Little Black Pen-plain Jane

[karmakoda]

Hi,

Came across this little pen in an antique store. It is my only Waterman's pen and I know very little about Waterman's except that some of the vintage nibs are exceptionally flexy and the pens can be very beautiful.

This one is plain but very comfortable to write with. The cap is quite destroyed, having cracks and chips in the lip and a chip gone where the clip fits on. Besides the clip and the nib, "Waterman's" is simply etched in the barrel. Any thoughts About how old it is?

http://i829.photobucket.com/albums/zz218/Valaccar/P1010291.jpg

http://i829.photobucket.com/albums/zz218/Valaccar/P1010294.jpg

http://i829.photobucket.com/albums/zz218/Valaccar/P1010301.jpg

http://i829.photobucket.com/albums/zz218/Valaccar/P1010307.jpg

[dedalian]

That is a gorgeous pen. Too bad its damaged.

[Readymade]

I'm guessing it's a Waterman Jif New Look.

 

See

http://www.vintagewatermanpens.co.uk/ProdDesc.asp?cat=-1&id=w4786

 

Nice pen btw!

 

I'm curious -- what does the eagle's head at the base of the nib mean?

[karmakoda]

That is a gorgeous pen. Too bad its damaged.

Readymade said

I'm guessing it's a Waterman Jif New Look

 

Nice pen btw!

 

I'm curious -- what does the eagle's head at the base of the nib mean?

Thank you Dedalian, and well done Readymade.

Sorry, I don't know what the eagle engraving indicates, but I'm guessing it must be typical of a certain line of Waterman's nibs. The pen in the link has an 18CT Ideal nib.

I know less than nothing about Waterman's pens so I am grateful for your information.

It is an attractive little pen and if I can get the cap fixed or replaced it will be very nice.

This is a very good start.

[jar]

 

I'm curious -- what does the eagle's head at the base of the nib mean?

 

It is a French Gold Hallmark, and since the Eagle is not contained it is what was known as a "Small Guarantee". Mass produced high volume items like nibs were not individually assayed rather the source blank was tested and so the punched out units carried a different hallmark than you would find on a custom ring for example.

[karmakoda]

 

I'm curious -- what does the eagle's head at the base of the nib mean?

 

It is a French Gold Hallmark, and since the Eagle is not contained it is what was known as a "Small Guarantee". Mass produced high volume items like nibs were not individually assayed rather the source blank was tested and so the punched out units carried a different hallmark than you would find on a custom ring for example.

Thank You Jar.

Hope I can find a way to have the cap repaired or replaced. It is a very fine little pen. Not sure when it was made though.

[brettttt]

I recently bought one that looks similar, though it hasn't arrived yet. While waiting, I've found a couple of interesting bits of info. David Nishimura discusses what he calls "the Standard" at http://www.vintagepens.com/Waterman_glass_cartridge_pens.shtml and says that it's from after WWII but before 1953.

 

Richard Binder blogged about restoring one at http://web.me.com/richardspens/PenBlog/Sweepings_from_the_Studio/Entries/2009/12/15_Now_this_is_a_cartridge_pen!.html. I tend to agree with what he says about the design--very appealing to my eye--but I don't see that he says anything about the model name or dates.

 

BTW, did yours come with a cartridge, or is it different from the glass cartridge pen in some way that I'm overlooking?

 

Brett

Edited June 8, 2010 by brettttt

[karmakoda]

I recently bought one that looks similar, though it hasn't arrived yet. While waiting, I've found a couple of interesting bits of info. David Nishimura discusses what he calls "the Standard" at http://www.vintagepens.com/Waterman_glass_cartridge_pens.shtml and says that it's from after WWII but before 1953.

 

Richard Binder blogged about restoring one at http://web.me.com/richardspens/PenBlog/Sweepings_from_the_Studio/Entries/2009/12/15_Now_this_is_a_cartridge_pen!.html. I tend to agree with what he says about the design--very appealing to my eye--but I don't see that he says anything about the model name or dates.

 

BTW, did yours come with a cartridge, or is it different from the glass cartridge pen in some way that I'm overlooking?

 

Brett

 

Hi Brett, thanks for the links, very helpful, and sorry for the delay. Thought I had responded to your reply.

My pen is a lever fill, and one thing I admire about Waterman's, is the reinforced lever housing. Not only is it sturdy, but many vintage pens, especially celluloid pens, become distorted in shape around the lever opening.

The pen came apart easily and I fitted a new spring bar and ink sac with no problem at all.

The 18 Ct nib writes like a dream, with enough tipping to last a lifetime.

Regards

Greg

[brettttt]

Greg,

 

Ah, I was indeed overlooking something really obvious--the lever! My pen arrived, and I got curious about it, so I found some ads in a French magazine (France Illustration). Even though the first one does indeed bear the text "New Look," that doesn't appear in any subsequent ads, so that seems to me to suggest that "New Look" wasn't ever thought of as the model name--it's just ad copy. Instead, it looks like JIF Waterman idenitifed the pens using a model number and a description that could be construed as a kind of name: "court à levier" (and for mine "long à cartouche"). I have only the barest understanding of French, but these are pretty straightforward, I think: "short with lever" and "long with cartridge."

 

FWIW,

Brett

 

http://i976.photobucket.com/albums/ae246/brettttt/France_Illustration-1948_Salon_de_l.jpg

http://i976.photobucket.com/albums/ae246/brettttt/France_Illustration-1948-11-27.jpg

[Ernst Bitterman]

For the sake of trying to pin down a some Waterman data points-- is the year of publication of those ads available?

[brettttt]

For the sake of trying to pin down a some Waterman data points-- is the year of publication of those ads available?

 

 

Sorry. I thought I had mentioned the dates. The first is from October 1948 and the second is from December 1948. I have others from 1949. And maybe from 1947--I can check, if you'd like.

[Ernst Bitterman]

It turns out you had, just not obviously-- when I slipped the images onto my computer, the dates are fairly prominent on the image titles.

 

Some days you're Grypipe-Smith, some days you're Eccles.

[brettttt]

It turns out you had, just not obviously-- when I slipped the images onto my computer, the dates are fairly prominent on the image titles.

 

Some days you're Grypipe-Smith, some days you're Eccles.

 

Hmmm. I'm not sure who I am today, I guess--who/what are Grypipe-Smith and Eccles?

[Ernst Bitterman]

Well, I was using "you're" reflexively (wretched English language!), and the sadly-misspelled names refer to the highly-esteemed Goon Show. Sometimes I'm more obscure than I need to be, when what I SHOULD be doing is thanking a helpful person for the help they're providing.

[Eccles]

It turns out you had, just not obviously-- when I slipped the images onto my computer, the dates are fairly prominent on the image titles.

 

Some days you're Grypipe-Smith, some days you're Eccles.

 

 

'Ere, 'ere, 'ere, I 'eard that. Just cos people tink I'm S-T-U-P-I-D doesn't mean... er, well... what does it mean?

I'll have you know, My Good Man, I've got the time written down on a piece of paper what says it is 8 o'clock.

 

The Famous Eccles.

[karmakoda]

For the sake of trying to pin down a some Waterman data points-- is the year of publication of those ads available?

 

 

Sorry. I thought I had mentioned the dates. The first is from October 1948 and the second is from December 1948. I have others from 1949. And maybe from 1947--I can check, if you'd like.

 

Brett

Thank You!

I never expected to see this type of information, truly appreciated. I will make every effort to have this great little pen restored. It is such a comfy writer.

Regards

Greg

[Bo Bo Olson]

A nib that writes that good, and a nice looking pen....have you asked Richard what it would cost to repair that pen. I've seen pictures of wonder's he has done.

 

Or are you just going to save the nib and junk the pen?