Dating Montblanc 149s

[niksch]

  On 3/26/2011 at 5:49 PM, hari317 said:

Your nib and pen are certainly legitimate. I have seen a few of these come up on ebay, all with the first gen plastic feeder. I believe these were the first 18K nibs.

 

I concur with the understanding that these were the first bi-color 18K nibs. Not rare, but not common either.

[draeroheli]

  On 10/9/2010 at 2:02 PM, niksch said:

This is a great effort. I think some of the photos are "incorrectly" associated with decades, and I'll throw in my two-cents later today. Incorrectly may be too strong of a word, though. I'll add my comments when I get a better chance to do it.

 

 

I refer this period of 1985 to 1990, from Dating MB 149 forum by DkRbs which is pinned at the start of this forum. In fact, the private seller said the pen was from 1980. The chart may not be accurate. Thanks.

[niksch]

  On 3/27/2011 at 2:45 PM, draeroheli said:

I refer this period of 1985 to 1990, from Dating MB 149 forum by DkRbs which is pinned at the start of this forum. In fact, the private seller said the pen was from 1980. The chart may not be accurate. Thanks.

 

 

It's a guide, a starting point. No one has ever said this was 100% accurate, and I'm not sure we could ever define discrete point in time of transitions. Besides it's more fun to debate them.

[penboard.de]

Hello out there,

compliments to David having started this thread,

compliments then to all the contributors, adding to the table.

 

let me add one pic, showing a variation of the early 60ies.

The first precious resin pens launched were made using a friction fit piston,

technically similar to the MB 14, 22, 24 ecc pens.

these first versions also deature the rounded rolled gold ring, similar to the rings used for the celluloid 50ies pens.

 

http://www.penboard.de/shop/pb/149mechs.jpg

 

Regards

Tom

 

PS - in case you find one of these first version 149ers, with broken piston - be aware its almost impossible to get it out.

you´d have to find a second barrel and shave off the barrel to get the mechanism, then you´ll have to drill out the broken barrel from the first pen - so you can unite the two parts.

[penboard.de]

Hello again,

 

another addition, about barrels.

the latest table shows one celluloid barrel and another resin barrel.

in fact, it has to be 3 types shown.

1. a two piece barrel from celluloid.

Mine shone here has been polished and shows a funny detail - MB used striped celluloid to reinforce the barrel end.

Section has to be unscrewed for repair.

 

2. a one piece barrel - piston can be taken out completely from the back.

 

3. a two piece barrel - diassembled - and showing this ugly gunk, MB used in the late 80ies/90ies as a sealant.

to disassemble - never try to unscrew forcing the section - this sits on two slots, by forcing the section, it will crack. You can only unscrew the feeder-housing. (what its proper name? )

this gunk is risky as well - it sometimes rolls into a nice ball when unscrewing the nib unit - and cracks the section as well. :-((

Never try to unscrew the feeder housing by grabbing the grey collar sitting outside - it will very easyly fall off.

 

 

http://www.penboard.de/shop/pb/149barrels.jpg

 

Best regards

Tom

[hari317]

Thank you Tom for your invaluable contribution to this thread.

[Michael R.]

Very nice Tom! Many thanks.

 

Do you have experience with the current production barrels?

 

Montblanc seems to use a similar construction like the single barrel construction of the late 1960's and early 1970's.

 

The nib unit screws out just like on those early pens and I have not been able to remove the gripping section. I wonder how they have attached the matte rim to the opening of the gripping section which seems to be non- removable as well.

 

Cheers

 

Michael

[penboard.de]

  On 3/28/2011 at 5:13 PM, Michael R. said:

Very nice Tom! Many thanks.

 

Do you have experience with the current production barrels?

 

Montblanc seems to use a similar construction like the single barrel construction of the late 1960's and early 1970's.

 

The nib unit screws out just like on those early pens and I have not been able to remove the gripping section. I wonder how they have attached the matte rim to the opening of the gripping section which seems to be non- removable as well.

 

Cheers

 

Michael

Hi Michael,

 

no, I have not yet studied these very new 149 barrels.

I now, they changed tools you need to unscrew the nib unit.

 

Best regards

Tom

[DKbRS]

Tom, thanks for these wonderful refinements to this thread.

[penboard.de]

Here is another tiny addition to the table:

 

cap threadings have been changed (for no apparent reason at all !!!) in 1995

they went from a 4 start threading to a 3 start threading.

 

thus - whoever plans to buy a replacement barrel - make sure to count the number of starts before buying.

 

Regards

Tom

 

BTW - the same is true for 146 threads, changed in 1995 - what a mixup for anybody, searching spare caps or barrels... :-(

Edited March 29, 2011 by penboard.de

[storyteller]

  On 3/29/2011 at 9:00 AM, penboard.de said:

Here is another tiny addition to the table:

 

cap threadings have been changed (for no apparent reason at all !!!) in 1995

they went from a 4 start threading to a 3 start threading.

 

thus - whoever plans to buy a replacement barrel - make sure to count the number of starts before buying.

 

Regards

Tom

 

Glad you posted this. Guess why!

 

Some more information for the table concerning a 149 I purchased new from an official dealer in France around 1988/89.

 

18k bi-color nib

Split ebonite feed

2-section barrel

Black plastic filler threads

 

It appears there is some overlapping on the type of filler threads and nibs that were used at this period.

[draeroheli]

  On 3/29/2011 at 9:46 AM, storyteller said:

  On 3/29/2011 at 9:00 AM, penboard.de said:

Here is another tiny addition to the table:

 

cap threadings have been changed (for no apparent reason at all !!!) in 1995

they went from a 4 start threading to a 3 start threading.

 

thus - whoever plans to buy a replacement barrel - make sure to count the number of starts before buying.

 

Regards

Tom

 

Glad you posted this. Guess why!

 

Some more information for the table concerning a 149 I purchased new from an official dealer in France around 1988/89.

 

18k bi-color nib

Split ebonite feed

2-section barrel

Black plastic filler threads

 

It appears there is some overlapping on the type of filler threads and nibs that were used at this period.

 

Thank you. You are right about an overlap during that period. The date of your purchase is not the actual date the pen was made. The pen might have been in the shop for some time before it was bought by a client. That creates some difficulty to make an accurate chart.

 

Cheers,

 

Htin

[storyteller]

  On 3/29/2011 at 10:30 AM, draeroheli said:

  On 3/29/2011 at 9:46 AM, storyteller said:

  On 3/29/2011 at 9:00 AM, penboard.de said:

Here is another tiny addition to the table:

 

cap threadings have been changed (for no apparent reason at all !!!) in 1995

they went from a 4 start threading to a 3 start threading.

 

thus - whoever plans to buy a replacement barrel - make sure to count the number of starts before buying.

 

Regards

Tom

 

Glad you posted this. Guess why!

 

Some more information for the table concerning a 149 I purchased new from an official dealer in France around 1988/89.

 

18k bi-color nib

Split ebonite feed

2-section barrel

Black plastic filler threads

 

It appears there is some overlapping on the type of filler threads and nibs that were used at this period.

 

Thank you. You are right about an overlap during that period. The date of your purchase is not the actual date the pen was made. The pen might have been in the shop for some time before it was bought by a client. That creates some difficulty to make an accurate chart.

 

Cheers,

 

Htin

 

This would put the introduction of the 18k bi-color nib at a lot earlier than 1990 then...

 

I don't know why Montblanc doesn't help out with collector orientated information? After all it would only encourage us more...

 

Thanks all the same for the table, even as it is, it is an invaluable tool!

[SamCapote]

Thanks to everyone for all this wonderful information.

[DilMin]

I can't seem to figure out what year this nib was produced

 

https://picasaweb.google.com/lh/photo/GO0xuOIZ2JHVV7kFI1oV4gkBmpEL3qpxYRs2JOAOy6c?feat=directlink

Edited May 2, 2011 by DilMin

[hari317]

  On 5/2/2011 at 3:04 PM, DilMin said:

I can't seem to figure out what year this nib was produced

 

https://picasaweb.google.com/lh/photo/GO0xuOIZ2JHVV7kFI1oV4gkBmpEL3qpxYRs2JOAOy6c?feat=directlink

 

This thread is about the 149. The nib in your photo is from a 144 and it seems to be an early monotone 144 nib.

[DilMin]

Thanks for your reply - the pen was my grandfathers

[hari317]

  On 5/2/2011 at 3:18 PM, DilMin said:

Thanks for your reply - the pen was my grandfathers

 

very nice! you are lucky to own your Grandfather's pen. the 144 is a very nice pen.

[fountainbel]

  On 3/29/2011 at 9:00 AM, penboard.de said:

Here is another tiny addition to the table:

 

cap threadings have been changed (for no apparent reason at all !!!) in 1995

they went from a 4 start threading to a 3 start threading.

 

thus - whoever plans to buy a replacement barrel - make sure to count the number of starts before buying.

 

Regards

Tom

 

BTW - the same is true for 146 threads, changed in 1995 - what a mixup for anybody, searching spare caps or barrels... :-(

 

Hi Tom and all,

This is a fantastic thread, thank you all for your efforts in bringing this great document to perfection !!

Tom, thanks for your very interesting input !

I expect Montblanc went for the 3 leads cap/barrel screw thread aiming to provide a stronger "higher profile" thread.

Montblanc normally used a 9TPI- 4 leads thread, having a (9x4) = 36TPI thread profile, combined pitch being 0.0278", male thread profile depth being 0.0170" or 0.43mm.

When using f.e 9TPI- 3 leads the thread profile becomes 9x3= 27 TPI, combined pitch being 0.0370", male thread profile depth being 0.0227" or 0.58mm, which is 0.15mm deeper., or 0.3mm deeper on diameter

The 27 TPI not being "standard" they could have opted for a 10TPI - 3leads, thread profile 30TPI, combined pitch being 0.0333", male thread profile depth becoming 0.0205" or 0.52mm, still 0.09 mm deeper as the original 4 leads thread ( 0.18mm on diameter)

Never seen one of these 3leads pens, could anyone measure and specify the thread profile??

Regards, Francis

Edited May 23, 2011 by fountainbel

[ecox]

I have a 149 that doesn't fit into the wonderful chart:

 

Late plastic feed. 14k bi-color nib. Two piece body. Brass piston threads. Marked as "W-Germany" on the ring at the top of the cap. No serial no., though.

 

Bought new in 1990; has never been serviced so it's all original.