What Is The Japanese Fountain Pen Company Quality Hierarchy?

[AltecGreen]

  On 1/23/2012 at 1:22 AM, ethernautrix said:

  On 1/23/2012 at 1:11 AM, kernando said:

Even better, Sailor made/makes a second Hello Kitty model. They should do one in the Daks Simpson line, if they can convince the companies to license the combination, and then they could have a HK tartan pen with a HK in tartan skirt set.

 

I think from Pilot, you'd only get V-Pens/Varsities with Hello Kitty. Maybe Nakaya would do a maki-e commission.

 

Oo! A cherry blossom pink Nakaya? I hope Ricky wants one and orders it! I think that could be very pretty -- just the sakura urushi.

 

 

Wait! Why am I the one to have to buy the pink Nakaya?

 

Well, maybe on the next pass. The current group of custom colors I have on order are in the blue and green range so the next grouping could be in that reddish pinkish range.

Edited January 23, 2012 by AltecGreen

[AltecGreen]

  On 1/23/2012 at 1:15 AM, grahamtillotson said:

What about the lower-end companies? Chinese I guess, but what about the Hero pens and all those? I'd be interested to know the quality rankings for the lower end too.

 

Graham

 

 

 

We should leave Chinese pens for a different thread.

 

 

As for Japanese pens, we need to make a distinction about modern versus vintage for lower end pens.

 

 

For modern pens, there really aren't any strictly low end companies. The big three cover the full range from $3 disposable fountain pens to maki-e masterpieces. However, almost all of the lower end pens do not have formal distribution in many countries outside of Japan except for the Platinum Preppy, Platinum Plaisir and a few others. The lower end pens are mass produced pens with steel nibs that are meant for catridge use. Many are pretty decent writers. The $15 Sailor desk pen is killer. Since most of these models are hard to get outside of Japan and no one talks about them on FPN, it gives the illusion that they do not exist. You kinda have to thumb through the Japanese catalogs for the big three.

 

 

Aside form the big three, Tombow, Ohto and Pentel make fountain pens in the low to middle price range. Tombow make some interesting pens. I've seen plenty of Pentel fountain pens but I don't own one. The ones I've tried seem comparable to the lower middle range pens from the big three. They come in really bright colors. It's not clear if Pentel makes them or one of the big three OEMs the pens. That brings up another point. The big three do do a lot of OEM work for other companies in regards to writing instruments. It's not always clear who really makes the pens.

 

These pens from Ohto, Pentel, and Tombow are pretty much competitive with similar products from the big three for a similar price range.

 

The rest of the modern Japanese pen companies fall into the smaller, high end makes. Aside from Nakaya, Danitrio, and Hakase, you have companies like Eboya, Tsuge, and others. These are handcrafted pens using nibs supplied by one of the big three.

 

 

(BTW-I scored a used Hakase on the eBay last night. No 24 month wait for me. )

 

The situation is very different in the vintage Japanese pen world. The big three are the big three because they pretty much bought up or out lasted the competition by the late 1950's. When all three started, they were not the biggest pen companies in Japan. You would look to a company like SSS instead. Prior to the 1950's there were hundreds of Japanese pen makers ranging from the large companies to small mom and pop jobbers who assemble pens from generic parts. In this case, you did have the equivalent to a third tier company making cheap pens.

[ethernautrix]

  On 1/23/2012 at 2:37 AM, AltecGreen said:

  On 1/23/2012 at 1:22 AM, ethernautrix said:

Oo! A cherry blossom pink Nakaya? I hope Ricky wants one and orders it! I think that could be very pretty -- just the sakura urushi.

Wait! Why am I the one to have to buy the pink Nakaya?

 

Well, maybe on the next pass. The current group of custom colors I have on order are in the blue and green range so the next grouping could be in that reddish pinkish range.

 

Because you're the one collecting Neo Standards in custom colors!

 

I wonder if Nakaya can do a sortv dark reddish-pink in a gradient to white....

 

 

And CONGRATS on your Hakase score on eBay!

[AltecGreen]

  On 1/23/2012 at 4:05 AM, ethernautrix said:

 

 

Because you're the one collecting Neo Standards in custom colors!

 

I wonder if Nakaya can do a sortv dark reddish-pink in a gradient to white....

 

 

And CONGRATS on your Hakase score on eBay!

 

 

True enough. I'll have to thumb though the reddish colors on the magic website.

 

I'm sure Nakaya can do an Akebono (a gradient) pen from pink to off white.

 

 

 

I won't have the Hakase for Tuesday but I will be calling a pre-LA pen show Posse and I should have it by then.

[mongrelnomad]

  On 1/22/2012 at 8:15 AM, Lloyd said:

Gee...I thought Sailor was the best since they produce the Hello Kitty pen.

http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_Ov5tKbeoxvs/SkuLhwa26CI/AAAAAAAAALY/wDPCPIdWB_M/s320/Sailor-HK-00.jpg

 

My wife has that pen. Now she wants a Hello Kitty decal for her car

[georges zaslavsky]

sailor, pilot/namiki, platinum/nakaya offer great quality products but the pity is that they are mostly offered with very tiny inki capacity ink converters.

[Toolattack]

Sailor, Pilot/Namiki and Platinum/Nakaya are the big three.

However, IMHO Namiki maki-e lacquered pens are the very best.

[Martius]

For me, Platinum/Nakaya has the nibs, Pilot the filling systems, and Sailor the overall quality of build. Platinum/Nakaya has a notably bad converter system. (All of my Platinums and Nakayas have suffered flow problems because of faulty converter.) Other than that, I recommend you try all of them and decide for yourself. All the nibs are top quality. You really can't go wrong with any of the big three companies. They are making the best fountain pens ever made. (And I say that as a Sheaffer collector.)

[JustinJ]

  On 1/23/2012 at 11:04 PM, Martius said:

For me, Platinum/Nakaya has the nibs, Pilot the filling systems, and Sailor the overall quality of build. Platinum/Nakaya has a notably bad converter system. (All of my Platinums and Nakayas have suffered flow problems because of faulty converter.) Other than that, I recommend you try all of them and decide for yourself. All the nibs are top quality. You really can't go wrong with any of the big three companies. They are making the best fountain pens ever made. (And I say that as a Sheaffer collector.)

 

 

I have had four Nakaya pens and not had a problem with ink flow or the converters yet. I still have three that get used daily. I also run a lot of different inks through the pens. One of my pens is setup a little drier, since it is used for writing subscripts and superscripts. The pen still has no flow problems.

 

Do you fill the Platinum converter, then push a drop of ink back out of the nib? You could have an air bubble trapped when you fill the converter up. You should not have problems with ink flow in the pens. It could be the ink or the setup of your pens.

 

I find if you want more ink capacity in the Nakaya or Platinum pen, you can use the Platinum Carbon Black Cartridges. The Platinum Carbon Black is a great black ink. You can refill the Carbon Black Cartridge with another ink after using them, if you do not like Black.

[nardo800]

There's not much to add to those great encyclopedic posts, but I would tell the OP that although they are very similar in quality, the Japanese companies have slight differences in what they emphasize in their pens. Sailor, in particular, seems to avoid fancy bodies and complicated filling systems and focuses on nib making, so they have exclusive specialty nibs and the broadest selection of nibs.

Edited January 24, 2012 by nardo800

[phrenzy]

This thread has lit a fire in me, could some knowledgeable pen friends recommend a few Japanese pens in the $100-$300 range to look into?

[JustinJ]

  On 1/24/2012 at 11:59 AM, phrenzy said:

This thread has lit a fire in me, could some knowledgeable pen friends recommend a few Japanese pens in the $100-$300 range to look into?

 

You may want to look at a Nakaya Briarwood Matte finish pen. It is $350.00. The price is $50.00 more than your budget, but you get a handmade pen by master craftsmen. You can read more about Nakaya at their webpage.

 

http://www.nakaya.org/eindex.html

 

 

Here is a FPN review of one:

 

https://www.fountainpennetwork.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=115653

 

You can look at the different finishes here

 

http://nibs.com/NakayaBriarwoodPage.html

 

You can also add your own color hardware and have a wide selection of nibs. Look at the middle of this page and you will see the different bands and clips metals.

 

http://www.nakaya.org/eclip.html

[pecidan]

  On 1/24/2012 at 6:45 PM, JustinJ said:

  On 1/24/2012 at 11:59 AM, phrenzy said:

This thread has lit a fire in me, could some knowledgeable pen friends recommend a few Japanese pens in the $100-$300 range to look into?

 

You may want to look at a Nakaya Briarwood Matte finish pen. It is $350.00. The price is $50.00 more than your budget, but you get a handmade pen by master craftsmen. You can read more about Nakaya at their webpage.

 

http://www.nakaya.org/eindex.html

 

 

Here is a FPN review of one:

 

https://www.fountainpennetwork.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=115653

 

You can look at the different finishes here

 

http://nibs.com/NakayaBriarwoodPage.html

 

You can also add your own color hardware and have a wide selection of nibs. Look at the middle of this page and you will see the different bands and clips metals.

 

http://www.nakaya.org/eclip.html

 

Or you can consider a Sailor 1911 (full or midsize)

https://www.fountainpennetwork.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=38706

 

you can buy on e-bay one at very good prices. Mine, cost me $87, shipping included, a real bargain.

[Jezza]

All three have great pens--and more specifically, great nibs. One thing about the Pilot/Platinum/Sailor pens: Each company designe and produces their own nibs and feeds. While this is not exactly rare, it is certainly not the industry norm anymore.

[inkstainedruth]

  On 1/23/2012 at 12:43 PM, mongrelnomad said:

  On 1/22/2012 at 8:15 AM, Lloyd said:

Gee...I thought Sailor was the best since they produce the Hello Kitty pen.

http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_Ov5tKbeoxvs/SkuLhwa26CI/AAAAAAAAALY/wDPCPIdWB_M/s320/Sailor-HK-00.jpg

 

My wife has that pen. Now she wants a Hello Kitty decal for her car

 

Ya know, other than the ooky/saccharine connotation, that is a really pretty pink.... and this is from a girl who was always something of a tomboy growing up and doesn't really do girly much even now.

If there was some way to get rid of the "Hello Kitty" lettering on the cap I would totally consider buying that pen (depending of course on the price).

Naah -- on second thought I'll pass -- just looked it up on Google for giggles and I'm not paying *anything* what they were asking for one on Ebay. Wondering if the HK fans are pushing the price up....

Ruth Morrisson aka inkstainedruth

[Flake]

I want one of those stupid hello kitty pens so bad. I'm such a girl.

[Hex]

Back on topic a bit, so what would you say are the 3 most desirable vintage Japanese pens ?

Say 1950-1970.

I don't know if there would have been much pen production during the pre-war years, but then again, I have been completely wet before.

 

thanks

[imadeadend]

Who cares which one is the best? The best pen is the one you buy in the end and if you buy any nakaya/sailor/pilot you are getting a great pen!

[Jezza]

It's hard to say which one is the best. Each company has its strong points and weak points, even from one model to the next. A while back, a member asked for a comparison between the Sailor 1911 and the Pilot Custom 742. I made the following photo comparison with narrative: Sailor 1911/Pilot Custom 742

 

I think this shows that, even between comparable pens, there are strengths and weaknesses attributable to both brands. I really like the Pilot clips, I prefer the way Sailor constructs the sections on it's cartridge converter pens, and I like the fact Platinum offers very useable pens made of colorful nitrocellulose. Pilot seems to keep most of its best pens in Japan, making it difficult to acquire them, and even more difficult to get them serviced if needed. I really comes down to deciding which features are most important to you, and going with that pen. Ultimately, however, I suspect you will end up like most of us and own pens from each manufacturer.

[stan]

  On 3/25/2012 at 2:44 PM, Hex said:

Back on topic a bit, so what would you say are the 3 most desirable vintage Japanese pens ?

Say 1950-1970.

I don't know if there would have been much pen production during the pre-war years, but then again, I have been completely wet before.

 

thanks

 

In the 1950s, Pilot was the dominant manufacturer. Platinum was second. third could be a toss-up between a number of makers. Sailor was not that big at the time. Makers like Vanco, Masters, and others had substantial market presence.

In the 1960s, Pilot continued their dominance, Platinum remained in second and Sailor moved up to third as mos of the smaller makers went under or were absorbed by one of the Big Three.

The 1970s is a bit tricky as Pilot remaine dth emain maker but, Platinum moved up substantially as did Sailor. I think in this era they really became the Big three.

 

In the pre-war era pen production was only limited by consumer ability to buy one. There were a large number of makers some of which produced very high quality writing instruments. Pilot predominated the 1930s. Both Platinum and Sailor were smaller companies.

 

In terms of desirability, this is a tough question and it will come down to personal choice. I will not include makie as Dunhill-Namiki would be at the top of the list.

My opinion.

1950s: Pilot Super. Any interesting celluloid pens from Platinum and Namiki. You could include yotubisi but, they ade a good number of makie models.

1960s: I have none on my list.

1970s: any of the better models by the Big three are desirable.

 

1930s: Northstar, Marukin, Star, and a few others made high-quality products. Pilot, in my opinion, was more of a mass market maker during this period.

 

Caveat: During the 1930s and 1950s one can occasionally find stellar quality products from small makers usually associated with mediocre products. You have to spend the time looking at hundreds of pens to find good stuff.