Learning Copperplate...

[toxicwitch]

Brilliant - I will order a Zebra G and give it a whirl at 10mm. Thanks so much for your help! It is pretty lonely teaching yourself!

 

Lisa

[smk]

Lisa - I know full well how it can get. I was teaching myself Copperplate when I was in Pakistan with very limited access to supplies. Luckily I had good company here and on WetCanvas so the process ended up being quite enjoyable.

 

You have come to the right place now :-)

 

Salman

[Mickey]

Lisa - the 404 is a fairly stiff nib and 4mm is about the right x-height for this nib. It is not suitable for writing at 10mm. The 303 would be better suited for that size but is very sharp and a little hard to control. You might want to try a Zebra G nib if you have a heavy hand. These are a little more flexible than the 404 and much easier to control than the 303.

 

You will find nibs vary slightly in size, thickness and roundness. This is why oblique holders with brass flanges are recommended. The flange can be adjusted (carefully) to account for the slight variation in the nibs.

 

Good luck with your exams. You are very welcome to post whenever you are ready.

 

Salman

 

The Hunt 22, I think, might be an even better compromise. It's soft enough to encourage a lighter hand, will provide generous (if not exactly extravagant) swells, and is less likely to snag than the 303. It also provides (again, I believe) an smoother migration path to the Hunt 101, Principal, Esterbrook 357, or the Gillott 303.

[smk]

Lisa - I don't remember using the Hunt 22 but trust Mickey's judgement enough to support his recommendation over mine.

 

S.

[toxicwitch]

Great! Thanks so much for this - lots of new things to try. I will let you know how I go. Happy flourishing!

 

Lisa

[disillusion]

First post here. I have been trying to learn Copperplate since February but have been running into several issues like bad ink and paper choices, not reading enough instruction materials etc. So far I've done about 3 weeks of real practice at about 3 hours per week. I guess at this point I should post some writing samples and look for constructive criticism.

 

Written with a Hunt 101 and Moon Palace sumi ink

I got tired towards the end as you can probably see.

 

A 7mm practice sheet today, just testing line widths etc. I really need to work on one thing at a time.

 

A message I wrote a few days ago to another user on the forum, with a Gillott 303

The smaller lines have completely wrong proportions.

 

I know there are many issues that I have to work on, but as a beginner there might be some that I have missed. This is the first script I am learning, I hope I am not making grave errors here!

[smk]

Welcome to the Learning Copperplate thread disllusion. You have made excellent progress for 3 weeks work.

 

Now that you have the basics covered to a large degree, I would suggest working on perfecting the fundamental forms/strokes. Your practice sheet shows a line or two of various strokes - each one of these is worthy of a few practice sessions on its own. If you can start making these really well, you will see your script improve by leaps and bounds.

 

Salman

[disillusion]

Thank you very much Salman! Looking through the beginning of this thread, I realized I should have done far more fundamental practice. I plan to do a few A4 pages for each form, slowly at 10mm x-height, in the next couple of weeks. I will post more when I have made some progress.

Edited June 6, 2014 by disillusion

[jeremiah.l.burns]

Well, here we go again! I joined the FPN several years ago now, and had higher ambitions than life actually allowed me to achieve at the time. One of them was attempting to learn Copperplate and I remember fondly reading through SMK's fabulous thread here.

 

Well I never made it very far before putting the pen down. But I've not given up and I want to have another go. But it's been about 5 years and I pretty much need to start from scratch because I've forgotten everything I've learned.

 

I found an old calligraphy pad in my box of bits, and have started having a go at foundational strokes as well as the occasional letterform. The problem with that pad is, although it's got guides printed in it already, they aren't Copperplate guides and the angle of the stems is nowhere near 55-degrees (it's much closer to 80 or 85...practically upright).

 

So I downloaded the copperplate guides to print off (cheekily making use of work's printer) and have found either their printer paper is terrible (unknown brand), my ink is terrible (a very basic "Calligraphy" ink from Manuscript...I don't even know what it's made of, but it's non-waterproof), or both...because it bleeds something fierce (see attached).

 

Oh well, all part of the re-learning process, I guess!

 

[jeremiah.l.burns]

A few practice sheets from the last week. Some days feel like progress is being made and others feel like I've taken 2 steps backward. The oldest sheet here (12-02) was done using a Gillott 303. The other two were my first attempts using a 404.

 

For the record, ignore pretty much all bleeding. The paper is terrible and I'm working on getting some better. Also, I think I stuck my elbow in it at one point. ;-)

Edited February 19, 2018 by jeremiah.l.burns

[jeremiah.l.burns]

Last night's practice. I finally received my new paper as well as my walnut crystals, so I've made up some ink as well.

 

The difference in ink is amazing. Granted, my skill is still rubbish, but hopefully I will start to see speedier improvement in consistency.

[toxicwitch]

Hi Jeremiah - I am in exactly the same position - I started learning copperplate almost 4 years ago but life had other ideas and I couldn't keep up the work. I have now changed jobs and have a bit more time so I have started again today. Rather depressed that I am right back at the strokes stage - and not doing brilliantly with those. Wish I had managed to keep things going last time. Oh well - onwards and upwards! I use the Daler Rowney Manga Pad from Hobbycraft for my practice sheets - it is smooth, no bleed and thin enough that I can see my guide sheets through it easily. On Ken's recommendations last time I use Copperplate Calligraphy by Dick Jackson as my source book for strokes and it comes with guide sheets that be copied. Hope we both manage to keep going this time!

 

Lisa

[jeremiah.l.burns]

Hi Lisa! Glad to have you on-board for this 'round of trying to get back into Copperplate. :-) Maybe if we keep encouraging each other, we'll stick with it.

 

I've got a couple of Daler Rowney pads as well. They're the yellow & red covers ... don't recall if they're sketch pads or what. But they're 150gsm and are very good with the ink. However, I've actually switched back to using printer paper so I can print the guidelines directly to the paper. I like this *much* better for practice.

 

Last night I did a practice sheet. I wasn't in the mood for foundational strokes practice, but still wanted to work the muscles, so just did a random practice sheet. I can tell I'm improving. The trouble is, now that I occasionally get "passable" letter forms, I can tell even more easily when something is wrong. So I can see flaws *everywhere*.

 

I've not heard of Dick Jackson's book...but I'll have a look, thanks! I do have a so-called "Calligraphy Bible", which is alright. Gives loads of exemplars and general guidance. But it would be nice to have something that focuses on Copperplate Style exemplars.

 

I've also been looking through Dr Vitolo's guide as well as the Zanerian Manual. The ZM is very good and encouraging, but it can only do so much. What I really need is detailed guidance. ZM offers exemplars, step-by-step stroke creation, and a few brief notes...but there's a lot left to the student to discover for themselves.

 

 

[smk]

It is great to see this thread revived. Putting my learning process online was both scary and inspiring.

 

I have since developed somewhat of a system for learning Copperplate and have been teaching it in workshops and online for the past few years. The minuscules are divided in 4 groups of letters based on basic strokes. The student moves on to the next group after achieving a satisfactory level with each. It helps the student to focus on manageable chunks of practice material and gives me a reference point to provide feedback.

 

I will be more than happy to add the lessons here if there is interest :-)

 

- Salman

[jeremiah.l.burns]

Hi Salman! Count me as interested! I'd be most grateful for the opportunity to study your lessons!

 

Not directly related: I recently discovered and subscribed to your YouTube channel and you've inspired me to have a try (eventually!) at making my own pen holder!

[jeremiah.l.burns]

Random practice from last night. Again, I wasn't in the mood for foundational strokes. But I wanted to work my hand. It's funny how just a couple of nights off changes your mood though. I'm looking forward to doing foundational work tonight so I can start working on the flaws I can see everywhere.

 

I think tonight I'll work on my underturns, overturns, and hairlines.

 

Also, last night I noticed my hairlines are getting thinner (just like my head...ha!). And it was a bit revelationary. Like, Oh, that's what a hairline can look like! So I'll probably focus on those especially, to try to get my hand used to the lighter touch.

[gshillitani]

I'm definitely interested!!!

 

I will be more than happy to add the lessons here if there is interest :-)

 

- Salman

[jeremiah.l.burns]

Just a bit of goofing around. I found the flourishing bits at the end of Dr Vitolo's manual and was rather drawn to the feather. It's kinda rubbish compared with the one in the manual, but I'm surprised at how well it turned out, actually. Imagine how good it could look with consistency and non-wobbly lines!

[jeremiah.l.burns]

I also did a bit of work on my curves...which I can't get rounded out correctly. I suppose that's why I need to practice them!

Edited February 27, 2018 by jeremiah.l.burns

[gshillitani]

I'm the the exact same situation, Jeremiah! I'm going to rescue my Copperplate books from the cabinet right now

 

 

Well, here we go again! I joined the FPN several years ago now, and had higher ambitions than life actually allowed me to achieve at the time. One of them was attempting to learn Copperplate and I remember fondly reading through SMK's fabulous thread here.

 

Well I never made it very far before putting the pen down. But I've not given up and I want to have another go. But it's been about 5 years and I pretty much need to start from scratch because I've forgotten everything I've learned.