PELIKAN took my Binderized M200 away! o_O

[Richard]

EVERYBODY PLEASE READ THIS!

 

One of the problems we as retailers face is that we don't know who "screen_name_001" or "alias_002" is. It's difficult or impossible to help someone who is anonymous. sky2shine, please contact me by EMAIL -- I cannot send or receive PMs. I've been asked by my Pelikan representative to identify you to him in an effort to get your pen returned to you as quickly as possible.

[Silvermink]

This is, in fact, part of Customs's job in any country.

 

I suppose. I do wonder at them confiscating a pen sold by an authorized dealer. In Canada, I've gotten so used to Canada Customs constantly overstepping their bounds that I have an inherent distrust of customs agencies in general.

[Edgar Allan Bo]

I have not seen anything in what the poster described that they are taking his pen, only that they are checking it with the experts (Pelikan) and that if it is real they will return it to him. I would much rather have Pelikan do that kind of check than a less expert customs agent who could make a mistake.

 

As some others have mentioned, it sounds like a bother but overall it makes me respect Pelikan more for wanting to be sure people are getting their real products and not some cheap forgery. If anything, we should all get together and everyone buy another Pelikan from an authorized dealer.

 

that's what I've been told... and as I said it before, I can understand why Pelikan is doing that, but it just seemed soo unnecesarry in my case (and it will also be soo unnecesarry in many other cases with some other fountain-pen-people who bought a Pel somewhere else, but it seems that is how it is and we have to live with it!) and no one would like to wait few weeks or months longer for his pen to finally arrive, specially not after he allready had it in his hands... ... I'm sure everyone here knows how that feels like! Specially if it's one with a customized nib...

 

And I wasn't prepared for something like that, I had to pick up a Binder-Pelikan last year at the customs dyty office, and there was no problem at all... and today I was treated like I was smuggling drugs

[Gehaha]

It seems we are drifting away from the original point: the conflict between a company protecting its commercial interest against foreign competitors and the responsibility of a country to protect the rights of its citizens. As another poster said earlier, when an individual's right to property is subjugated to the interests of a company's profit margin, without due process for that individual, something has gone profoundly wrong. One can only hope that this is an isolated case of poor judgement and not the tip of an iceberg. I should think that if this is an isolated misunderstanding, Pelikan will return the pen at once with an apology and compensation, and clarify to the customs authorities that they do not want inspectors to seize individual pens legally purchased by individuals. If this is not a misunderstanding, I for one will reconsider my feelings about Pelikan products permanently.

ron

 

Hello,

 

I want my Government as well as a trusted company to protect my interest as a confident consumer.

I'm as a consumer not able to protect my rights (at Ebay or elsewhere) per lawsuit. I'm prepared to take some inconvenience

to support their effort. I will be confident towards Pelikan even more.

 

Anna

 

P.S. sk2yshine: customs officers also use to have bad days - an ugly argument with spouse at breakfast maybe?

They have to deal with things, we would never even touch - hard earned money, I think. You were some kind of "breather hole" to one of them, I fear.

(I know the feeling, dealing with officials - humans are human...).

Edited June 17, 2009 by Gehaha

[Stylo]

A single pen packaged in a box that has most likely both the sender address of and a receipt from Richard's Pens should have been very easy to verify as being legitimate merchandise. My guess is that an "unsure" postal employee simply played it safe rather than exercise some judgement.

[offbase]

QUOTE (Frits B @ Jun 17 2009, 07:25 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I was slightly baffled when the woman told me that the pen is now going to PELIKAN AND is maybe never coming back again... for whatever reasons!

 

But there is nothing wrong with the pen... sure, the nib is customized, but that's not Pelikan's problem, the pen isn't fake because of that!

 

IF the reason is that they fear that some Pelikan pens might be fake - they cannot check EVERY pen, if EVERY Pelikan pen from abroad has to be sent to them first to be checked - then it will take them soo much time to go through all these pens and to check every case... that is very inefficient!

You are too reasonable about this. What happens here is theft. Pelikan is not the owner of its pens once they have been sold, and what you do with it is your prerogative. If I buy trousers that are too long (happens all the time) I have them shortened. In addition, Pelikan is a private company which is not in a position to instruct a customs officer to confiscate your pen, to the same extent that they cannot tell the police to search your house for fakes. You should claim immediate return of the pen to its lawful owner = you, and lodge a complaint with the customs officer's superiors.

 

You understand that you just accused the German Customs of being an accesory to theft by Pelikan? Without sounding like a jerk (and I will), you had better have a German law degree and be registered to practice law in Germany and have court cases to back you up. Otherwise you are doing everyone a disservice by clearly saying that without a doubt it is theft and that they have all rights to it. At best you are giving advice with no backing, and at worst you are just plain propogating misinformation.

 

You also understand that Pelikan has a right to it's trademark, and that they are allowed to actively stop the propogation of items bearing fake trademarks? At leat, from my understanding (I am not a lawyer).

 

-Nkk

 

Court cases? That's the English & American common law system. I believe everything in Germany is simply by statute. Still, I also think that this is (Potty Mouth). If the German government does indeed think so little of its citizens property rights, it's pretty disappointing.

 

[Edgar Allan Bo]

A single pen packaged in a box that has most likely both the sender address of and a receipt from Richard's Pens should have been very easy to verify as being legitimate merchandise. My guess is that an "unsure" postal employee simply played it safe rather than exercise some judgement.

 

She's not just a "postal employee", she's a public administration-employee and state-official... I even explained who Richard Binder is (what he is doing with the pens/nibs, and so on...) but the woman had no clue about FP's... she fumbled around on the M200, turned all the knobs and declared it as "probably fake", because it's "in such expensive price range" (USD 100) o_O

[offbase]

A single pen packaged in a box that has most likely both the sender address of and a receipt from Richard's Pens should have been very easy to verify as being legitimate merchandise. My guess is that an "unsure" postal employee simply played it safe rather than exercise some judgement.

 

I think you've hit the nail on the head. BUT, what would make any ordinary customs worker an authority on the authenticity of a particular brand of pen??? If any employee was "being careful" if such was the case, I would imagine that, like this, ALL Pelikans are being sent back to Pelikan because customs staff aren't pen experts.

[RLTodd]

good grief...

 

How about a little tolerance for the Germans?

 

Their system of laws is quite different from our system based on the English Common Law, the Magna Carta, court cases, and in our case a rather nasty revolution between 1776 and 1789.

 

As I understand it they have a legal system based on Salic (the Franks) and Roman Law. It was once explained to me this way, "Everything that is not permitted, is forbidden." Fifty percent of them, plus 1 are happy with it, so I seen no reason to keep grousing about it.

 

I am sure that after the letters are sent, and the explanations understood, this will all be cleared up.

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Silvermink]

She's not just a "postal employee", she's a public administration-employee and state-official... I even explained who Richard Binder is (what he is doing with the pens/nibs, and so on...) but the woman had no clue about FP's... she fumbled around on the M200, turned all the knobs and declared it as "probably fake", because it's "in such expensive price range" (USD 100) o_O

 

Oh, yeah. Being expensive totally makes it likely to be fake.

Edited June 17, 2009 by Silvermink

[krandallkraus]

EVERYBODY PLEASE READ THIS!

 

One of the problems we as retailers face is that we don't know who "screen_name_001" or "alias_002" is. It's difficult or impossible to help someone who is anonymous. sky2shine, please contact me by EMAIL -- I cannot send or receive PMs. I've been asked by my Pelikan representative to identify you to him in an effort to get your pen returned to you as quickly as possible.

 

 

Go, Richard! This is why we buy from you.

[saintsimon]

In my opinion, the problem here is less likely a counterfeit problem but that of gray marketing and market area segmentation:

 

Richard B. is an official dealer of Pelikans - for the North American market. I don't know if his contracts actually say anything about his rights to export complete pens to the EU. It is possible that Pelikan, which obviously is aware of different pricing of its products in the US or in Malaysia (Pengallery), now tries to protect the EU/German market area from cheaper imports of their own pens back to the high priced home market. Maybe they are trying to enforce a right they already may have.

 

Pelikan is not alone: recently I've read about the Japanese camera maker Canon (maybe even Nikon) doing exactly this. New cameras bought cheaper outside Germany/EU from official foreign dealers are under the risk of being held (confiscated?) by the customs, when (gray) imported. Canon tries to protect their high prices over here.

Edited June 18, 2009 by saintsimon

[Gandalfandula]

wow, i would be incensed at this. hopefully you will get it back though, because it is not counterfeit. let us know...

[Gehaha]

A single pen packaged in a box that has most likely both the sender address of and a receipt from Richard's Pens should have been very easy to verify as being legitimate merchandise. My guess is that an "unsure" postal employee simply played it safe rather than exercise some judgement.

 

She's not just a "postal employee", she's a public administration-employee and state-official... I even explained who Richard Binder is (what he is doing with the pens/nibs, and so on...) but the woman had no clue about FP's... she fumbled around on the M200, turned all the knobs and declared it as "probably fake", because it's "in such expensive price range" (USD 100) o_O

 

Your are NOT right. The first place is the postal service! If there is any doubt in Frankfurt Airport by a postal officer,

they hand the package to your local customs office. One can not expect that the local officer can judge a legion of products.

It's "prussian accuracy" to send it to Pelikan.

Through the ongoing thread, I start to get annoyed about the judgements here against better knowledge (at least through the information here).

 

I'm out now!

 

Anna

 

 

[WendyNC]

Assuming arguendo that Germany has adopted a policy of doing its level best through its Customs office to crack down on fakes of all kinds being imported, and assuming further that Pelikan has chosen to participate in this program, what bothers me is that Richard Binder, an authorized Pelikan dealer, has apparently not been informed by the company of the probability of this type of delay or provided with a means of identifying his shipments as being from an authorized Pelikan dealer.

Edited June 18, 2009 by WendyNC

[saintsimon]

...

Court cases? That's the English & American common law system. I believe everything in Germany is simply by statute. Still, I also think that this is (Potty Mouth). If the German government does indeed think so little of its citizens property rights, it's pretty disappointing.

Before we start the Nazi argumentation: such actions are taken by legal request or by court decision in favour of a company. The government acts in this case not on its own behalf.

[OcalaFlGuy]

Best,

Anna

 

P.S. I'm absolutely sure, that Richard Binder with his company will support the effort of Pelikan - he is one of the important supporters of the brand.

 

Say whut?

 

You are absolutely sure that Richard would support the confiscation of a pen, legally owned by an individual AND sent from a licensed distributor of the company?

 

Now, he didn't address your comment, and I surely don't speak for him, but if I were you, I wouldn't go waggering any large

sum of money on that idea...

 

Bruce in Ocala, FL

 

[saintsimon]

Well, didn't we had discussions about Department of Homeland Security officials confiscating laptops from travelers at airports without further explanations and refunds? Talk about legal ownership.

 

...

 

 

Edited for legal uncertainty.

Edited June 18, 2009 by saintsimon

[Gehaha]

Best,

Anna

 

P.S. I'm absolutely sure, that Richard Binder with his company will support the effort of Pelikan - he is one of the important supporters of the brand.

 

Say whut?

 

You are absolutely sure that Richard would support the confiscation of a pen, legally owned by an individual AND sent from a licensed distributor of the company?

 

Now, he didn't address your comment, and I surely don't speak for him, but if I were you, I wouldn't go waggering any large

sum of money on that idea...

 

Bruce in Ocala, FL

 

 

Yes, I'm absolutely sure! He is a reasonable person!

I'll wager...No polemics needed.

 

Anna

[oceansportrait]

That's terrible! I've gotten used to my packages being searched (thanks to our national treasure that is Canadian Customs ) and I've even gotten used to being charged nearly 25-50% of the package's worth in brokerage fees and taxes, but to have a package confiscated (and not just any item...a PEN) for authentification is strange indeed!