Parker 51 Cap Question...

[InfernoOrangeSS]

Being very new to fountain pens in general, and never having had a Parker 51, please excuse me if this is an incredibly dumb question.

Are all Parker 51 caps interchangeable with any Parker 51 pen? The reason I ask is that I am looking for a cap for a recently acquired Parker 51 that does not have a cap. I don't want to order or buy something if it won't work with the pen.

Thank you for any help you can offer.

-William

[icardoth]

No, they are not all the same. There are several cap models out there:

 

1. Vacumatic Full size

2. Vacumatic Demi size

3. Aerometric Full Size

4. Aerometric Demi size

5. Parker 51 Special

 

#1 is fully compatible with #3 and #5 in size, but there are other differences: Most (but not all) #1 have Blue Diamond clips, while #2, #3. #4 and #5 have Arrow clips. All other combinations are not interchangeable.

 

#1 and #3 can be made of gold, sterling silver, stainless steel, gold filled or rolled silver. #5 is made only in polished stainless steel.

 

So, you must first be sure about what kind of pen you have, and then begin the cap search.

[InfernoOrangeSS]

No, they are not all the same. There are several cap models out there:

 

1. Vacumatic Full size

2. Vacumatic Demi size

3. Aerometric Full Size

4. Aerometric Demi size

5. Parker 51 Special

 

#1 is fully compatible with #3 and #5 in size, but there are other differences: Most (but not all) #1 have Blue Diamond clips, while #2, #3. #4 and #5 have Arrow clips. All other combinations are not interchangeable.

 

#1 and #3 can be made of gold, sterling silver, stainless steel, gold filled or rolled silver. #5 is made only in polished stainless steel.

 

So, you must first be sure about what kind of pen you have, and then begin the cap search.

Thank you so much!

I have the Parker 51 Special. I guess I need to find someplace that sells those caps. Greatly appreciate your help!

[Flounder]

I think there is a slight difference in the clutch rings between 51s that have caps with the earlier 5 finger clutch baskets , and 51s with the later 4 finger clutches. The ones with a later open ended 4 finger clutch basket seem to have shallower clutch ring recesses. Swapping the caps around on mine, it is difficult to get a 4 finger cap on one that usually takes a 5 finger cap, and a 5 finger cap on a 51 that usually takes a 4 is looser.

[InfernoOrangeSS]

I think there is a slight difference in the clutch rings between 51s that have caps with the earlier 5 finger clutch baskets , and 51s with the later 4 finger clutches. The ones with a later open ended 4 finger clutch basket seem to have shallower clutch ring recesses. Swapping the caps around on mine, it is difficult to get a 4 finger cap on one that usually takes a 5 finger cap, and a 5 finger cap on a 51 that usually takes a 4 is looser.

Thank you for that help, but I think you went way over my head in your descriptions. As I said, I am very new to fountain pens, so what you have said is hard for me to understand. I shall have to do more research on the subject it seems. Is there a good place to find replacement caps? I'd be somewhat afraid to try eBay as I'm not sure which caps are the Parker 51 Special caps. Looking online through google, I get mostly places selling complete P51 Specials. I'd like to get the correct cap so my P51 is as complete as possible.

Thank you again for trying to help!

[InfernoOrangeSS]

I don't have the ability to post in the classifieds as yet, so if anyone knows someone who has one please let me know.

Thank you

[Flounder]

Hi, sorry if I wasn't clear, my bad.

 

The clutch ring is the silver ring on the body of the pen. This photo shows a later 51's clutch ring:

http://i773.photobucket.com/albums/yy19/flounder2009/51%20Hood%20Gasket/th_Gaskets014Large.jpg

 

And here is a later 51's cap, with a 4 finger open ended clutch basket inside:

http://i773.photobucket.com/albums/yy19/flounder2009/51%20Hood%20Gasket/th_UKBold003Large.jpg

 

Here's a clearer view of the later 4 finger clutch basket:

http://i773.photobucket.com/albums/yy19/flounder2009/Gray%2051/th_Serviced127Large.jpg

 

Here's an earlier 51 clutch ring, left hand picture:

http://i773.photobucket.com/albums/yy19/flounder2009/1948%20Canadian%20Parker%2051%20Vac/th_Lineup.jpg

Earlier 51 caps have a clutch basket that looks more like this:

http://i773.photobucket.com/albums/yy19/flounder2009/th_Basketscratches001.jpg

Here's a clearer view of the 5 finger basket:

http://i773.photobucket.com/albums/yy19/flounder2009/th_01002Large.jpg

 

I don't know what the special's cap came with inside, but you can avoid any potential hassle getting a special cap (shiny finish, black jewel on top for the majority).

I've bought cap parts from Ernesto Soler, maybe drop him a line and see if he can help?

[icardoth]

I don't know what the special's cap came with inside, but you can avoid any potential hassle getting a special cap (shiny finish, black jewel on top for the majority).

Just my two cents: All my Parker 51 Special (I have 4) have the "5-window" basket inside the cap.

[jslallar]

Being very new to fountain pens in general, and never having had a Parker 51, please excuse me if this is an incredibly dumb question.

Are all Parker 51 caps interchangeable with any Parker 51 pen? The reason I ask is that I am looking for a cap for a recently acquired Parker 51 that does not have a cap. I don't want to order or buy something if it won't work with the pen.

Thank you for any help you can offer.

-William

 

 

Dear InfernoOrangeSS

 

Firstly welcome.

Secondly no question is stupid, yours was in fact quite to the point and although not affected I did learn something from reading your blog here, and noted it for future reference.

[InfernoOrangeSS]

Being very new to fountain pens in general, and never having had a Parker 51, please excuse me if this is an incredibly dumb question.

Are all Parker 51 caps interchangeable with any Parker 51 pen? The reason I ask is that I am looking for a cap for a recently acquired Parker 51 that does not have a cap. I don't want to order or buy something if it won't work with the pen.

Thank you for any help you can offer.

-William

 

 

Dear InfernoOrangeSS

 

Firstly welcome.

Secondly no question is stupid, yours was in fact quite to the point and although not affected I did learn something from reading your blog here, and noted it for future reference.

Thank you for the kind words. I learned a lot from the good people who responded as well. Sometimes, I feel like the more experienced members might cringe if I ask something that most would assume everyone should know.

I have a Parker 51 Special cap on it's way now for my pen. Thank you to all who responded!

[PAKMAN]

Love it when folks help each other and another pen becomes complete!

[pajaro]

I think there is a slight difference in the clutch rings between 51s that have caps with the earlier 5 finger clutch baskets , and 51s with the later 4 finger clutches. The ones with a later open ended 4 finger clutch basket seem to have shallower clutch ring recesses. Swapping the caps around on mine, it is difficult to get a 4 finger cap on one that usually takes a 5 finger cap, and a 5 finger cap on a 51 that usually takes a 4 is looser.

 

So, if I understand this correctly, if you are replacing the clutch ring, because you lost one down the sink drain, it matters which clutch ring you use, and if you replace the clutch ring on a pen with a four finger clutch with a ring from a pen that had a cap with a five finger clutch, you might have issues getting the cap on properly, the exact situation I have now. I knew there was something wrong with the replacement clutch ring. I can't get the cap on my 1960s 51 Standard.

Thanks for the explanation. I can't see any difference in the clutch rings between the one on this 51 standard and a slightly later one, both with four finger clutch baskets. Well, this clears up a mystery for me.

[Flounder]

Nice one Mr. Inferno, that was very quick!

 

Pajaro, I took a few photos and they all came out horribly, there's no natural light here in the evenings this time of year. The difference is easier to feel than see, running a (human) finger over the hood and clutch ring. The older style feels more of a pronounced bump. Is there no chance your original is still in the sink's trap?

 

http://i773.photobucket.com/albums/yy19/flounder2009/Vac/Parker51ClutchRings.jpg

Edited October 31, 2012 by Flounder

[pajaro]

Flounder,

 

I see what you mean about a visual difference between the old and new. The older clutch ring does look deeper. This explains why my newer cap hangs up on the deeper indent of the older clutch ring. I can keep pushing, and the cap will go on further, if I push it hard enough to overcome the hang-up of the clutch finger in the deeper indent of the older clutch ring. Interesting how the OPs question elicits the solution for a flip-side issue.

 

I will have to see if there is anything in the sink plumbing trap. The clutch ring I used on the 60s pen came from an English Parker, probably 1950s. I will have to look at the clutch basket on that pen, which was pretty hosed up cosmetically.

 

 

[icardoth]

I may be wrong, but I think the "4 finger open basket" does not use the clutch ring to keep the cap in place. The fingers just use friction fit to grab the section, just as in a Parker 45. So, this type of cap is not as secure as the "5 window basket". Personally I prefer the earlier closed basket, is much better than the newer open finger style.

[Glenn-SC]

I may be wrong, but I think the "4 finger open basket" does not use the clutch ring to keep the cap in place.

What makes you think this?

[pajaro]

I may be wrong, but I think the "4 finger open basket" does not use the clutch ring to keep the cap in place. The fingers just use friction fit to grab the section, just as in a Parker 45. So, this type of cap is not as secure as the "5 window basket". Personally I prefer the earlier closed basket, is much better than the newer open finger style.

 

If the newer 4 finger open basket doesn't use the clutch ring, why include it, why slightly re-engineer it? Spacer?

 

If you prefer the earlier 5 window basket, do you disassemble your 51 caps to replace the 4 finger basket with the 5 window basket?

 

Or do you just use Vac 51 caps on your pens? I'm not sure where I might find that many.

[icardoth]

I may be wrong, but I think the "4 finger open basket" does not use the clutch ring to keep the cap in place. The fingers just use friction fit to grab the section, just as in a Parker 45. So, this type of cap is not as secure as the "5 window basket". Personally I prefer the earlier closed basket, is much better than the newer open finger style.

 

If the newer 4 finger open basket doesn't use the clutch ring, why include it, why slightly re-engineer it? Spacer?

 

If you prefer the earlier 5 window basket, do you disassemble your 51 caps to replace the 4 finger basket with the 5 window basket?

 

Or do you just use Vac 51 caps on your pens? I'm not sure where I might find that many.

 

Of course I do not change the basket, I do not have the proper tool to do that. I just try to keep the "window" pens and let the "4-finger" go. All Vac 51s have n-window baskets, I think they changed the window number at some point. Some early aeros also have this kind of basket. Newer MK2 aeros and all the MK3 (the pens with flat barrel end) have the 4-finger style.

 

Parker51.com say that

 

1962 Finger clutch introduced

 

So, 1948-1962 aeros have the window cap clutch.

[Glenn-SC]

 

Parker51.com say that

 

1962 Finger clutch introduced

 

So, 1948-1962 aeros have the window cap clutch.

OK, went from 5 to 4.

What leads you to believe that the fingers no longer attach to the clutch ring?

[InfernoOrangeSS]

Interesting how the OPs question elicits the solution for a flip-side issue.

I don't feel so bad asking my question now. Glad it sparked a discussion. I have learned a lot from you guys!