/c/14/?facetValueFilter=Tenant~Brand%3ADe_Atramentis

[pictogramax]

Yup, I'm using De Atramentis Document BROWN ink for a while now, washing with watercolors over it, and it's been great:

 

http://www.pictogramax.com/soko-grad/

 

http://www.pictogramax.com/gornjak/

 

http://www.pictogramax.com/moss-creek/

 

http://www.pictogramax.com/old-mill/

 

http://www.pictogramax.com/lignes-de-front-2/

[Davros]

  On 5/30/2015 at 9:00 PM, pictogramax said:

Yup, I'm using De Atramentis Document BROWN ink for a while now, washing with watercolors over it, and it's been great:

 

http://www.pictogramax.com/soko-grad/

 

http://www.pictogramax.com/gornjak/

 

http://www.pictogramax.com/moss-creek/

 

http://www.pictogramax.com/old-mill/

 

http://www.pictogramax.com/lignes-de-front-2/

 

 

Wow. Those are really lovely.

[amberleadavis]

The images didn't come up for me.

[pictogramax]

Because those are links to blog posts with lots of images :-)

[SNAK]

I am finding that along with De Atramentis Document ink, their Archive Black is also completely waterproof, and behaves the same way as their Document inks. I have tried Doc Black, Brown, Fog Grey, Fuchsia, Turquoise, Yellow, as well as their Archive Black. They all have amazing waterproof quality that I appreciate for washing over with watercolour.

 

I just don't know what the differences are between D.A.'s Document Black and Archive Black. For me they behave the same way, look the same way, and I use them interchangeably. I can't detect any difference.

 

Edited to add: I do use Platinum Carbon Black and Pigment Sepia too, but I feel that they have more tendency for clogging the feed if left for a long time in the pen. Whereas D.A. inks have incredible flow (for what I assume are pigment based inks) and I have never had any clogging or hard starts in any pens I tried them in.

Edited May 31, 2015 by SNAK

[pictogramax]

SNAK, I read somwhere that an ink, in order to be branded "archival" has also to resist bleaching and other attempts at forgery and even endure the attack of new race of cockroaches emerged after nuclear war. The "document" ink, on the other hand, will "only" survive couple of generations and be extremely handy with watercolors :-) To our intended artistic purpose I didn't detect any difference either.

 

DAVROS, thanks!

[pictogramax]

AMBERLEADAVIS, if you were referring to my post #24, those links indeed seem to be broken :-( But there's no EDIT button either to that post so I could fix them :-(

[amberleadavis]

Can you post the new links?

[SNAK]

pirtogramax, thanks for your explanation about Archive inks. That makes sense. At my local art supply store where I get my De Atramentis inks from, they have the Archive Black ink a couple dollars cheaper than the Document Black, so I will go with the Archive Black in the future.

 

I also have the Super5 (made by Rorher & Klingner) Waterproof Black which is supposedly good for the same purpose, but I have yet to try that under watercolour wash. When I do, I will try to report back and leave a comment.

[amberleadavis]

  On 5/31/2015 at 6:26 AM, pictogramax said:

resist bleaching and other attempts at forgery and even endure the attack of new race of cockroaches emerged after nuclear war.

 

 

 

Oh, that would be KTC by Noodler's - waterproof, fade proof and DIRT proof.

[the_gasman]

I use Diamine registrar's ink at work (and sometimes at home). It was pointed out to me that I shouldn't use a fountain pen for official forms because the ink isn't waterproof. To make my point, I wrote on a sheet of paper and then held it under a running tap. The writing remained crystal clear and no-one has commented since. You will need a few seconds for it to be able to resist water, but if you don't need immediacy it might suit your purposes.

 

It's a fabulous ink. It goes down as a rich blue and matures to a dark [almost] black in a few hours as the iron 2 oxidises to iron 3. Registers are obliged to leave records that will endure for 100 years.

 

Cheers, David.