What Does Your Handwriting Look Like

[Quinton42503]

Your handwriting is very beautiful....classic!!!

[caliken]

From everything I've ever read (from years of trying to improve horrid handwriting) "arm writing" is the correct way to write. There are quite a few videos on YouTube, plus websites where they describe how to do it. Like you, I find it awkward, but I'm doing it the right way much more than "finger-writing", which apparently gives you less control (although I'd argue the point).

 

If you are moving your fingers as you write, then apparently that's incorrect. From what I gather, your fingers should be doing nothing more than holding the pen. If you move your fingers (in other words, your wrist stays in one spot and your fingers extend and contract to move the pen), that's apparently wrong.

 

Don't blame me, I didn't make up the rules!

 

 

This is very much a matter of personal opinion. I never gave any thought at all, to arm/shoulder/muscular movement until I started reading this forum. When I started, back in the 1950s, I just concentrated on learning the letter shapes, and let my body (including arms and digits) do whatever came naturally!

 

I am now aware that I use fingers more for small lettering and progressively include arm and shoulder movement as lettering increases in size. However, I try very hard, not to think about this, as I feel that it may detract from the pleasure of writing, and as I am a calligrapher by profession, the more pleasure I can derive from it - the better!

 

I'm of the opinion that studying arm movement specifically, is largely unnecessary.

 

I can write for long periods without experiencing cramp or any other side effects.

 

Ken

Edited May 5, 2012 by caliken

[byronss]

 

This is very much a matter of personal opinion. I never gave any thought at all, to arm/shoulder/muscular movement until I started reading this forum. When I started, back in the 1950s, I just concentrated on learning the letter shapes, and let my body (including arms and digits) do whatever came naturally!

 

I am now aware that I use fingers more for small lettering and progressively include arm and shoulder movement as lettering increases in size. However, I try very hard, not to think about this, as I feel that it may detract from the pleasure of writing, and as I am a calligrapher by profession, the more pleasure I can derive from it - the better!

 

I'm of the opinion that studying arm movement specifically, is largely unnecessary.

 

I can write for long periods without experiencing cramp or any other side effects.

 

Ken

 

For some people, 'finger writing' produces awful handwriting and they're looking to improve. Every time I've asked or searched for more info, the answer lies in technique and implies incorrect physical movement. I agree with you… who cares what you do if your writing is lovely and your hand isn't cramping up from producing that writing? For others, it may be appropriate for them to look into their technique as a starting point to improvement. I am personally of the opinion people's natural handwriting is unique to them and in some ways connects to various personality traits (and no, we don't need a discussion on graphology) and if that writing isn't aesthetically pleasing to the writer and they want to change it, then looking at technique could be a starting point. Moving on, it could then involve some experimentation with unnatural physical movement, per the arm-writing method, to see if that can 'fix' the problem. The arm-writing method is everywhere on the internet. There must be something to it.

 

Since I became aware of it, I have slowly tried to change my technique, and I'd say I now use a combination of both. My handwriting is still not neat, not legible sometimes and not in any kind of font known to man, but it's definitely me, and I'm not sure the basics will ever change! I've been trying to improve it for more than 40 years! When I put major effort in, it looks better, but when I have to write fast, it's pretty much the same as it has been for years. I have major problems with letter spacing (too close). I know what I want my handwriting to look like, but I've not been able to get it there.

[caliken]

byronss - we are basically in agreement, but I'd like you to consider the following -

 

This emphasis on arm movement (muscular movement) mostly originated with the American development of Spencerian script. It was not an issue with other scripts developed elsewhere. At random, these eminent books on the subject of Calligraphy and Handwriting, make no reference to the use of the arm in handwriting.

 

"Writing & Illuminating & Lettering" (1906) by Edward Johnston

"A Handwriting Manual" (1932) by Alfred Fairbank

"Italic Handwriting" (1955) by Tom Gourdie

"The Art of Calligraphy" (1977) by Marie Angel

"William Gardner's Book of Calligraphy" (1988) by William Gardner

 

Typical of all of these books, Alfred Fairbank wrote "...the fingers and thumb are contracted, as in making a downstroke and then extended"

He also stated that Edward Johnston, whilst writing, "pressed his hand firmly upon the desk".

When discussing Copperplate/English Roundhand/Engravers Script the following eminent Spencerians wrote -

 

http://i226.photobucket.com/albums/dd289/caliken_2007/zanerbrown450.jpg

 

I personally, feel that combined movement of arm/hand/fingers is best, depending on the size of the lettering.

I also think that to specify Arm Movement, as an imperative to good handwriting, is frankly, wrong.....it's just part of the technique.

 

Ken

Edited May 6, 2012 by caliken

[byronss]

byronss - we are basically in agreement, but I'd like you to consider the following -

...

 

Really interesting! I haven't read any of those books and any further foray into calligraphy for me would be beyond a joke with my awful handwriting. I tried years ago, for ages, and the result was horrendous. I didn't know the reasons for the "arm writing". Happy to be educated! I do admire the writing of those who've mastered some of the very beautiful shapes and flourishes in calligraphy. It seems to be a skill that some can execute far more easily than others. I'm also completely hopeless at anything artistic and I'm sure there's a connection.

 

I know there has been much discussion on script etc, but my preference is for writing with no or minimal slope. My brain seems to find it more legible. Am totally in love with ethernautrix's handwriting sample above, but can't copy it well enough to save myself!

[Columba Livia]

This emphasis on arm movement (muscular movement) mostly originated with the American development of Spencerian script. It was not an issue with other scripts developed elsewhere.

 

From what I've been reading, it did originate in Britian and it further evolved and developed in America. Here are some British sources on arms and movement in handwriting:

 

The first thing that must be attended to by those who are desirous to gain the right command of the Pen [...] will be to have the free and easy movement of the arm, and at the same time take peculiar care to sit in a right posture

 

p10, "Tachygraphy, or the flying Pen", Carstairs, 1815

 

the body should very slightly incline, and its weight be exceedingly light, and alone press upon the left arm, leaving the right entirely free

 

"The Writer's Guide", Ventris, c.1840

 

The right arm should be rested upon the edge of the desk lightly, half-way between the elbow and the wrist [...] The wrist should never touch the desk while writing [...] the advantage of working with a long lever will by this method be gained, the hand and arm moving freely in every direction, and with the powerful muscles and nerves of the hand, arm and fingers, all brought into operation together. But if the wrist is dropped the leverage is destroyed

 

-p6 & 7, "Writing without a master", no author given, 1858

 

If a flat table be used, the right fore-arm, at any part between the elbow and an inch or two above the wrist, should be laid upon the edge. This will serve as a guide in the case of a slope also. The wrist must not rest upon the table or slope ' the object being to combined adequate support with the least possible impediment.

 

-p9, "Penmanship", Mitchell, 1882

 

No weight from the body must be thrown on the right arm, as it is necessary that there should be perfect freedom in this limb in order that the pen may be propelled smoothly and swiftly over the paper [...] The movements of the pen are all made by the combined action of the thumb and first and second fingers, aided slightly by the action of the wrist

 

-p7 & 8, "Papers on Penmanship", Cleaver, 1886

 

This page in the Penman's Art Journal from 1896 is very interesting as regards muscular movement. The author is writing about a book by Benjamin Franklin Foster (An America penman) published in 1830, and he says that Foster copied muscular movement exercises from a British book:

 

http://archive.org/stream/penmansartjourna20unse#page/n65/mode/1up

^

By far the greatest number of plates are devoted to movement exercises for the fingers, hand and arm. These exercises are practically the same as those used by our most enthusiastic muscular movement teachers of the present day. They were undoubtedly copied from "The New Method of Rapid Writing" by James Henry Lewis, published

in London in 1816. So our much boasted movement isn't as new as we thought it to be. The English teachers have had and are having the same trouble our American teachers have in teaching movement. We make it more prominent and insist on it more, and as a consequence our teachers obtain better results.

 

So this raises the interesting thing of muscular movement pedagogy that evolved in America originating from Britain, including the push-pulls and ovals.

 

This is not to say that Palmer wasn't overly dogmatic about arm movement though!

 

At random, these eminent books on the subject of Calligraphy and Handwriting, make no reference to the use of the arm in handwriting.

 

"Writing & Illuminating & Lettering" (1906) by Edward Johnston

"A Handwriting Manual" (1932) by Alfred Fairbank

"Italic Handwriting" (1955) by Tom Gourdie

"The Art of Calligraphy" (1977) by Marie Angel

"William Gardner's Book of Calligraphy" (1988) by William Gardner

 

These books all share a common element though: one was written by Edward Johnston himself and the others by people who were influenced by him and his students and thus represent one very particular view of the art of handwriting, calligraphy and lettering which is rather exclusionary and idiosyncratic e.g claiming that copperplate isn't calligraphy, was invented by engravers and written with a pointed quill and some of Johnston's students even maintained that he re-discovered the broad pen(!).

Edited May 6, 2012 by Columba Livia

[Columba Livia]

- double post -

Edited May 6, 2012 by Columba Livia

[caliken]

These books all share a common element though: one was written by Edward Johnston himself and the others by people who were influenced by him and his students and thus represent one very particular view of the art of handwriting, calligraphy and lettering which is rather exclusionary and idiosyncratic e.g claiming that copperplate isn't calligraphy, was invented by engravers and written with a pointed quill and some of Johnston's students even maintained that he re-discovered the broad pen(!).

 

Thanks for the enlightenment. I wasn't aware of the earlier developments and interest in 'arm movement' in Britain.

 

Although I'm British, I tend to agree with the above criticism of the Johnstonian movement and their dictates.

 

However, I still maintain that this element of handwriting technique isn't absolutely necessary for the attainment of good handwriting, and its usefulness is certainly over-emphasised.

 

Ken

Edited May 6, 2012 by caliken

[pmhudepo]

Thank you all for your comments regarding whole arm movement. To paraphrase GClef, when I do what I want, my hand starts to hurt. If I concentrate on shapes, slant etc., like I did last year, then, certainly, my writing improves, but sustainability suffers. I hope that by giving up a little control over the nib and focusing on a fluid motion (which is what finger writing versus whole arm movement effectively means to me), I will eventually be able to write easily 2 or 3 pages without cramping up half-way through. My recent practice sheets suggest this might work.

 

I suppose it may depend on the script you're trying to learn -- I'm leaning towards a business writing style.

 

Perhaps different backgrounds matter. I can imagine someone being trained to draw, paint, or play the piano has a different starting position from someone who's been a computer whizz-kid for most of his life. Must be great to have some (natural or taught) fluidity in one's fine motor skills.

[Columba Livia]

However, I still maintain that this element of handwriting technique isn't absolutely necessary for the attainment of good handwriting, and its usefulness is certainly over-emphasised.

 

"The Penman and Artist", in 1899, carried a few cartoons poking fun at then-contemporary dogmas of handwriting, this is the one for teaching muscular movement to the exclusion of all else and was probably aimed at Palmer:

 

http://i.imgur.com/ELi5i.jpg

^

http://archive.org/stream/penmanartist05zane#page/n63/mode/1up

Edited May 7, 2012 by Columba Livia

[Artemis200]

http://s1209.photobucket.com/albums/cc393/Artemis200/?action=view&current=IMG_0004.jpg

Lamy AL-Star, M nib, Lamy Blue ink

Well... my writing's pretty terrible. That was just a random picture I had on the computer from a while ago, it doesn't look quite like that anymore, but it's pretty much the same. One thing I will point out is that my descenders do actually go below the line now! If I slow down writing, I can even it out enough that it's all legible, but it still doesn't look great and it looks very much like my writing.

[topaz]

I'm tempted to "steal" some of the handwriting styles I've seen here -- you know, incorporate a certain letter from here and from there. Too lazy -- I've been writing like this for so long now... decades. My handwriting used to be more curvy, more slanted forward. And before that, more round overall.

 

This is what I mean when I say my handwriting is bad. I never wrote a lot of "flourishes" (except a brief period in my teens when I practiced my autograph for when I was famous LOL). My writing stayed on the line and it was more...graceful. Now it is angular, some letters aren't completely formed and if I am in a big hurry- some letters are just part of the joining line.

[Zipzap]

Below is a sample of my handwriting. I have a recent thread containing this sample as part of my effort to improve my handwriting, but it hasn't gotten much feedback except for a few people. So, I thought I'd put it in a place were everybody is giving more frequent comments!

 

http://img267.imageshack.us/img267/7392/img13412.jpg

[GClef]

 

http://i1128.photobucket.com/albums/m496/gclef1114/photobucket-554-1336371397487.jpg

[GClef]

Below is a sample of my handwriting. I have a recent thread containing this sample as part of my effort to improve my handwriting, but it hasn't gotten much feedback except for a few people. So, I thought I'd put it in a place were everybody is giving more frequent comments!

 

http://i1128.photobucket.com/albums/m496/gclef1114/photobucket-1799-1336372252652.jpg

[DanF]

http://i98.photobucket.com/albums/l279/T-Caster/DSC_0806_2.jpg

 

I should add that I have diluted the ink by about 1/3 in order to slow drying on the nib and improve shading, and for some reason, the ink appear a little lighter in the photo than it does in real life. Straight from the bottle, it's darker still.

 

Dan

Edited May 7, 2012 by DanF

[GClef]

http://i1128.photobucket.com/albums/m496/gclef1114/photobucket-25536-1336507748223.jpg

[caliken]

]http://i1128.photobucket.com/albums/m496/gclef1114/photobucket-1799-1336372252652.jpg

 

Yes..but if we do that, it won't be possible to isolate a relevant passage from a previous post, to answer!

 

Ken

[Zipzap]

Thanks for the great advice, GClef! I'm typing this at work right now, but as soon as I get home I'll start writing out all my posts!

 

I think it would be possible to isolate a relevant passage, caliken. You would just have to write the whole thing out. More practice for my handwriting though! :roflmho:

[verdiinpink]

On one boring weekend I grabbed my calligraphy practice pad and start writing the capital names. Here is the result.

 

The photo is taken with my camera at night, sorry for the poor image quality.

 

The pen is Pilot Parallel 2.4mm with its green cartridge.

 

Without any rulers around, the line is always going up.

 

I think I need to practice more often to loosen up the spacing between letters, as I realise it now.

 

If I can find some scanner around, I might post my everyday note later tomorrow.

 

Love this thread.

 

http://i690.photobucket.com/albums/vv263/verdiinpink/photo-3.jpg