Noodlers ink labels

[Namo]

Well, not living in the States, I may miss something sensible about Nathan's inks labels.

 

But I can see a conceptual consistency: inks are for writing, and Noodrer's aim at making these FP ink more durable, more accessible and less exepensive. This is, in a very large sens, a political (and not only an economical) statement, it seems to me.

 

Writing, actually, and writing with a FP has someting to do with the fact we live in societies and, therefore, in politics.

 

Writing, too, is an act of memory. Writing is the way (not the only one,l but maybe the main one) human being (well, let's cut to western cultural area - memory can be kept by telling stories and not onyl by writing them) make ideas and values go through time. No "Troy" movie without Homer and its putting down on "paper" (more likelin papyrus or parchment) some old greek stories...

 

Therefore, by labeling its inks with historical names or by political events, Nathan makes an act of memory that is precisely what writing is about.

 

Thank you for bringing that, I wouldn't have noticed that aspect of Nathan's work if not - and to me, it is one more reason to love and use Noodler's inks.

 

Thank you for reading.

 

PS: this doesn't imply I would agree with Nathan's political opinion, of course - and the more since I don't know them - or him.

Edited February 10, 2010 by Namo

[jleeper]

Given that I would greatly offend the moderators of the board if I offered my opinion of the subject of ink's title, it would take much, much more than that before I would take enough offense to justify not buying it primarily for political reasons.

 

I'll repeat the description I once heard from an (unnamed) pen vendor: Nathan "is..... weird."

 

Honestly I'm a little surprised that I can't find a single vendor actually selling the stuff.

 

Actually, I think I'm softening, I'll show my displeasure by not buying that ink. I would prefer that future inks names not be so tied to a specific partisan election, but maybe I'll rename and relabel it for myself.

[StudyAnimal]

I rejoice in seeing others exercising their right to free political speech, regardless of whether I agree with it or not. To me it shows balls, someone who exerts their values and principles rather than watering them down, or trying to hide them for fear of losing a sale. From a business perspective sure it is risky, but at some more fundamental level I respect the guy for it.

 

What was it Pericles said: 'We do not call a man who does not share in public life politically quietist; we call him politically useless'

 

If you aren't proud to passionately assert your beliefs, then perhaps they aren't such good beliefs. Of course, part of having strongly held political opinions is respecting the right of others to have them too.

 

@PenTieRun: Irony? Where?

Edited February 10, 2010 by StudyAnimal

[parkerstylo]

What was it Pericles said: 'We do not call a man who does not share in public life politically quietist; we call him politically useless'

 

If you aren't proud to passionately assert your beliefs, then perhaps they aren't such good beliefs.

 

:hmm1:

I suppose that certainty is the problem for many. A thought by Voltaire:

 

"Doubt is not a pleasant condition, but certainty is absurd."

[lynxcat]

We are taxed too much, have too much government and are too worried about everyone else's emotions.

 

maybe so, but how do you know it? if the current levels of those three phenomena are "too much", then how much would be not too much, and what yardsticks should we use to ascertain said levels?

 

(by the way, i'm a first-generation immigrant to the USA, originally from a northern European welfare state. the taxation levels there --- chosen as an example because they, at least, are fairly easy to measure --- are very much higher than anywhere in the USA; yet my native country has not collapsed into ruin. fancy that.)

[CraigR]

Personally, I enjoy Noodlers ink and the labels. I am all in favor of eccentric, taking a stand on issues and running your business the way you see fit (within laws). My ink bottles reside on a shelf in my study and are only viewed by the occasional visitor. The discussion here brings more attention to the labels than the labels do themselves. I also like the full bottles. Inconvenient, but I do appreciate that the man wants to give you your money's worth. Just seems to be a bit of color, humor and opinion bottled up with some pretty nice inks. /Craig

[Pippin60]

I have to say, and proudly, that I don't care what is on the Noodlers labels. I like a few of their inks quite a bit. I'll also add that I don't really pay too much attention to the labels which is I'm sure counter to what they are designed to elicit. I should note that this is probably because like almost all of my ink's I keep them in the box for storage.

[Bill]

When companies use my money to promote or donate to causes I don't believe in (terrorism, funding convicted cop assassins, etc.), I will boycott their products. And I have. If I become uncomfortable about how Nathan is using my money, I will exercise my right to choose.

 

Like many here, I was buying Noodler's before the names and labels became bolder. So far, I am amused rather than offended. But then, there are many folks who are more sensitive to certain issues and who have not become somewhat hardened through life or more tolerant of diversity.

 

 

 

Maybe Nathan should do an ink showing a catfish in an army uniform named..."Lighten Up, Francis".

 

Bill

 

[edited to fix misspelling]

Edited February 11, 2010 by Bill

[ajcoleman]

I personally love Nathan's labels and the obvious passion for his craft that they display. I suppose that some of his labels have perhaps cost him some business. But my guess is that his artful and unique labels have won him more business than they have lost. Dark Matter is one of my favorite inks. I love the label and the story that goes with the ink better than the ink itself (although is is a fine ink in its own right).

[dizzypen]

Did I miss something? I keep seeing everyone refer to people being offended because they are of weaker constitution, yet I haven't seen anyone mention being offended...

[indigirl]

This is an interesting topic. I am not offended per se by his labels, but they remind me that his politics are opposite (or at least, very different from) my own. It hasn't directly stopped me from buying his ink, but I'm pretty sure that on some subtler, even subconscious level it makes me like them just a little bit less. It's true I have not bought any of his specific inks that have the more in-your-face labels or names.

 

On the other hand, like someone else above noted, I much prefer to support a sole proprietor who is upfront about his views, instead of focus-grouped, marketing-savvy corporations who avoid overtly controversial statements while quietly funneling huge amounts of money toward who knows what awful things. I don't know where Staples stands politically, but every time I go buy those bagasse notebooks I experience a lot more distaste than I generally experience from Noodlers labels. I'd rather buy notebooks from a nice little local ma & pa stationer, but haven't found a combination (of notebook & store) that suits my needs as well. Likewise I'm sure I'd rather buy organic fountain pen ink made by some groovy local lesbian Buddhist coop, but afaik they don't exist. :roflmho: Maybe I should start one!

[FaustianSlip]

The distinctive labels of Noodler's were actually one of the first things to attract me to the inks. I love the inks themselves- I have far more Noodler's than any other brand (though having tried both Herbin and Diamine, I'm rapidly in danger of becoming an addict of both- I love Majestic Blue), and I adore Noodler's Navy. I suspect that I would disagree with Nathan on virtually every issue of politics we might discuss, but he's entitled to have whatever opinion he wants; I don't generally let that alone determine who I buy from. If nothing else, at least Noodler's are something developed and made in the US, which is important to me.

 

I won't be buying Brown 41, but that has more to do with the fact that I already have Noodler's Walnut, which I don't use nearly enough as it is, so I couldn't justify buying another brown ink.

 

All of that said, I think that Nathan risks needlessly alienating people by wearing his politics on his bottle, as it were, but hey, it's his business. He can run it however he wants.

[Randolph Carter]

While many have mentioned the likelihood that political ink names would decrease demand for the product, this may be precisely Mr. Tardif's intention. This interview seems to indicate so. Look at the question regarding labels.

[Mille]

How many people buy Noodlers ink just to collect? I have yet to see prices of discontinued inks demand high prices. But I would not be surprised if my stained bottle of Stockholm Indigo will be sought after, if it was in pristine order that is.

 

An ink explicitly supporting the invasion would be very controversial for many. Inks celebrating the election or a statement against the Chinese regime are rather lame in comparison. Luckily for him his contribution of tax made the invasion possible.

Edited February 11, 2010 by Mille

[QM2]

I am apolitical, so I see Nathan's approach as fascinating - rather than controversial, weird, or offensive. Noodler's labels are charming and attractive, the colours are delicious, and the waterproof qualities are much appreciated. I find many of the names and labels of the inks irresistible, and have definitely bought a few just because of the concept behind it or because the catfish were looking particularly fetching. If that's wrong, then I don't want to be right!

[saintsimon]

His world view isn't short of contradictions.

 

So he avoids to pay taxes as far as possible and poses as a rebell.

 

While he openly and proudly supports one of the most costly federal activities, he openly and proudly doesn't (want to) actually pay for it.

He relies on a functioning infrastructure (physical and legal) to make business, while avoids to"make a profit to be taxed and then squandered by the government."

He also openly despises of one of his nations' major creditors, an undemocratic country that finances the growing national debt of a country of reluctant taxpayers who are so proud of their freedom.

Thus, in the long term, by actually making his country more and more dependent on another country without the same values, he is selling his freedom for the instant proud illusion of it.

 

Rebell?

[Johnny Appleseed]

SaintSimon

 

Nathan's views of taxation and his reasons for opposing them are somewhat cryptic, and my comments about his possible methods is based on some speculation. However, I suspect that his position, like many conservatives (of which I am not one) is not as inconsistant as it seems at first blush. Many conservatives object to taxes that fund welfare and public works programs, bank bailouts, and social programs, believing that the purpose of taxes should be for common defense (military) and perhaps a few common infrastructure projects. They equally oppose the deficit spending that results in our need to be a debtor to "undemocratic" (or counter-to-free market) nations. Whether this is a realistic interpretation of the way the world works is a matter of debate.

 

However, this thread is talking about the political reasons behind Nathans labels and his particular marketing strategy, not a place to engage in a debate about our own views on the subject. If we wish this thread to remain open, we need to refrain from arguing about the underlying politics.

 

We do not need to agree with another viewpoint in order to seek to understand it.

 

 

But then, there are many folks who are more sensitive to certain issues and who have not become somewhat hardened through life or more tolerant of diversity.

 

I don't think it is a matter of being more sensitive or not being hardened, but of where one draws the line with ones principles. Some prefer not to purchase a product that espouses a point of view they oppose. I don't have a problem with buying Nathan's inks in general, but I am not going to buy a bottle of ink that celebrates a politician I disagree with - particularly since the ink seems little different in color or properties than other inks on the market. That is how I personally feel, and where I draw the line.

 

We all have different principles about what we believe in, how we express that belief, and how we will act or not act on those beliefs. We get into trouble, at least in a diverse environment like this, when we do not respect how others express or act on their principles.

 

John

Edited February 11, 2010 by Johnny Appleseed

[Zaarin]

I tend to support businesses based on a combination of the normal, natural factors - the quality of their stuff and its usefulness to me, how they have treated me in the past, how they treat their own employees (if I have any idea); I tend to leave aside any notion of the private opinions, political or otherwise, of the owner or anyone else involved.

 

I would become reluctant if I thought that, say, money I spent on Noodler's was actually going to fund donations to political parties I oppose, but I see no evidence that something like that has happened, and so for the time being I will go on buying Noodler's ink if I feel like it. As others have noted, no matter one's stance of Mr Tardif's political leanings, his politics have surely done far less harm than those of many an overtly apolitical proprietor.

[saintsimon]

SaintSimon

 

....

 

However, this thread is talking about the political reasons behind Nathans labels and his particular marketing strategy, not a place to engage in a debate about our own views on the subject. If we wish this thread to remain open, we need to refrain from arguing about the underlying politics.

...

John

And I tried to be as unspecific as possible , not naming sides or nations, or arguing about political thinking. Just factual, as-is present day financial actions (his) and situations (debt to be paid somehow) and (first glance?) contradictions. Or shall we say dialectics? I have become familiar with the world views over there ...

He reminds me of the "consume now, pay later" attitude that both individuals and countries have aquired, especially in the "rich" industrialized world . There's growing debt on all levels, undermining our future.

 

I just don't see anything that deserves to be called "rebellious", it's IMHO just a occasional wet dream of a social class.

Edited February 11, 2010 by saintsimon

[sporkboy]

I have to admit that I was a little surprised when I saw the description of #41 Brown on the Noodlers site. At first, I was a little surprised and offended, but it is a free country and if you want to mix business and politics that's alright. Once I got past the initial shock, I started to realize that I have to admire a fellow who is this brash with business and I kind of like that.

 

I do have several Noodlers inks and I like them quite a bit. I won't be buying #41 Brown, but Nathan is OK with it, so I'm OK with it too.