Handwriting Sample

[Lyander0012]

Thought to upload a sample of my (admittedly bad) handwriting; I really need to work on my penmanship :/

Any comments or suggestions on how to improve my handwriting?

 

[Draless]

Looks good, some words are a bit hard to read it seems due to the spreading of the ink. Trying one nib size smaller or different stationary that may help.

[pmhudepo]

Nice writing. I think it just needs a bit more space and the smaller size nib Draless suggested should help as well to make your writing clearer, open up the letter forms a bit. If you increase the line spacing (write on every other line), your bold descenders won't run into the next line.

[linearM]

I agree with the suggestions you have received so far. Everyone doesn't have to have handwriting that looks like it came from a Palmer text. Over time everyone's handwriting evolves and yours is legible and has character, of course that doesn't mean that some things couldn't be done to make it more legible and still maintain it's personal character.

[bernardo]

Very nice, it shows some character. Thumbs up for the ink color choice too!

[Lyander0012]

You know, this is the first time I've ever actually received praise for my handwriting, so I'm at a loss for words, kinda. Thanks guys, I really appreciate it.

 

Actually, I already have considered writing only on every other line thanks to my "bold descenders" (a term that perfectly describes my handwriting, which I've only just now come across), but I'm the kind of person who tries to cram a lot of text into as little space as possible, as I write a LOT; I'd somehow gotten it into my head that doing anything else would be a waste of paper.

 

Anyway, I'm thinking of getting a F Namiki Falcon one of these days, though the soft nib might prove a hindrance (you think?); the F size and Asian manufacturing double whammy ought to result in a really fine line.

 

And, bernardo, I actually botched this batch of ink mix, since I was aiming for something closer to midnight blue; this colour's closer to Celtic green than anything else. Not that I don't like it, but it's not quite what I was going for

[Cepasaccus]

I think with a thinner line the "bold descenders" appear not so bold and so you can continue to write on each line.

[Lyander0012]

An here's an updated version. Well, there are only minor changes, as far as I can tell; I was doing my best to write normally while taking the advice I'd gotten into consideration. Everything except for the smaller nib, that is. Not much room in my budget for an additional FP, sadly.

 

Further comments or suggestions? Apart from the fact that there was barely any change, that is :/

 

 

Edited November 5, 2012 by Lyander0012

[pmhudepo]

I think it looks a lot better already!

 

You could try some of the drills and exercises for a method like Palmer or Business Writing. Even if you're not interested in adopting either style, focusing on posture, grip and motion and properly learning the strokes a script consists of, will be useful. You can find free PDF books on www.iampeth.com -- see for instance their "Rare Books" section.

[caliken]

  On 11/5/2012 at 12:50 PM, Lyander0012 said:

Further comments or suggestions?

 

I think that your writing is basically fine.

 

I agree with Draless and pmhudepo. A finer nib would help to sharpen up your lettering and eliminate the closed-up loops. Also, increasing the inter-line spacing would make a considerable difference in legibility and general ease of reading. A simple way of determining this, is to write a few lines and then measure the distance apart the lines have to be, to avoid the ascenders and descenders from touching. This is then the minimum distance the lines should be apart.

Your writing is a bit cramped and would benefit from opening out a little. The simplest way of achieving this is to "think wide" whilst writing. I've taken the liberty of artificially modifying your example to show what I mean. Firstly, I've created inter-line spacing as described above. In the second example, I've extended the writing to show the effect of "de-cramping". If this second example had been written with a finer nib, the loops wouldn't have closed up.

 

Ken

 

http://i226.photobucket.com/albums/dd289/caliken_2007/Untitled-2600.jpg

[jolyon]

You mentioned that you were "thinking of getting a 'F' Namiki Falcon one of these days". But in my opinion that would be a mistake. That very flexible nib is not what you want unless you are planning to take up copperplate handwriting, or drawing - it's a good nib for the range of line widths it can produce by varying the pressure. You just need a nib with a narrower writing tip. The Sheaffer medium nib is really quite broad for someone who wants to get a lot of words onto each line. A rigid (not flexible) fine or extra-fine nib in a cheap pen seems to be the quick answer. You can get an idea of the effect by turning your Sheaffer pen over and writing with the top of the nib. The free flow from Sheaffer pens usually provides a good narrower line that way.

[Lyander0012]

EDIT: Added postscript.

 

First off, thanks caliken, for taking the time to artificially modify my handrwriting. If anything, I was a bit surprised by the difference such a subtle change in my writing style would have on the legibility of my writing, though not nearly as surprised as you going through the trouble of modifying the sample. Thanks again!

 

Also, after thinking about it a bit, maybe getting a Falcon wouldn't be the best course of action, at least not while I'm still trying to make my penmanship legible. I'll probably save it for when I move on to more complex forms of lettering, like Copperplate or Secretary Hand.

 

Lastly, pmhudepo, I really want to make my handwriting legible, but I'm actually depressed by what my efforts have resulted in so far. I haven't the time right now to upload a sample, but I'll try my best to explain:

 

Originally, my "M"s and "N"s were flourished print-forms, though after trying to improve upon my handwriting, I'd adopted a more orthodox looped style in writing them. There are a few personal touches remaining to differentiate them from textbook samples, but I can't help but feel that it's losing the sense of character it'd originally had. Also, if you'd noticed my capital "A"s, I usually start with an upward stroke and form a soft "S" shape before making a left-slanting downwards stroke, then finishing with an inverse "U" shape for the horizontal bar. It used to come naturally, but I've had to make a conscious effort of late in trying to write that way; apparently, my hand wants to use a standard Palmer "A" in its place.

 

... I realize that it's a bit weird for me to be obsessing so much over little things, but I suppose I don't want my handwriting to lose any of its character. You see, I adopt letters from the handwriting styles of people I respect or admire, and I've been doing so since grade school. For example, my capital "P" came from this really nice teacher I had in 7th grade that helped me through a hard time early on in life, the "A" I was so fixated on is on its 3rd or 4th variation, originating as a sort of modified Greek Delta symbol (LONG story); my lowercase letters, as well as my interest in fountain pens in general, I got from my grandfather, who I respect and love very much.

 

Essentially, there's a bit of a backstory to my handwriting, and I feel guilty about sacrificing it for mere orthodox writing. I still want to make it legible, but if it's all the same, I'm going to keep a safe distance from Palmer or Spencerian texts. No offense intended to those who utilize those hands on a regular basis, though.

 

So my only course of action would be to get a smaller nib and try widening/spacing/spreading my letter forms, yes? I'll work on that over the week (school's in again here in the Philippines, so I'll be getting a lot of writing in, haha), and I'll see what's happened to it after then.

 

Cheers!

 

 

P.S.

jolyon, I have no idea how the back of your Sheaffer nibs act, but writing with the reverse end of mine is... well, scratchy would be a bit of an understatement, really. I suppose that it'll wear down if I keep writing that way, but I'm not that desperate )

Edited November 8, 2012 by Lyander0012

[Mickey]

  On 11/7/2012 at 9:58 PM, jolyon said:

You mentioned that you were "thinking of getting a 'F' Namiki Falcon one of these days". But in my opinion that would be a mistake. That very flexible nib is not what you want unless you are planning to take up copperplate handwriting, or drawing - it's a good nib for the range of line widths it can produce by varying the pressure. You just need a nib with a narrower writing tip. The Sheaffer medium nib is really quite broad for someone who wants to get a lot of words onto each line. A rigid (not flexible) fine or extra-fine nib in a cheap pen seems to be the quick answer. You can get an idea of the effect by turning your Sheaffer pen over and writing with the top of the nib. The free flow from Sheaffer pens usually provides a good narrower line that way.

 

The Namiki Falcon isn't even close to being flexible. It is at best, soft. Getting one would hardly be a mistake.

[thang1thang2]

  On 11/8/2012 at 2:38 AM, Mickey said:

The Namiki Falcon isn't even close to being flexible. It is at best, soft. Getting one would hardly be a mistake.

 

I think one with a mottishaw adjustment would be more of a mistake, though. Either way it's still an amazing pen to consider.

 

  Quote

... I realize that it's a bit weird for me to be obsessing so much over little things, but I suppose I don't want my handwriting to lose any of its character. You see, I adopt letters from the handwriting styles of people I respect or admire, and I've been doing so since grade school. For example, my capital "P" came from this really nice teacher I had in 7th grade that helped me through a hard time early on in life, the "A" I was so fixated on is on its 3rd or 4th variation, originating as a sort of modified Greek Delta symbol (LONG story); my lowercase letters, as well as my interest in fountain pens in general, I got from my grandfather, who I respect and love very much.

 

Essentially, there's a bit of a backstory to my handwriting, and I feel guilty about sacrificing it for mere orthodox writing. I still want to make it legible, but if it's all the same, I'm going to keep a safe distance from Palmer or Spencerian texts. No offense intended to those who utilize those hands on a regular basis, though.

 

We all have different personalities, that's what makes us unique after all. It's quite alright to have a story behind your handwriting and want to keep that story. I would suggest that if you want to get your handwriting more legible without losing its character that you evaluate one of three paths

 

1. Learn Spencerian/Palmer and lose all the personality of your handwriting, and then add back the letter forms you want to change gradually but keep the slant, consistently, uniformity of the others. (You only mentioned a capital A, Capital P and some lower case letters)

2. You could take a pencil and write each and every letter "perfectly" in an exemplar of your own writing. Find your handwriting, and shape it into a single letter of each different character that would be your perfect "idealization" of that letter. Then practice your own handwriting to get it consistent

3. You could completely ignore all the advice about switching styles and just slow down your writing, space it out a wee bit, and work on consistency and see where that takes you. Practice makes perfect, after all.

 

Handwriting is simply the art of written communication. Legibility is composed out of an even slant and spacing and a consistent letterform. With those three things in mind you can do pretty much whatever with your handwriting and keep it very legible (this is why scripts like ornament blackletters can exist. Or cadels. They'd be a horrible mess if they weren't executed perfectly).

 

Personally? I would suggest a bit of 2 and 3. Take your handwriting and make an "ideal" alphabet, practice it, and write a lot, slow down and widen up your spacing a tad and you should end up with "your" handwriting, but a more legible cousin of it.

 

I hope that helps*

 

*In case of emergency: ignore everyone but caliken.

[pmhudepo]

Practice makes permanent but, as I've read on this forum, not necessarily perfect unless you have a good basis to work from. Creating an exemplar of your own script is a good idea. Understanding the general principles is beneficiary too.

 

To clarify: I've spent quite a bit of time working on my handwriting, often in a 30-minute session before breakfast. I would notice difficulties in my writing: for instance, a "d" and "cl" would appear very similar and I would work on that. I used practice sheets with guidelines to work on slant and tall ascenders, long descenders. My writing on these sheets improved. However, there was quite a difference between slow, deliberate practice and daily writing (notes, journal, letters).

 

What helped me, was to have a better understanding of posture, grip and motion. Search for "tripod grip" (as opposed to "death grip"), "whole arm movement" and "muscular movement", or ask Mickey to please explain it once more It continues to help me to develop a more relaxed, flowing way to write, lessening the distinction between practice and daily writing.

 

Certainly, the idea of slowing down, using a bit more space and eventually getting a finer nib is great. Re-learning the basics can take quite a lot of time but I think it will ultimately yield the best result.

[pmhudepo]

  On 11/8/2012 at 5:13 AM, thang1thang2 said:

I hope that helps*

 

*In case of emergency: ignore everyone but caliken.

 

+1

[Mickey]

  On 11/8/2012 at 5:13 AM, thang1thang2 said:

  On 11/8/2012 at 2:38 AM, Mickey said:

The Namiki Falcon isn't even close to being flexible. It is at best, soft. Getting one would hardly be a mistake.

 

I think one with a mottishaw adjustment would be more of a mistake, though. Either way it's still an amazing pen to consider.

 

 

Even modified Falcons are not all that flexible. Unless the OP has the hand weight of a gorilla, a Falcon won't be a problem. If the OP does suffer from gorilla hand, that problem should be addressed before worrying about anything else.

 

  On 11/8/2012 at 5:13 AM, thang1thang2 said:

1. Learn Spencerian/Palmer and lose all the personality of your handwriting,

 

That's silly. Formal study of any handwriting will not erase the personality from your handwriting. Personality is inevitable, even for highly skilled, professional scribes. The mistake is trying to inject personality. The usual result is neither convincing nor satisfying.

 

  On 11/8/2012 at 5:13 AM, thang1thang2 said:

2. You could take a pencil and write each and every letter "perfectly" in an exemplar of your own writing. Find your handwriting, and shape it into a single letter of each different character that would be your perfect "idealization" of that letter. Then practice your own handwriting to get it consistent

 

This assumes analytical skills a beginning calligrapher won't have, e.g., knowing what is perfect, i.e., what the imperfectly formed letters should look like. Designing a handwriting is no trivial task.

 

Other than taking Ken's advice about opening up your handwriting, your best course of action is a formal study. Pick a hand which pleases your eye and suits your needs, find a method book, and go at it. It's fun.

[caliken]

  On 11/8/2012 at 2:38 AM, Mickey said:

The Namiki Falcon isn't even close to being flexible. It is at best, soft.

 

I think that this is right. It's certainly been my experience. I have a Namiki Falcon with an FS nib and wouldn't be without it, but I use it as a superb fine point and never flex it.

 

To use it flexed takes far too much pressure for controlled writing IMO.

 

Rather than spend that amount of money at this stage, why not consider the excellent Chinese pens, currently available. I have several and my favourites are Baoer 388 and 801 pens. They come with (firm) fine nibs and are surprisingly good writers considering the ridiculously low prices.

 

Alternatively, the Lamy Safari pens are cheap and are very smooth writers....again, ideal for your purpose.

 

Ken

 

BTW this is my 3000th post....how time flies!

Edited November 8, 2012 by caliken

[thang1thang2]

  On 11/8/2012 at 3:10 PM, Mickey said:

  On 11/8/2012 at 5:13 AM, thang1thang2 said:

1. Learn Spencerian/Palmer and lose all the personality of your handwriting,

 

That's silly. Formal study of any handwriting will not erase the personality from your handwriting. Personality is inevitable, even for highly skilled, professional scribes. The mistake is trying to inject personality. The usual result is neither convincing nor satisfying.

 

I'm sorry for not stating what I meant completely. We're all individual, and our handwriting will always reflect that, however taking a formal study towards a course of handwriting style is designed (that's the whole point, of course), to reach a certain "ideal". While this creates legible handwriting, it erases some personality in the way that poster was saying. He likes how his lower case letters look because he has a back story behind them. He would lose a lot of that if he tried to learn Palmer. However it would surface back once he "learned to his satisfaction" and then started using it for writing.

 

In any case, his handwriting would look much more uniform, however it may not be the uniformity that he wants, if he did such a formal study, is what I was getting at.

  Quote

  On 11/8/2012 at 5:13 AM, thang1thang2 said:

2. You could take a pencil and write each and every letter "perfectly" in an exemplar of your own writing. Find your handwriting, and shape it into a single letter of each different character that would be your perfect "idealization" of that letter. Then practice your own handwriting to get it consistent

 

This assumes analytical skills a beginning calligrapher won't have, e.g., knowing what is perfect, i.e., what the imperfectly formed letters should look like. Designing a handwriting is no trivial task.

 

Other than taking Ken's advice about opening up your handwriting, your best course of action is a formal study. Pick a hand which pleases your eye and suits your needs, find a method book, and go at it. It's fun.

 

I've never realized how hard it would be. Wouldn't you just write out sentences, find out what your normal letterforms look like and then write down each one, smooth out the lines, make them cleaner while still characteristic and then use that as a direction of where to improve it? It just seems intuitive to me, though that could be because I'm mad as a march hare.

 

  On 11/8/2012 at 3:15 PM, caliken said:

BTW this is my 3000th post....how time flies!

 

Congratulations!

[Mickey]

  On 11/8/2012 at 7:47 PM, thang1thang2 said:

  On 11/8/2012 at 3:10 PM, Mickey said:

  On 11/8/2012 at 5:13 AM, thang1thang2 said:

2. You could take a pencil and write each and every letter "perfectly" in an exemplar of your own writing. Find your handwriting, and shape it into a single letter of each different character that would be your perfect "idealization" of that letter. Then practice your own handwriting to get it consistent

 

This assumes analytical skills a beginning calligrapher won't have, e.g., knowing what is perfect, i.e., what the imperfectly formed letters should look like. Designing a handwriting is no trivial task.

 

Other than taking Ken's advice about opening up your handwriting, your best course of action is a formal study. Pick a hand which pleases your eye and suits your needs, find a method book, and go at it. It's fun.

 

I've never realized how hard it would be. Wouldn't you just write out sentences, find out what your normal letterforms look like and then write down each one, smooth out the lines, make them cleaner while still characteristic and then use that as a direction of where to improve it? It just seems intuitive to me, though that could be because I'm mad as a march hare.

 

 

A hand is not a random collection of letter forms dumped into a pot. This is especially true for cursive hands. To appreciate this, let's look at Spencerian, although the principles apply to most other hands, as well. The Spencerian hand is composed of a limited set of strokes, 7, or 8 principals (the number depending on which source you consult) and two characteristic angles. The entire alphabet, both upper and lower case, and created from just those 7 or 8 strokes oriented on one or the other of the two characteristic angles (52 and 30 degrees). It is the march between these two angles which ultimately determines the manner in which the principles are assembled and how the spacing is effected.

 

Because the system is simple and well organized (consistent), any letter which does not fall into this scheme will almost surely stand out (not in a good way) and fail to space naturally. The result will be the classic dog's breakfast.